Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Finally finished the Statements!!

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • marvin
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Originally posted by mattsk8 View Post
    The baffle and back are done w/ real mottled copper veneer. The veneer is a little thicker than an aluminum can, cuts well w/ sissors, and tools very nicely. Unfortunately you have to be extremely cautious while routing it or the router base will scratch it (learned that on the first one :().
    I have used shelf liner contact paper to protect a pre-finished surface while routing....works very nicely since you can peel it off when finished. Perhaps that is what you learned, too.

    Click image for larger version

Name:	JPEG Image (9211553).jpg
Views:	1
Size:	864.7 KB
ID:	1146457Click image for larger version

Name:	JPEG Image (17048321).jpg
Views:	1
Size:	831.5 KB
ID:	1146458


    Originally posted by mattsk8 View Post
    The eight ball triangle and nine ball diamond are inlalyed. Here's a closeup of the triangle. I haven't uploaded the pics of the process for doing the inlay, but I can if you like. Basically I made a 1/4" thick MDF template, then mounted a brass guide bushing in my router and routed it out using a 3/16" router bit (the width of the inlay). I finished the sharp corners w/ a woodchisel.
    I did a small mantle clock inlay project years ago where the strip was on the edge which is easier than in the center of your panel. Nice job and thanks for posting it--it helps remind me of possibilities for a future build.


    Originally posted by mattsk8 View Post
    Thanks for the compliment!!! How have you been? I'm ready for another DIY demo
    I am doing well. Still holding out for a couple more options before committing to another build. Hope to build something sometime this year to show at whatever events come up. Your get together was fun and it would be great to have another sometime.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattsk8
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Originally posted by marvin View Post
    Excellent, Matt!!:applause: That arch on the top lends nice character to a standard box. Reminds me a bit of a floor standing clock case.

    Is the baffle and back some type of laminate? Can you post a couple of close ups of the triangle and diamond in the base? Is that inlaid applique or what?

    It looks great! Gives me some possible cues for a future build, too.

    Marvin
    The baffle and back are done w/ real mottled copper veneer. The veneer is a little thicker than an aluminum can, cuts well w/ sissors, and tools very nicely. Unfortunately you have to be extremely cautious while routing it or the router base will scratch it (learned that on the first one :().

    Click image for larger version

Name:	2012-11-13_19-55-50_346.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	26.9 KB
ID:	1146446 Click image for larger version

Name:	2012-11-13_22-36-06_761.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	23.1 KB
ID:	1146447

    The eight ball triangle and nine ball diamond are inlalyed. Here's a closeup of the triangle. I haven't uploaded the pics of the process for doing the inlay, but I can if you like. Basically I made a 1/4" thick MDF template, then mounted a brass guide bushing in my router and routed it out using a 3/16" router bit (the width of the inlay). I finished the sharp corners w/ a woodchisel.

    Click image for larger version

Name:	179.JPG
Views:	1
Size:	75.1 KB
ID:	1146448

    I uploaded the pic I have of the process. This is everything I used. I used the utility knife to cut the inlay strips.

    Click image for larger version

Name:	2012-12-29_15-04-33_359.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	88.8 KB
ID:	1146450

    Thanks for the compliment!!! How have you been? I'm ready for another DIY demo

    Leave a comment:


  • marvin
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Excellent, Matt!!:applause: That arch on the top lends nice character to a standard box. Reminds me a bit of a floor standing clock case.

    Is the baffle and back some type of laminate? Can you post a couple of close ups of the triangle and diamond in the base? Is that inlaid applique or what?

    It looks great! Gives me some possible cues for a future build, too.

    Marvin

    Leave a comment:


  • johnastockman
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Yeah, I've had to treat the rotary controls to some Caig, but only twice since I bought it. It went about 18 years before the first spray. The adjustable loudness control that Yamaha uses seems to be the one that needs it more than the other ones, and I sprayed that again about 3 years ago. I had to replace 2 of the tiny bulbs for the FM dial about 10 years ago. With the Yamaha, it has the sliding frequency indicator that's lighted and there's some longer wires going to it. Since that bulb is the only one that moves, it was the first to go. Other than that, it has performed beyond my expectations. When I got it, I never thought I'd still have it after 36 years.


