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Anyone Built Pete's New Designs: Apollo / Ares ?

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  • #16
    TMM or MTM oriented vertically will have very uniform horizontal off axis dispersion. The difference would be in the vertical lobing where the 2.5-way would behave more like a TM.

    But for 2-channel listening, I'm not sure you'd notice much difference between the TMM or MTM when sitting in the "sweet spot."
    R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
    Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

    95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
    "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

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    • #17
      Makes sense! I think the TMM might make more sense using the PE cabinet because they are 34" high and an MTM at that height would put the tweeter well below ear level. MTM would work on like a 24" stand im guessing.

      Is there any way you'd be willing to share the TMM crossover?

      When I build it I'd be happy to take measurements for you if that would provide more data for your future stuff with the anarchy. I have a umik and REW, and I'm clearly a novice in all areas haha but I'd love to contribute in some way as a thanks.

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      • #18
        Hey Pete,

        would it be possible to post or pm me the .frd and .zma files for the 558 that you used? I want to play around with it. I'm thinking of pairing the woofer with a Fountek ribbon.

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        • #19
          Originally posted by thechemist View Post
          Hey Pete,

          would it be possible to post or pm me the .frd and .zma files for the 558 that you used? I want to play around with it. I'm thinking of pairing the woofer with a Fountek ribbon.
          Here ya go. Keep in mind that these are relative levels, not absolute sensitivity. In other words, what you see on there is accurate for shape, but not for level. This is on-baffle, and is probably about 1 to 1.5dB lower than the calculated sensitivity of 85dB based on TS parameters.
          Attached Files
          R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
          Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

          95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
          "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

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          • #20

            Here ya go. Keep in mind that these are relative levels, not absolute sensitivity. In other words, what you see on there is accurate for shape, but not for level. This is on-baffle, and is probably about 1 to 1.5dB lower than the calculated sensitivity of 85dB based on TS parameters.
            Thanks Pete.

            How different would the crossover be if the Apollo was a TM? Maybe doing TM for L/R and MTM for center? I don't have a large living room (16' x 10.5' x 7.5'). I am ~80" from my TV/speakers.

            I'm playing around with the idea of using the 5.5" anarchry or the 7".
            Last edited by thechemist; 02-17-2018, 01:37 PM.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by thechemist View Post

              Thanks Pete.

              How different would the crossover be if the Apollo was a TM? Maybe doing TM for L/R and MTM for center? I don't have have a large living room (16' x 10.5' x 7.5''). I am ~80" from my TV/speakers.

              I'm playing around with the idea of using the 5.5" anarchry or the 7".
              Between the Apollo TM and MTM, the crossover will be very similar. Because we're using the 4 Ohm Anarchy in the TM, the woofer crossover will the same. The tweeter crossover will be different to account for the 3dB loss in sensitivity. The TM version using the 4 Ohm woofer is in the works and should be ready to go in a couple weeks.

              But I'd go the other way, TM for the center, oriented vertically for uniform off axis coverage, and MTM or TMM for the left and right.

              The 5.5" Anarchy is a dang nice woofer too. MTM with those will easily be the equal of any other 7" MTM due to the large displacement capacity. But they do require a substantial enclosure (~1cf) in order to get to F3 in the 30s. Smaller raises the F3 into the 40s, which is still plenty for most folks.

              Last night I queued up John Wick II on the DVR and turned it UP!!!! There is no shortage of dynamic punch!!! What a fun couple hours. Didn't keep count, but the number of on-screen deaths and brains exploding was monumental, and the various firearms discharging with the concussive impact was awesome.
              R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
              Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

              95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
              "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

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              • #22
                The 5.5" Anarchy is a dang nice woofer too. MTM with those will easily be the equal of any other 7" MTM due to the large displacement capacity. But they do require a substantial enclosure (~1cf) in order to get to F3 in the 30s. Smaller raises the F3 into the 40s, which is still plenty for most folks.
                what about running them sealed? Presumably​ running a sub to cover the bottom end

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by thechemist View Post

                  what about running them sealed? Presumably​ running a sub to cover the bottom end
                  I don't see a problem with that at all. You'll need a sub that can get up to around 80Hz
                  R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                  Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                  95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                  "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                  Comment


                  • #24

                    I don't see a problem with that at all. You'll need a sub that can get up to around 80Hz
                    what size would you recommend for the TM and MTM. Using 5.5" woofer?

                    Comment


                    • #25

                      Between the Apollo TM and MTM, the crossover will be very similar. Because we're using the 4 Ohm Anarchy in the TM, the woofer crossover will the same. The tweeter crossover will be different to account for the 3dB loss in sensitivity. The TM version using the 4 Ohm woofer is in the works and should be ready to go in a couple weeks.

                      But I'd go the other way, TM for the center, oriented vertically for uniform off axis coverage, and MTM or TMM for the left and right.

                      The 5.5" Anarchy is a dang nice woofer too. MTM with those will easily be the equal of any other 7" MTM due to the large displacement capacity. But they do require a substantial enclosure (~1cf) in order to get to F3 in the 30s. Smaller raises the F3 into the 40s, which is still plenty for most folks.

                      Last night I queued up John Wick II on the DVR and turned it UP!!!! There is no shortage of dynamic punch!!! What a fun couple hours. Didn't keep count, but the number of on-screen deaths and brains exploding was monumental, and the various firearms discharging with the concussive impact was awesome.
                      How small of a sealed box would work with them of you were OK with a 40-50hz roll off?

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by stephenmarklay View Post

                        How small of a sealed box would work with them of you were OK with a 40-50hz roll off?
                        .25 cubic feet sealed will put F3 at 75 and 83 for the 7 and 5.5 respectively.

                        The 5.5" in .35 cubic feet tuned to 45Hz will put F3 at around 44Hz


                        R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                        Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                        95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                        "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by thechemist View Post

                          what size would you recommend for the TM and MTM. Using 5.5" woofer?
                          .3 and .6 for the TM and MTM respectively. F3 of 83Hz
                          R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                          Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                          95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                          "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                          Comment


                          • #28

                            .25 cubic feet sealed will put F3 at 75 and 83 for the 7 and 5.5 respectively.

                            The 5.5" in .35 cubic feet tuned to 45Hz will put F3 at around 44Hz

                            Thank you so much.

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                            • #29

                              The real difference between the two is the ability to scale. Apollo looks like a smallish MTM but sounds like a large floor stander. A pair of them will pressurize a room unlike any 7" two way stand mount speaker. The Anarchy woofers are game changers in that respect. With double the available excursion of other 7" woofers, that translates directly into peak capacity. And that doesn't go unnoticed, especially during very dynamic passages. So if you ever really like to turn it up, Apollo is the way to go.

                              Ares delivers big sound in a small package. The little Anarchy is obviously smaller, and it has less Xmax than its big brother, but it's still well in excess of other 5.5" woofers at 9mm one-way. The parameters allow it to hit mid 30s in the right cabinet, something unusual for a 5.5" woofer. Of course it's easy to drive it to its limits compared to the Apollo, but for someone who never turns it up to concert level Ares will deliver full range music to reasonably high levels: over 102dB from 40Hz on up in .5cf tuned to 42Hz. That's pretty special for a 5.5" driver.
                              I am interested in this little woofer but for some reason DIYSoundgroup does not publish the specs. Are this available?

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by stephenmarklay View Post

                                I am interested in this little woofer but for some reason DIYSoundgroup does not publish the specs. Are this available?
                                The little Anarchy has the following specs. I've only measured the 8 Ohm version.

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                                The 7" 8 and 4 Ohm models are below.

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                                R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                                Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                                95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                                "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

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