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Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

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  • RogueCow
    started a topic Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    Hello again all,

    i am getting ready to build a titan 48 loaded with an eminence Kappa LFA driver.

    I have been looking around for cheap used amps and have seen one on these forums (Peavey pro GPS 900), and when looking up the output values, it gives an output (lets say 660 WRMS bridged/mono) and a Rated Output (170 WRMS /channel/ stereo both driven)



    I have somewhat of a double question here:

    1. is this something like car audio where they advertise a MAX power (output) and then the Rated power (Typical Output)?
    - Which one should be planned around?

    2. Could a SINGLE Kappaa 15LFA (600 RMS) be run off of an amp like this safely? Or will the amp automatically bridge the mono connection and output enough watts to fry the driver?

  • Randy L
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    ^^ Yea, I'd say the Kappa 15LF-A's 10.4mm Xlim is what kept the drivers alive, though I was pushing them dangerously close. That's why I moved up to the 3015LF drivers. Love their VERY generous 17.0mm of Xlim, though in their current cab, only move right at their designed Xmaxx of 9.6mm for undistorted bass down to the low 40's.

    Leave a comment:


  • Paul O
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    Originally posted by Randy L View Post
    But even in a carefully designed cabinet with the vented cabinet tuned for 43hz, the Kappa (by WinISD 7x) reaches its rated 5.5mm Xmaxx at a low 400 watts. I push each with a 700wpc amp and have found out that they (per WinISD) are being pushed WAY past its rated Xmaxx to 9.1mm!!!
    One of the better features of most Eminence drivers is the generous gap height.. often 2x xmax before there is any danger of contacting the backplate. Why anybody designs sub drivers without this kind of safety margin I don't understand but it's not hard to find them with only 1mm difference between xmax and xlim.

    Leave a comment:


  • Randy L
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    Since you will be suing the Kappa 15LF-A as a subwoofer in a folded horn (T48), I'd be just as cautious about making sure the driver is not pushed past it's mechanical limits. I have 4 of the Kappas that I used for woofer duty (LP @ 42hz and HP at 120hz) and can testify that they are wonderful drivers. But even in a carefully designed cabinet with the vented cabinet tuned for 43hz, the Kappa (by WinISD 7x) reaches its rated 5.5mm Xmaxx at a low 400 watts. I push each with a 700wpc amp and have found out that they (per WinISD) are being pushed WAY past its rated Xmaxx to 9.1mm!!! But fortunately, none have torn themselves apart, which is a testament to how well they are built. Though they easily handled this abuse for years without fail, I still replaced them with the Kappalite3015LF.
    Not sure at what wattage the Kappa will reach Xmaxx in the T48, though. Might need BFM to chime in for that. I've seen folks blow woofers (15's, and 18's) by forcing them to go too low, even when pushing them with amps well below the drivers' power ratings.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sydney
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    FWIW: I've had positive experience with Peavey products in general - BUT no experience w this model in particular.

    Leave a comment:


  • RogueCow
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    Behringer Inuke 1000 (bridged-mono 620max/440 RMS)
    or
    Peavey Pro GPS 900

    They are both roughly the same price, and it seems the Inuke 1000 can provide almost enough power to match the driver max...

    Is Behringer just a brand to stay away from in general? Or is that more for their X'overs and Limiters?

    If i can get a more powerful amp, it is better to buy that and limit it to the voltage specified in the plans, rather then buy an amp and crank it for volume correct?

    Leave a comment:


  • Sydney
    replied
    Re: Amp selection "Output" vs. "Typical Output"

    My experience has been more neg than pos; mechanical issues with cheap switches in their crossover that developed about 18 mo after purchase.
    "B" specifically targets the low price market so no not for under <$100

    Leave a comment:


  • RogueCow
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    To me, a drop-out would not be as critical,

    this is only some backing sound effects (bass drops, some techno riffs, etc...), so even if it failed in the middle of a gig that would be no issue.

    Is there another unit like this/better than this for around or under $100??

    Leave a comment:


  • AMC
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    That has been the knock on Behringer product, I own a couple of pieces of their gear, and it has served me very well over the years, others have had less then stellar luck. Most the time, if it's good, it seems to last, if it's bad, it's bad from the start.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sydney
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    It should...
    FWIW: I've had QC issues w that company's products and could not afford to have them fail in a "paying gig" otherwise...
    Your needs my not be as critical.

    Leave a comment:


  • RogueCow
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    Alright awesome!

    In regards to voltage limiting, would something like this be a good investment? Also considering i would need crossovers anyways??

    http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/CX3400.aspx

    Leave a comment:


  • Paul O
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    Originally posted by RogueCow View Post
    I am sorry, but the "Bridged/mono" confuses me... I know what bridged means, i just don't know if a single driver connected to a single output will automatically be bridged so to speak...
    No there is nothing automatic about bridged operation. The user has to first engage the switch to enable bridged mode, connect a single input cable to Ch1, and then connect a single speaker across the two hot(red) speaker terminals. Ch2 input is not used at all and you do not connect to the regular L or R speaker terminals.

    Leave a comment:


  • Sydney
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    i just don't know if a single driver connected to a single output will automatically be bridged so to speak...
    Not automatically ( that would be potentially dangerous to the speakers ); the user has to "set" the amp to bridge mode by one of several means
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bridged...led_amplifiers
    http://www.bcae1.com/bridging.htm
    Voltage Limiter?
    Not just bridged...
    Audio amps amplify voltage; so a limiter is a device to monitor the voltage and prevent it from exceeding a desired limit; sort of like a governor on an engine

    Leave a comment:


  • RogueCow
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    Voltage Limiter?

    Is that a means of lowering the bridged output (660 RMS) below the rated power handling of the driver (600 RMS)?

    Leave a comment:


  • RogueCow
    replied
    Re: Amp selection &quot;Output&quot; vs. &quot;Typical Output&quot;

    For an amp like the Peavey, if only one driver is connected to one of the stereo connections, the amp will only provide the power it says will provide to 2 channels in stereo correct?

    EG.
    400 W x2 channels Stereo
    900 W x1 Bridged/mono

    If only one driver is plugged into one output (not bridged) it puts out 400W correct?

    I am sorry, but the "Bridged/mono" confuses me... I know what bridged means, i just don't know if a single driver connected to a single output will automatically be bridged so to speak...

    Leave a comment:

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