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Peerless TC9FD18: A severe dissapointment?

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  • Peerless TC9FD18: A severe dissapointment?

    Hi everyone, as you might have guessed by the title, I picked up 4 of these guys a few weeks ago to mess around with various projects to see how I liked them. I figured for the price and reviews they were getting might as well go for it. However, I have yet to be even slightly impressed with these guys. Here are some of the setups I have tried already...

    1. All 4 of them in a mini array for a single speaker wired to an overall impedance of 8 ohms (vented enclosure)
    ​2. 2 drivers per speaker wired to 4 ohms (have tried in vented and sealed enclosures)
    ​3. 1 driver in a sealed enclosure

    ​Each case has been filter free--really trying to get a feel for how these guys naturally as full range drivers.

    ​All sealed enclosures were stuffed with polyfil. Vented enclosures had minimal old carpet padding for sound damping. All enclosures were made with leftover MDF I have lying around, but I'm starting to run out :( lol. I haven't tried them paired with a tweeter yet, but honestly with how they have performed thus far I don't think it would even be worth it.

    ​What are your guys experiences with this driver? To me, it's honestly just a $10 speaker that would be suitable for cheap projects.
    ​That being said, I really want to love these little guys! Any suggestions of what I should try next?
    Peerless by Tymphany TC9FD18-08 3-1/2" Full Range Paper Cone Woofer

  • #2
    1. Much comb filtering will be audible
    2. Little less comb filtering, but will still affect overall sound quite a bit
    3. These are anemic on the bass in any event.

    Couple things stand out to me, primarily that of running absent filtering of any kind. These are not for making bass, they are for low distortion "wide range" sound. That being said, they are not immune to baffle step loss, and without compensating for that - you are taking a driver that is already anemic on the low end and exacerbating it by introducing a 6db swing (plus whatever baffle diffraction effects are going on).

    Long story short, this is not the way to evaluate a driver. Perhaps try a simple BSC circuit - Hong has a calculator floating around that will definitely get you in the ballpark. You might be surprised at how much better they can sound.
    Don't listen to me - I have not sold any $150,000 speakers.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by JerriAZ View Post
      Any suggestions of what I should try next?
      Try measuring them in your cabinet and designing a proper filter. Post like this remind me of the phrase "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas", and then you are blaming the speaker driver. Most speakers don't sound that fantastic run full-range without a filter, especially in arrays. From what you've done, I would expect the single driver in a sealed box to have performed the best.

      What you have is a nice 3" driver with flat frequency response and low distorsion, and you get all that for only $13, so what's not to like?
      Don't waste your money on a new set of speakers, you get more mileage from a cheap pair of sneakers. Next phase, new wave, dance craze, anyways it's still rock and roll to me!

      Comment


      • #4
        For baffle step compensation you could use 2 drivers and put an inductor in series with one of them. That way the driver with the inductor will be active for 4 pi radiation and rolled off for 2 pi.

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        • #5
          If you put them back to back in(on)a small box you will have no baffle loss. Or take a big board, put the driver off center, and stand fairly close.

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          • #6
            What we your plans for these? I've used small ​Peerless as mids in a number of designs..........wonderful! There ain't no low end in these guys.
            Kenny

            http://www.diy-ny.com/
            DIY NY/NJ 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGwA...ature=youtu.be
            Man does not live by measurements alone, a little music helps.

            Comment


            • #7
              OP, I don't think you gave them a fair chance.

              Originally posted by kenny_k View Post
              What we your plans for these? I've used small ​Peerless as mids in a number of designs..........wonderful! There ain't no low end in these guys.
              Yep, me too Kenny! Super smooth response with extremely low distortion. They just can't do everything on their own (I still have never heard a single driver speaker that could). They have great midrange and nice highs (on axis), but there's nobody home on bass street.

              I used them in a hybrid open baffle design where they were the open baffle and played midrange and up. I used a Dayton ND105-4 in a bass reflex box below them to do the heavy lifting. I think that project turned out really nice and I got some positive feedback on them at SD DIY.
              Craig

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by johnnyrichards View Post
                1. Much comb filtering will be audibles
                2. Little less comb filtering, but will still affect overall sound quite a bit
                3. These are anemic on the bass in any event.