    John A.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattsk8
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Originally posted by Wolf View Post
    Craig is used to larger 3-ways or 7" 2-ways for reference, so in effect, they would be more inefficient. However, They're more efficient than lots of speakers their size.
    I would think 25W would be enough to make them sing, but maybe more headroom would be required.
    Later,
    Wolf
    Thanks Ben, that gives me confidence to move forward as well. I'll be driving mine w/ my 125w/ch Yamaha HT receiver, they'll be replacing JBL Northridge speakers. Waiting for tax dollars from uncle Sam to get rolling on it; and that may be a bit because I haven't done my taxes yet. Can't wait to get this project under way :D.

    John, that's awesome that you've managed to hold on to that old Yammi for so long! Have you ever done the deoxit/lube on the controls? It made a huge difference on my Pioneer.

    Leave a comment:


  • 6thplanet
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Nice job and +1 on the copper, looks great next to the wood..

    Leave a comment:


  • johnastockman
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    I do know what you mean about the watts. I auditioned many receivers before I got the CR-420, some with up to 75W/channel. All were in the same price range, and I settled on one pair of speakers to do all my listening, a pair of Mission 3-ways that weren't too bad. I hadn't built the S2's yet, so I thought it would be a good way to hear any differences between the receivers. I liked how the Mission sounded back then. Even with "only" 25W RMS, the Yamaha just had that certain SQ that other units didn't quite have, even ones with twice the power. It came down to the Marantz 20-something receiver, which I think had about 30-35W RMS and the CR-420. I thought the Yamaha had the edge...in 1977 I paid $450 for the CR-420. A lot of moola for me back then, but this was my first real stereo system and I wanted to have something nice. I saved out of my first two paychecks from my first full-time job, working in the Civil Engineering dept. at McChord AFB in Tacoma, Wa. I got the Yamaha YP-211 TT and the CR-420 at the same time...the guys really tried to sell me some speakers. When I told them I already decided the speakers I was going to "build", they actually chuckled and told me they'd still be there when I wanted to buy some "real" speakers. The old Yamaha still sounds terrific and the Azurites are hooked up to it now. The YP-211 also works very well and is hooked into the Emotiva set-up in the main system along with the Statements. Currently I have a nice Grado GF3E+ cartridge on the turntable. And thanks Ben, for adding your comments on the Stance and their efficiency. Since a good friend is buying my faithful Azurites next week, I'll have to get going on the Stance in the next month or so. I'm sure they'll be a great compliment to the old Yammie.


    John A.

    Leave a comment:


  • Wolf
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Craig is used to larger 3-ways or 7" 2-ways for reference, so in effect, they would be more inefficient. However, They're more efficient than lots of speakers their size.
    I would think 25W would be enough to make them sing, but maybe more headroom would be required.
    Later,
    Wolf

    Leave a comment:


  • JeffG.
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    These are really nice. Very cool how you chose to put these together.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattsk8
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    I only said what I said about the Stance's efficiency based on what PWR said. As far as the 25w receiver to drive them goes, that prob would be a good one for Ben. I do know the vintage equipment's 25w compared to modern equipment's 25w isn't the same 25w if you know what I mean! I love vintage as well. I have a Pioneer SX-1050 driving my ER18s and ooooooh la la does it ever sing beautifully!!

    Leave a comment:


