The Mystiques - Build Thread

[Kevin K.]

Kevin, what do you think caused the lumpy finish under the CF. I would have thought the vacuum bag would have negated that issue. How did you apply
the 3M adhesive?

I applied the adhesive to the back of the Carbon Fiber with a 3" wide putty knife and then used a rubber roller to get it as uniform as possible. There's a pretty rough backing on this stuff so perhaps the glue needs to be much thicker to account for how rough the backing is. I'll be attaching a picture of the backing to this reply.

Catching up to your thread, bud... most impressive! I can imagine what you mean with the "lumpy" carbon fiber finish. Makes me recall that the 0-90 carbon fiber IS a woven product, and will be kinda bumpy unless given a thick enough topcoat of epoxy or other material.

I hadn't appreciated that you were using the carbon fiber as an insert to the cabinet front face. Does it pop in and out relatively easy? I'm thinking about your upcoming white paint job here... I'd never be able to tape that carbon fiber off cleanly enough to satisfy myself. It would have to come out for the painting, then get cleared as a unit afterward (as you're doing). I assume you cut the CF insert on the CNC to match your profile after vacuum bagging?

Lots of questions peppered in there. As always, great work! Maybe one day I'll do some vacuum bag veneering at home I know there's some neat curvature features to be had there that can't quite be achieved any other way!

Thanks Keith! Yep, we're on the same page. The Carbon Fiber insert will come out easily and it will be removed while painting the cabinets white. If there's any wet sanding required on the white, I'll do that right before gluing in the Carbon Fiber insert. Once it's glued in, clear coat the whole thing at once. Couple of days later, wet sand and polish the entire cabinet.

Still studying the CF to try to figure out if the lumps are related to how much glue I applied or if it's just the top finish from the factory. Kind of reminds me of a bad car paint job. You can apply a high gloss clear over an orange peeled paint but if the clear isn't wet sanded and buffed, you can still see the orange peel telegraphing through.

[KEtheredge87]

Catching up to your thread, bud... most impressive! I can imagine what you mean with the "lumpy" carbon fiber finish. Makes me recall that the 0-90 carbon fiber IS a woven product, and will be kinda bumpy unless given a thick enough topcoat of epoxy or other material.

I hadn't appreciated that you were using the carbon fiber as an insert to the cabinet front face. Does it pop in and out relatively easy? I'm thinking about your upcoming white paint job here... I'd never be able to tape that carbon fiber off cleanly enough to satisfy myself. It would have to come out for the painting, then get cleared as a unit afterward (as you're doing). I assume you cut the CF insert on the CNC to match your profile after vacuum bagging?

Lots of questions peppered in there. As always, great work! Maybe one day I'll do some vacuum bag veneering at home I know there's some neat curvature features to be had there that can't quite be achieved any other way!

[Kevin K.]

Sorry for the late replies guys, busy weekend. Spent most of it with Rick Craig of Selah Audio at LoneStar Audiofest, good times. We took some on and off-axis measurements of the Mystique's Friday night in his hotel room. He pointed out a couple of areas that need addressed on the crossovers and made some other suggestions, so I'll be working on that over the next few weeks. Sunday, he came by the house to help fine tune the Gandalf's. Have never done any in-room tuning for the arrays and he detected some room issues/nodes as soon as he heard them. This was a treat to see how much difference room adjustments/tuning can make. He also suggested I build some wall treatments for further improvements. I'm thinking Rick really enjoyed them after the tuning was finished. We spent a couple of hours listening to his music library and he sampled a lot of different stuff. I envy his music collection.

Thanks dkalsi! I've learned a lot from other builders on this forum and am only trying to pay it forward by sharing any tips I think might be helpful to others. It's part of what makes this such a great community.

Nice!

Thanks Mike!

Thanks dst! I've heard this driver in two cabinets now, mine and in Rick Craig's Epico. The reinforced Ceramic cone is not only sexy to look at, it's also an incredibly smooth driver. Easy to work with. IMO, SB Acoustics left money on the table with these drivers but lets keep that to ourselves.

Where did you source the carbon fiber?

Here you go. https://dragonplate.com/

nice work !

Thanks filmslayer!

