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  • Stereo console - need full range speaker recommendation

    I am planning on building an all-in-one stereo console with a turntable, amplifier and built-in speakers. Sort of similar in looks to the attached photo. I already have the turntable, can build an amplifier plus the phono stage but I need a recommendation for set of full range drivers. I do not want to mess with tweeter/woofer configuration, crossovers, ported enclosures. It would have to be a single driver sealed 1 cubic feet per speaker enclosure (maybe a bit more if design permits). I was thinking about Visaton BG20 8" driver for which a 1.06 cubic feet enclosure is recommended. Would that be a good choice or would you recommend a different driver. The music I listen to is classic rock, rock and roll and classical. I am looking mostly for a non-fatiguing sound. Main source will of course be the turntable but I will have an aux jack and bluetooth option as well.

  • #2
    For an 8" FR (w/whizzer) in a closed box, the GRS 8FR-8 only reaches 80Hz, the Visaton BG20 does 70, but the Goldwood GW-8003/8 will do 50Hz. That's the only one I'd consider, personally.
    These drivers are ALL limited to an Xmax of only 2 or 3mm, meaning they can only handle 5w RMS or LESS, gracefully.
    You'd get MUCH better range/sound-quality by finding a 1cf 2-way design to put on each end (vented is the only way to get decent bass if you're not going to use a subwoofer, UNless you use some kind of EQ/boost).

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    • #3
      Originally posted by drabina View Post
      I am planning on building an all-in-one stereo console with a turntable, amplifier and built-in speakers. Sort of similar in looks to the attached photo.
      You will need to make considerable efforts to isolate the turntable effectively from the structure-borne vibration created by the drivers hammering on the baffle. An interesting challenge.

      Is this intended for background music while pottering around the room doing things or do you intend to sit in the sweet spot directly in front? Wide bandwidth drivers tend to beam strongly at high frequencies unlike conventional 2 ways or coaxials. For the console shown in your picture where the drivers have a fixed orientation of 90 degrees to the wall sitting in the sweet spot will mean listening at something like 30 degrees off the driver axis. The directivity of your Visaton driver is shown here. Do you really want to be listening 30 degrees off axis? If pushed for space a coaxial would be significantly more appropriate but inevitably there would be increased cost and complexity in order to achieve the increase in sound quality. Whether this is worthwhile for this project is for you to decide. $30 per channel is an attractive price.

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      • #4
        Thanks guys for a detailed replies. Much appreciated.

        With the Xmax of 2mm and ability to use only 5W of power, I may go with a low powered tube amp. Still, 5W may be enough for my needs. This would be for a fairly close range listening (3-5 feet) with seating around the console (on the left and right) but not in the front. Not for critical listening (for which I have another system) but sort of "cool conversation piece that plays music" type of setup. You know couple of guys in the basement, with drinks, playing The Eagles, admiring the setup and some nostalgia in the air as we all grew up with vinyl.

        I know about the vibrations from the speakers transferring to the turntable. This will be taken under consideration when designing the console though many older consoles were designed similarly. If I cannot overcome the vibrations at the design stage, I may split the speakers and stereo into three separate pieces on their own stands but that's a last resort.

        I can do electronics and the woodworking part but I am not familiar with the speaker design part. What benefit would I get from a coaxial speaker? Do I need to design a crossover, port the box, do some other things? Would something like Tang Band W8-2314 be a lot better than the Visaton or Goldwood mentioned above? I mean like 6x better considering the price of the Tang Band driver? I can spend the money but would need some advice if it is worth it to go from a $30 driver to $180 one.

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        • #5
          A major benefit of a coaxial speaker is avoiding the narrow beaming of the high frequencies of a "full range" driver which is important when you do not intend to sit near the speaker axis. Another is a smoother response due to having a small driver behaving well for the high frequencies and a large driver behaving reasonably well for the low frequencies. The disadvantage is that you need to include a crossover but reasonable examples are often provided along with the datasheet.

          There are loads of modestly priced car coaxials about which I know nothing in terms of performance but many may be superior to your Visaton PA "full range" driver. Anyone?

          SB Acoustics have released a range of modestly priced coaxials with spec sheets that suggest they are suitable for home audio. I have no direct experience. Anyone? The 6.5" $58 version is possibly worth a look. I won't provide a link because PE is not a distributor of SB Acoustics in the US but their competitor's description page provides guidance on example cabinet sizes and an example crossover. There are more expensive coaxials like the Tangband you cite but the SB is likely to be around the cheapest price one will find reasonable examples for your home audio application.

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          • #6
            I'm new. I don't know what I'm doing. When I read the specs for the Visaton it says 40W rms and 92 db 1w/1m. It also looks like you want a pretty piece of furniture for entertainment. I'd think you'd be good given your goals. 92 db 1w/1m should be loud on low wattage, right?

            If you decided you wanted different sound characteristics you could make modifications to suit your tastes later. I think you're good but like I said, I'm new and don't know what I'm doing yet.