  • johnastockman
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    I sure wish I was closer to the mecca of DIY events. Just to hang out with you and the other guys would be great, plus getting to hear some of the great designs and meet the guys that designed them. I came to speaker-building through financial necessity and curiosity. I couldn't afford to buy name brand speakers and curiosity from learning what I did by attending those classes hosted by the founders of Speakerlab in the early 70's. I knew that I could get better SQ through what they offered for less money. I heard the differences and why there were differences/improvements because they had many of the well-known brands at their classes to take apart and discuss the internals and compromises. The S2 plans/parts kit was about 1/5 of what some Large Advents cost, so that was the main reason. I'd never made any speaker cabinets or anything similar before and my woodworking experience was limited to wood shop projects in 7th and 8th grade. I did watch and help my dad make some enclosures for a pair of speakers he made from a plan and parts he got from the old Lafayette Electronics store, but I was only 8. The S'lab guys showed how to cut and assemble cabinet pieces, but I was on my own for those first ones. My friend/roommate in 1977 had an old late-40's Craftsman 8" table saw that was rusty and not working sitting in our basement. I cleaned it and cleaned it some more and got the rust off the table top and other parts. The motor brushes were completely gone, so with some new brushes, more cleaning and some lube, I got it working pretty good; it took me a week but it was cutting straight and smooth. I just followed the plans and borrowed my friend's tape measure...I didn't even have my own tape measure back then. Even adding in the extras I needed, like 3/4" particle board, glue, extra silicon, extra bag of quilt batting and the peel-n-stick vinyl for the exterior, I still had about 1/4 of what the Advents would've cost. Yes, labor was not included, but I found I liked to do the cutting, measuring, assembly and all the other stuff. The vinyl laminate I got at a fabric store of all places, with a walnut grain & color. I still have the boxes. My goal was also to just get something that sounded better. With all the ridicule I got from my friends, I suppose I was hoping to show them I was right about the better-SQ part. I was totally happy with the S2's and the receiver/TT I bought. I knew I got better performance and that was all I wanted...more enjoyment and more of those goose-bump moments. But my friends soon realized the same things I did and I kind of fell into making enclosures for the Speakerlab model they wanted. I made mistakes doing all of those boxes, but I learned. Just those minor mistakes we all make along the way, usually the measurement ones or something that can be sanded out or re-cut. I'm still making them to this day.

    Like you, it was never about bragging, showing someone up or putting down a commercial speaker company for me. I made those S2's before I started working at The Stereo Shoppe. I wanted to get the most/best SQ for my money and I was quite fortunate to have found a different way than most, being near Seattle at that time and able to go to those classes. If that hadn't happened, I probably would have ended up with some Large Advents and been very happy. My best friend at the time and I used to listen to music for hours through his Advents and Marantz gear, way before I knew about Speakerlab. I wouldn't say I am an expert, but I just love making things, working on stuff all those hobby-type enjoyments. I also love fixing and working on motorcycles, and half of the bikes I've owned and enjoyed have been fixer-uppers in various states of fixing up. With a motorcycle, you can do all that and then ride it for more enjoyment...if you've done it right. Speakers are similar...you can build them and then enjoy the listening experience. With the same important sense of satisfaction. The satisfaction can be a huge part of the experience.

    I haven't designed a speaker from scratch, just various subwoofers...because they don't require a familiarity/understanding of XO designing. I'm content to enjoy/build other folks projects and find no shame in that. It's the love of building, working with tools and your hands and then being able to enjoy the end-results of your efforts that I really enjoy. Sorry, don't mean to ramble on. I hadn't looked at the Stance's efficiency, but do you think they might require more power? I have an Emotiva UPA-2 amp with a solid 125W RMS/channel in my main 2-channel system and still have my old Yamaha CR-420 receiver in my "vintage" set-up in the family room. The CR-420 only has 25W/channel, so maybe the old Yammie might be a little light in the watts for a pair of the Stance. I'll ask Ben and see what he says.


    John A.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattsk8
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Originally posted by johnastockman View Post
    Everything you said :D.
    I agree completely about the whole "Can you build better that professional" or that other "Why DIY will last" thread. I think anyone that has to even ask that first question obviously has never heard, or built a pair of DIY speakers.

    I'm in a bit of a different category than you though as I don't have the experience or expertice you do when it comes to speaker design. I build speakers simply because I love woodworking, I love audio, and I love to learn. I'm not out to out-do anyone, just have some fun building some fantastic speakers.

    I'm looking forward to building the next ones! It'll be after I get my tax return because I'll be in the $500 range to build 5 of them. The only reason I'm in the air a little on that design is I'm not too sure how they'll perform in my less than ideal room; but honestly I don't think anything will be ideal there. Before I heard those I was considering building 3 of Zaph's 5.3c for the fronts, and 2 of his 5.2s for the rears. Too bad your way over on the other side of the country or you could hear the Stance. I heard them at the get together at Meniscus and that's what sold me on them. Hopefully they'll be at InDIYana as well so I can see and hear them again! I think what sold me was the depth of clarity and realism in the mids and highs. I'll be running them w/ my Klipsch powered sub for starters; at least until I build my first one of those to go w/ that system. One other reserve I have is PWR's statement, "They are definitely not efficient". I heard them on what I think was a 200watt Legacy amp, so I wouldn't have known if they were efficient or not.