[Squidspeak]

Last of the teasers on the Mystique's for a while guys. After this, it'll be time to dig in and catch the other cabinet up. Also need to vacuum press the other Carbon Fiber insert, paint the cabs and then clear coat everything as a whole. The CF isn't standing out very well in these pics. Once the cabinets are painted to match the Ceramic driver, the CF should pop a little more.

Disclosure: All though these photos of the CF look okay, I didn't realize until peeling back the protective tape how lumpy the finish is. It's got a great gloss to it but it's not very flat and as you move around and view it from different angles, you can see the lumps. Sorry, I'm anal about this kind of stuff and that's not gonna work for me so I'll be shooting clear over these panels at the same time I shoot the cabs. After some wet sanding and polishing, it will be flat along with glossy.









Got the paint match done this week. Lady at the paint supply nailed it IMO.

Kevin, what do you think caused the lumpy finish under the CF. I would have thought the vacuum bag would have negated that issue. How did you apply
the 3M adhesive?

[filmslayer]

nice work !

[skatz]

Where did you source the carbon fiber?

[dst]

Total cabinet porn!  Amazing.  So how does the ceramic sound?

[Millstonemike]

Nice!

[dkalsi]

Last of the teasers on the Mystique's for a while guys.

Just blows my mind how talented some of the folks are on this form. Absolutely beautiful work Kevin. Thank you for sharing design/build tips as you go. 

[Kevin K.]

Thanks Howard.

Thanks Tom. I'm right there with you, I've never been much of a fan of the hot rod black on cars or trucks but for some reason it does look pretty cool on this cabinet. Maybe it's because it's being complimented by the Carbon Fiber.

[tomzarbo]

They look really nice Kevin.  FR too. I forgot, what's the white paint for again?  Oh, never mind, duh... cabinet color. It actually looks pretty sleek in matte black to be honest!  Strange, I don't care for that look on cars, but on these, it looks pretty cool.

Looks amazing!

TomZ
 

[howard]

Beautiful speaker.  Response looks promising!

[Kevin K.]

Couldn't resist the temptation to hear one of these so I took a quick stab at the crossover on one of the Mystique's. 3rd order on both drivers crossed at 2.5K. Also tested the tuning this afternoon and this was the closest I've been on any of my builds. Needed a 1/2" adjustment to get it to my target of 37hz. I've got some special company coming by this weekend, Mr. Rick Craig of Selah Audio. He's going to take a listen to what I've concocted here and give me some tips or advise. Looking forward to learning some stuff from one of the Masters.





I suspect there are some phase issues that could be addressed, only seeing about a 6db drop when reversing the tweeter polarity. And it may need a little more baffle step, not sure yet cause it's out in the middle of the room but it sounds pretty thin to me.

[Kevin K.]

Last of the teasers on the Mystique's for a while guys. After this, it'll be time to dig in and catch the other cabinet up. Also need to vacuum press the other Carbon Fiber insert, paint the cabs and then clear coat everything as a whole. The CF isn't standing out very well in these pics. Once the cabinets are painted to match the Ceramic driver, the CF should pop a little more.

Disclosure: All though these photos of the CF look okay, I didn't realize until peeling back the protective tape how lumpy the finish is. It's got a great gloss to it but it's not very flat and as you move around and view it from different angles, you can see the lumps. Sorry, I'm anal about this kind of stuff and that's not gonna work for me so I'll be shooting clear over these panels at the same time I shoot the cabs. After some wet sanding and polishing, it will be flat along with glossy.









Got the paint match done this week. Lady at the paint supply nailed it IMO.

[Kevin K.]

This picture is right after sanding the first of several coats of primer required. My preference is the Evercoat G2 polyester primer. Stuff builds well and sands even better. Only drawback is the fact that it is a catalyzed primer. Once you mix it, get it sprayed and out of the gun as quickly as possible. Don't leave it sitting in the gun afterwards or plan on spending the next hour or more cleaning the gun back up.



Front view after the second coat of primer



Side view after the second coat of primer. Everything is starting to cover, no sign of the laminations any more. Three coats may get the job done, I'll have to see how these turn out after sanding this second coat.



This is where I've left off. Purchased the 3M 2216 adhesive, spread a layer of it on the back side of the carbon fiber and used the vacuum bag to press it onto the piece of 1/4" MDF. Sat in the bag overnight. Manufacturers recommendation is 8-12 hours under clamping pressure. Will take a shot at cutting this stuff this evening or tomorrow night. Stay tuned.