                Couple things stand out to me, primarily that of running absent filtering of any kind. These are not for making bass, they are for low distortion "wide range" sound. That being said, they are not immune to baffle step loss, and without compensating for that - you are taking a driver that is already anemic on the low end and exacerbating it by introducing a 6db swing (plus whatever baffle diffraction effects are going on).
                's ID Fsdfsdsfdjfsdaoij
                Long story short, this is not the way to evaluate a driver. Perhaps try a simple BSC circuit - Hong has a calculator floating around that will definitely get you in the ballpark. You might be surprised at how much better they can sound.
                ​Well, just like you said, I'm not expecting bass from these guys, but maybe I will try a BSC circuit for the heck of it.. If not that, I might just throwing a single capacitor on there to make sure the driver isn't trying to handle the lows.

                Originally posted by dcibel View Post
                Try measuring them in your cabinet and designing a proper filter. Post like this remind me of the phrase "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas", and then you are blaming the speaker driver. Most speakers don't sound that fantastic run full-range without a filter, especially in arrays. From what you've done, I would expect the single driver in a sealed box to have performed the best.

                What you have is a nice 3" driver with flat frequency response and low distorsion, and you get all that for only $13, so what's not to like?
                ​One of the reasons I got them was to compare them to some BMR12​'s I have for a very simple portable boombox that I made. Those are running rull-range without any filtering and sound much better that the Peerless ones so far--more detail and clarity for mids and highs. The Peerless have such a flat frequency response that I was hoping for more--just haven't got there yet.

                Originally posted by kenny_k View Post
                What we your plans for these? I've used small ​Peerless as mids in a number of designs..........wonderful! There ain't no low end in these guys.
                ​My main plan is to use these for some desktop speakers.

                Originally posted by PWR RYD View Post
                OP, I don't think you gave them a fair chance.

                Yep, me too Kenny! Super smooth response with extremely low distortion. They just can't do everything on their own (I still have never heard a single driver speaker that could). They have great midrange and nice highs (on axis), but there's nobody home on bass street.

                I used them in a hybrid open baffle design where they were the open baffle and played midrange and up. I used a Dayton ND105-4 in a bass reflex box below them to do the heavy lifting. I think that project turned out really nice and I got some positive feedback on them at SD DIY.

                ​I'm trying to give them a fair chance. That's why I created this thread. I haven't tried an open baffle setup yet. Might as well try that while I'm at it lol

                ​Thanks for the responses so far everyone

                Comment


                • #9
                  http://www.nolaspeakers.com/products/brio_b.php

                  This commercial venture uses these drivers and gets good reviews and can be diy'd (I think the sub even uses a Dayton amp). If you search around a little you will find some guesses at the crossover circuit and enclosure volume.
                  Projects:

                  transcenD: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5035-transcend
                  Summits: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...75-The-Summits
                  References: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...-My-References
                  Vintage Style 2-way: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...-vintage-2-way

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by dynamo View Post
                    http://www.nolaspeakers.com/products/brio_b.php

                    This commercial venture uses these drivers and gets good reviews and can be diy'd (I think the sub even uses a Dayton amp). If you search around a little you will find some guesses at the crossover circuit and enclosure volume.
                    ​Thanks for the link. And holy $3500?? I guess you can't put a price on good design. Wow hahaha.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I'm surprised I haven't seen anything about that design previously. Definitely looks promising. I will try that design next and let you guys know the result.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Google brio tri clones. Suppleement with bass. Be surprised.

                        Good thread here

                        http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-...ex-hybrid.html

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                        • #13
                          They will make a fine desktop speaker............with a sub.
                          Kenny

                          http://www.diy-ny.com/
                          DIY NY/NJ 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGwA...ature=youtu.be
                          Man does not live by measurements alone, a little music helps.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            They are really fine mid-ranges. No bass(can't really move any air), comb distortion with more than one above 3000hz. But as a midrange speaker: Fabulous.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by PWR RYD View Post
                              I used them in a hybrid open baffle design where they were the open baffle and played midrange and up. I used a Dayton ND105-4 in a bass reflex box below them to do the heavy lifting. I think that project turned out really nice and I got some positive feedback on them at SD DIY.
                              I heard Craig's (PWR RYD) speakers at SD DIY and thought they sounded great. Using the ND105-4 for bass duties instead of another Peerless was a definite upgrade. Here's a pic of the speakers. They sounded very open and did very well even in a large room.
                              "Everything is nothing without a high sound quality." (Sure Electronics)

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