    Leave a comment:


  • johnastockman
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Hey, I'm going to be building Ben's Stance design also, as soon as the weather warms a bit, probably a couple months or so. I have some cabinets I was going to use for an project that a forum member and I collaborated on. I found some of my favorite woofers, a pair of NLA Focal polyglass 6.5". Regarded by Mr. D'Appolito as the best of the Focal midwoofers, especially mated with the best-of-the-inverted-dome tweeters, the tdx series. I'd heard the MTM's that D'appolito designed with those drivers, and I was very impressed with the balance and SQ, superb imaging. I still don't know what happened, but it's been 3 years and I haven't seen the woofers and don't know if they were lost, misplaced, or anything. Correspondence stopped about a year ago, so I had to just forget about it, rather than get all wicked off about the situation. Funny, as I had him do two other XO designs for me and they turned out exceptional.

    Anyway, I got a pair of the PE cabinets 2 years ago in anticipation of the build, so they've sat unused since then. They're a little bigger than the Stance's specs, but the baffle width is within 1/2", so I can make them work. I'll put in a brace, a solid one so it blocks off the lower portion of the enclosure and I'll get the correct internal volume. Interesting also is that because that project didn't work out, I decided to go with the Statements...which I know have the edge in overall SQ. Not that the Focal design wouldn't have turned out amazing, but that edge the Statements have are more like a cliff.

    I was following that thread about DIY vs high-end OEM speakers and also the one about the $200,000 Wilson's and their suspect measured response. I always knew that about Wilson, as we sold them, along with some other uber-dollar speakers. I have direct experience with these situations regarding the upper high-end and the value and SQ of many DIY designs. From budget to the Statements, I know that those super high-end offerings can be duplicated SQ-wise. All my notes and all those anechoic/in-room measurements we took told me, even back then, what was going on with many of the upper-class speaker companies. My modest 2-way Speakerlab S2's would trounce 2, 3, and 4-way commercial speakers costing up to 10 times what the S2's had in them, in anechoic and in-room measurements. And all of our own personal listening impressions. The Speakerlab S50 and their evolution, the DAS-8, were continually the winners in measurements and listening enjoyment, compared to any of the Wilson, Quad, Infinity Reference Standard ($50,000 for the 3-piece line array) and the top-line B&W. I went through ridicule and derision from my friends for deciding to go with a S'lab design, instead of just buying one of their fav name-brands. Some wouldn't even listen to them, or want to compare when I got them built. They eventually did, but only because our mutual friends told them how much better the S2 was next to what they owned. The rest is history. I'm sure I'm repeating myself about these experiences, so thanks for reading and indulging me on this controversial-for-some subject. It does kinda bother me that these experiences, especially the retail background, seems to be dismissed, thinking that I'm some sort of retail/OEM basher. No one could work in that situation, take stuff apart, measure and take reams of notes, and not come out with a certain disdain for the outright lies and marketing hyperbole that accompanied the higher-end of speaker offerings. Let me know if you start on the Stances...my cabinets won't be as nice as Ben's, but with his attention to detail on the driver selection and XO design, I know they'll be awesome. Since I haven't built one of his designs yet, it was a natural progression from all the other great designers to get to one of Ben's.


    John A.

    Leave a comment:


  • mattsk8
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Thanks for all the kind remarks :D!

    I've been commenting and perusing that thread jinjuku referred to and anyone that says you can't build speakers as good or better than professional designs has never heard a pair of Statements, or any of the other fantastic designs you guys have blessed us w/! Thanks to all of you for sharing that info, w/out it I would have never even gotten into this hobby that I absolutely love!

    My dad LOVES the speakers. I'm still trying to "train" him to leave the bass, treble, and loudness controls alone but I have to bite my tongue and remember that I did build them for him and not me :p.

    Now its off to my next build, which I'm still contemplating a bit. Probably going to be Ben's Stances for my HT system.

    Leave a comment:


  • johnastockman
    replied
    Re: Finally finished the Statements!!

    Wow, exceptional cabinet skills Matt. Love the curved feature at the top. Those cabinets are a big undertaking to construct, huge congrats. I know what goes into just the Statement Monitors, so I can understand the skills required for the full-size versions. I saw bungalow_ed's build process of his full-size ones and some of the challenges. I know your dad will be over-the-top with the build-quality and the incredible SQ.


    John A.

    Leave a comment:

Working...
X