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            • #7
              I'm a fan of Mark Audio speakers. They are designed as full range drivers, they are very simple to use. The Alpiar 10P might be just what you're looking for, in my opinion. However, they do need to be ported, so if that's a deal breaker for your build, nevermind.
              If you're still reading, the manufacturer recommends an 11.951-liter box with a 35mm X 80mm port to get an Fb of 47Hz. Very easy build.
              Mike
              "We're speaker geeks, not speaker nerds. Nerds make money!" Marty H
              Bismarck, North Dakota
              My Current System: Jolida SJ502A, Squeezebox Touch, and Carmody Sunflowers
              My Garage System:Marantz 2238B and Nano-Neos

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by mikejennens View Post
                I'm a fan of Mark Audio speakers. They are designed as full range drivers, they are very simple to use. The Alpiar 10P might be just what you're looking for, in my opinion. However, they do need to be ported, so if that's a deal breaker for your build, nevermind.
                If you're still reading, the manufacturer recommends an 11.951-liter box with a 35mm X 80mm port to get an Fb of 47Hz. Very easy build.
                Mike
                I was kind of thinking the same thing, before I read this post...or Fostex. Maybe you can take a look for a folded horn design with outside dimensions that fit your vision. It would add complexity to the build, and you'd want to follow the horn design to the letter. It would be a sweet match for a little tube amp.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by mikejennens View Post
                  I'm a fan of Mark Audio speakers. They are designed as full range drivers, they are very simple to use. The Alpiar 10P might be just what you're looking for, in my opinion. However, they do need to be ported, so if that's a deal breaker for your build, nevermind.
                  If you're still reading, the manufacturer recommends an 11.951-liter box with a 35mm X 80mm port to get an Fb of 47Hz. Very easy build.
                  Mike
                  Interesting. The recommended enclosure is 14" high so that's in a ballpark for the design I was thinking of. Front port is easy and I will not be restricted by the wall behind the unit. The problem is with the depth of the enclosure being only 7". I will have about 2x the depth.

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                  • #10
                    You can make a false cavity with nothing in it. You can also mass-load a small volume with sand to cut down on vibration to the vinyl.
                    Wolf
                    "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                    "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                    "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                    "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                    *InDIYana event website*

                    Photobucket pages:
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                    http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

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                    • #11
                      make a false back section to extend it to the required depth...
                      ak

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by drabina View Post

                        Interesting. The recommended enclosure is 14" high so that's in a ballpark for the design I was thinking of. Front port is easy and I will not be restricted by the wall behind the unit. The problem is with the depth of the enclosure being only 7". I will have about 2x the depth.
                        Here is another enclosure, closer to what it seems you're looking for, designed by a very knowledgeable gentleman. As long as the volume stays close to the same, it should work well for your purpose. It wouldn't be a GR (golden ratio), but I think it would still work well in your application.
                        http://wodendesign.com/downloads/sim...lan-100214.pdf
                        "We're speaker geeks, not speaker nerds. Nerds make money!" Marty H
                        Bismarck, North Dakota
                        My Current System: Jolida SJ502A, Squeezebox Touch, and Carmody Sunflowers
                        My Garage System:Marantz 2238B and Nano-Neos

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by drabina View Post
                          ... I can do electronics and the woodworking part but I am not familiar with the speaker design part. ...
                          I'd go for an existing, ported, 2-way design. Lots of choices in that category circa 1 ft3. Including kits including drivers, XO components and misc items for a build. Add the enclosure.

                          .

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Millstonemike View Post
                            I'd go for an existing, ported, 2-way design. Lots of choices in that category circa 1 ft3. Including kits including drivers, XO components and misc items for a build. Add the enclosure.

                            .
                            I am noob when it comes to speaker building. How would I go about finding kit that's has the enclosure of approx. 1 cubic ft? I did a quick check on PE's website but all the small two-way kits are lot smaller than what I need. Any recommendations? If the kit includes all the parts (XO, port, drivers and instructions) I can definitely do it.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by drabina View Post

                              I am noob when it comes to speaker building. How would I go about finding kit that's has the enclosure of approx. 1 cubic ft? I did a quick check on PE's website but all the small two-way kits are lot smaller than what I need. Any recommendations? If the kit includes all the parts (XO, port, drivers and instructions) I can definitely do it.
                              You don't have to use the entire 1 ft3 available in your console's design. You can add a false or recessed back to reduce the available volume for the speaker. For example, both the Classix II and Hitmaker MT kits need about 0.7 ft3 internal volume. For the PE offerings, you would get a pre-cut baffle with the kit. An extra you don't need to use.

                              Once you get past the need to use the entire available volume, there are are host of MT kits with an internal volume in the 0.7 ft3 to 0.75 ft3 range. It boils down to budget. For example, the Apollo 7 MT kit (available elsewhere) comes in at ~$400 per pair; a step up in SPL.

                              Your front baffle will be a different shape than the original designs for these kits. That will change the sound somewhat. Once you have narrowed down the choices, post again. Many members can tell you about driver placement on your console's baffles to minimize any changes from the original design.

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