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Budget diy Dayton 2-way vs budget brand monitor

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  • #31
    Something I don't understand - one among many things! These sound good on my desk as near-field monitors. But out in a room, they will probably sound thin. There doesn't seem to be a good way to add more BSC here. This looks to only have about 1dB. Increasing L1 adds a tiny bit more, as can be seen in the transfer function. But it also changes the crossover point and mucks everything else up along the way. Is adding an LR network out in front the only (or easiest) way to increase BSC in a series crossover?
    Co-conspirator in the development of the "CR Gnarly Fidelity Reduction Unit" - Registered Trademark, Patent Pending.

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    • #32
      Thanks for messing around, again
      First things first, what does the 'H' mean I see on your drivers? Does that mean inverted?

      Anyway, simply adding the coil really messes up my crossover. (of the ND25FW_15deg)
      I can change the R1 from 4.7 to around 6ohms, then I have about 3db of BSC from 1000hz and up.

      I can upload the .dxo and driver files if you want.
      Attached Files
      Last edited by prxprx; 05-28-2020, 06:46 AM.

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      • #33
        Put a 1.0mH on the junction between R2 and the woofer negative connection. Vary to taste.
        Wolf
        "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
        "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
        "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
        "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

        *InDIYana event website*

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Wolf View Post
          Put a 1.0mH on the junction between R2 and the woofer negative connection. Vary to taste.
          Wolf
          Ah yes, that works as a BSC! I've updated 'my' crossover for the ND25FW. (I just love it's design, call me biased!)
          It still uses the 15 degree file. Any comments? I don't really like the look of the impedance plot, but then again; I'm just messing around a bit.

          The DX20 might still be the better choice, but I would love to design something myself.
          Attached Files

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          • #35
            Thanks for the tip, Wolf! I played around with this briefly last night, but I still need to dial things in a bit more.

            prxprx - that looks better than mine at the moment! I'm curious if you still have the plateau in the tweeter response. Can you shift the center line up in that window?

            Maybe Wolf can chime in on whether the impedance looks acceptable with a series network.
            Co-conspirator in the development of the "CR Gnarly Fidelity Reduction Unit" - Registered Trademark, Patent Pending.

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            • #36
              Originally posted by tom_s View Post
              Thanks for the tip, Wolf! I played around with this briefly last night, but I still need to dial things in a bit more.

              prxprx - that looks better than mine at the moment! I'm curious if you still have the plateau in the tweeter response. Can you shift the center line up in that window?

              Maybe Wolf can chime in on whether the impedance looks acceptable with a series network.
              Ah yes, I've shifted the center and changed the vertical spacing to 3dB.
              I've also worked on the version with your XO, slightly different approach. your DX20 has a much better impedance plot.
              Note, my version uses the generic files that PE supply, your DX20 version has 'real life' measurements.
              Attached Files

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              • #37
                JB always recommended adding a "tail" to the end of freq. resp. data (I THINK he even had a tool w/which to do it?), meaning that the tweeter's "drop off" (below Fs) SHOULD continue downward (at approx. -12dB/octave?), as opposed to some measurements that show(ed) it leveling off - or worse.

                Ben?

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                • #38
                  Chris just reminded me - I didn't answer the question about the H shown beside the drivers. From what I can tell, that indicates the phase/response tails have been modified. I know it can make a fairly significant difference with a parallel design. I'm grateful that feature is included in X-Sim, since I no longer have Excel on a working computer.

                  I haven't been as mindful of phase response on this one - not really knowing how to alter it in a series design. I'm seeing a reverse null when inverting the DX20, so I'm guessing it's close. I also made sure to enter the acoustic offset - following Jeff Bagby's method, I used WinPCD to determine that.
                  Co-conspirator in the development of the "CR Gnarly Fidelity Reduction Unit" - Registered Trademark, Patent Pending.

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by tom_s View Post
                    Chris just reminded me - I didn't answer the question about the H shown beside the drivers. From what I can tell, that indicates the phase/response tails have been modified. I know it can make a fairly significant difference with a parallel design. I'm grateful that feature is included in X-Sim, since I no longer have Excel on a working computer.

                    I haven't been as mindful of phase response on this one - not really knowing how to alter it in a series design. I'm seeing a reverse null when inverting the DX20, so I'm guessing it's close. I also made sure to enter the acoustic offset - following Jeff Bagby's method, I used WinPCD to determine that.
                    And that right there is where it get's too complicated for my first time. ;-)
                    I might just go for your latest DX20 version as I have more confidence in your crossover skills than mine!

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                    • #40
                      Just messing around and it looks like the TD20F is also a valuable option.
                      Saves money on the XO too. Any opinions?

                      DX20 version XO + drivers = $106 over here
                      TD20F version XO + drivers = $81 over here
                      Attached Files

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