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First Solo Design

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  • First Solo Design

    This is going to be my first time doing a design on my own (ish). I am thinking about doing a 2 way or maybe an mtm design. It will be for both music and for movies/TV. I am hoping to create a design that will make me want to go back through my music collection. I really want that clean clear and detailed sound. The drivers I am looking at all seem to be of high quality and will preform above their price points. I am trying to keep the driver costs under $400.

    As for past experience I started out building a pair of Amigas (Thanks Paul these are amazing!) and I am currently building a pair of C-Notes for a friend, waiting on the glue to dry. The first time I did my own thing I took two different designs that looked like they would work and turns out they did. That was an open baffle design mtmw design using Arum Cantus 5 1/4 mkII with a peerless bc25sc55 and an eminence alpha 15a. These are using a very simple 1st order crossover and while I am sure you guys on here could do better they do sound really great to my ears.

    I have been throwing around so many different ideas I am hoping you guys can help me narrow it down and get this project started.

    SB Acoustics SB17NRXC35-8, 6.5" Woofer
    SB Acoustics SB29RDC-C000-4 Ring Dome Tweeter
    SEAS Prestige 27TDFC (H1189) Textile Dome Tweeter
    SB Acoustics SB17NAC35-4 6.5" Aluminum Cone Woofer - 4 ohm These are currently on sale for $50
    SB Acoustics SB26ADC-C000-4 Aluminum Dome Tweeter

    My thinking was HDS Woofer or the Usher woofer in a 2 way bookshelf with either the SB Acoustics SB29RDC-C000-4 Ring Dome Tweeter or the SEAS Prestige 27TDFC (H1189) Textile Dome Tweeter.

    Maybe the SB Acoustics SB17NRXC35-8, 6.5" Woofer with the SB Acoustics SB29RDC-C000-4 Ring Dome Tweeter in either an mtm or 2way.

    The SB Acoustics SB17NAC35-4 6.5" Aluminum Cone Woofer - 4 ohm with the SB Acoustics SB26ADC-C000-4 Aluminum Dome Tweeter in either an mtm or 2way.

    Or if you think some other combination please feel free to share. If I left something out please ask. Thanks

  • #2
    The 2 drivers you linked to are both amazing - either one would be an excellent choice. Great bass and easy to cross over. I'm not a huge fan of the SB Acoustics midwoofers. They look and feel great, but they always seem to break-up weird and give me difficulty in the crossover. The Satori midwoofers from the same manufacturer are a whole different story - amongst my favorites - but the Usher and the Peerless you're looking at are great choices as well.

    The tweeters you listed get a lot of love, but none of them have stood out to me. For your first design, I think you'd have good success with the Morel CAT308. Between this tweeter and the Usher or Peerless, you shouldn't have any weirdness to deal with in the crossover.

    Tall Boys
    NRNP Computer Sub
    The Boxers
    The Hurricanes
    The Baronettes


    • #3
      Do you have the ability to measure the drivers yourself in their proposed enclosures in order to generate the FRD / ZMA files for crossover design?

      I don't (at this point at least), so I tend to go with Dayton parts for three reasons: (1) lower cost, (2) good performance, and (3) provided general FRD / ZMA files -- though not in my proposed enclosures. (better than nothing).

      This allows me to come reasonably close with a good crossover using XSim or PCD. Then I can tweak further after listening.

      I can certainly tell the difference between good drivers and excellent drivers -- but with my current skill set, these high dollar drivers have to overcome my novice crossover designs and that makes them not quite worth it. Same goes for fancy capacitors. Now when using other people's expert designs (Carmody Carreras), I'm ok with spending the money for the fancy stuff.

      (I'm still a newbie myself)


      • #4
        I looked up that tweeter and that looks like its nice and smooth and really good off axis response. Looks like 2k would be a good crossover point, well depending on topology. Guess I am going to have to choose between those two woofers. I have always wanted to try the Usher but I have heard so many good things about those peerless woofers and they are half the price.

        I don't have a way to measure the ts parameters but my plan is to use a mini DSP 2x4 HD to design a crossover and then buy the parts for an analogue crossover. I figure it gives me options to try things with out having buy tons of caps and inductors. Ya right there with you being new to this and trying to find the balance between drivers that sound good but might to to pricey to start with. I hope to make these look and sound good so I can sell them to friends/family for cost and then put that into my next design.


        • #5
          I've seen quite a few people go that route (active then try to replicate in passive). It rarely works out to be that easy. Either way, measurements are needed for the best results. Otherwise, it's just a shot in the dark.


          • #6
            What would you recommend for taking measurements? In the past I thought about getting DATS with some measurement mic and using REW.


            • #7
              Buy the dats & omni mic combo and don't look back.


              • #8
                I think I have decided to go with the morel tweeter and the usher woofer. I think I'll try to go active first as I all ready have the equipment and if I run into to much trouble trying to make it analogue then I'll probably go and get the dats and Omni mic combo.


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Ranis View Post
                  I think I have decided to go with the morel tweeter and the usher woofer. I think I'll try to go active first as I all ready have the equipment and if I run into to much trouble trying to make it analogue then I'll probably go and get the dats and Omni mic combo.
                  You can't really do a proper active crossover without being able to measure as you need the driver responses in order to eq them to flat and then to add the crossover slopes to the flattened response. It's only $70 for the UMM-6 or UMIK-1 and that is all you will need to do measurements, and for less than $20 you can build an impedence measuring jig if you want to get into passive crossovers. That $70 will go a long long way (many years) if you decide to regularly do designs, so it is really not a big upfront investment.


                  • #10
                    I can make the SB woofers siiiing, I did a design that, all modesty aside, shows off more of the SB potential than even a certain Excel-ent totem was able.
                    Don't listen to me - I have not sold any $150,000 speakers.


                    • #11
                      Ya I have the UMIK-1 in my cart, the impedance jig sounds interesting as I am trying to not spend too much right now.

                      I am curious what SB woofers you are referring to. I am tempted to get the aluminum woofers since they are on sale and then use them in a future design.


                      • #12
                        I have used both the SB 6" and 5" paper cone (RNX) and agree with Johnny, they are fantastic little drivers with more bass capabilities than they should. However, the Peerless you linked is also a high-class woofer too, so you can't go wrong with either.
                        Keep in mind that aluminum cone woofers typically (not always) have a resonance right at the point you would cross a 2-way (1200-1800 Hz), which only means you will need to push that down and use a couple extra parts to make it sound the best it can.

                        If you live close to a forum member, a lot of guys help each other out with impendance and FR sweeps, if buying isn't in the budget quite yet you could always see if someone's close by with a couple hours to spare.

                        The "SB's" build page


                        • #13
                          Well I knew the people on this forum were good but I had no idea you guys were this good.


                          • #14
                            Ok so I just placed the order, I got the Usher and Morel. Now the real work starts, designing a crossover.


                            • #15
                              Congrats and I look forward to following along your journey. Enjoy it!!