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High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

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  • High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

    Congratulations to Dennis Murphy and Jim Salk !!!!!!!

  • #2
    Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

    Originally posted by Dwight View Post
    Congratulations to Dennis Murphy and Jim Salk !!!!!!!
    do you have a link by any chance or it's a new article?
    http://www.diy-ny.com/

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    • #3
      Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

      I've seen several reviews for the Song Towers and all have been effusive in their praise. But that has been the case with all the offerings from the dynamic duo of Dennis Murphy and Jim Salk. Jim's mastery of woodworking and Dennis' magic with crossover design never cease to amaze me. Recently Dennis designed a crossover for a pair of 3-way speakers I was building and the results are most impressive. It also doesn't hurt that Dennis is a real gentleman and a pleasure to deal with. Glad to see good folks like Jim and Dennis are getting the recognition they deserve.

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      • #4
        Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

        I was really happy to see that written up a few weeks back, but disappointed that Dennis didn't get credit. Most good reviews laud the XO designer and many manufacturers get good milage from playing up that affiliation (the best speaker on earth, etc.). In my experience not only is Dennis an exceptional designer, he is just an all around good guy and somebody I am proud to know as a friend. As the host of a DIY meet he is also known as a heck of a cook!

        Congrats to all involved as I believe it was a collaborative effort WRT the cabinet tuning, driver choice, XO and Salk's fine construction.
        When you run make sure you run,
        to something not away from, cause lies don't need an aeroplane to chase you anywhere.

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        • #5
          Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

          And, even though Jim provided the magazine with several high-resolution photos of the gorgeous SongTowers, TAS published only photos of the AVA power amp used to drive them for this combined review!?
          Paul

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          • #6
            Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

            Originally posted by r-carpenter View Post
            do you have a link by any chance or it's a new article?

            http://www.enjoythemusic.com/magazin..._songtower.htm

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            • #7
              Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

              Excellent. Congrads from me as well!!!
              http://www.diy-ny.com/

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                I've never heard any Dennis Murphy designed crossover but I've only heard good about them.

                Congrats to both of them!
                "It is only Scrooge McDuck and others with a personality disorder who have money as their goal"

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                • #9
                  Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                  A few nuggets from the article (which I have here on my lap; I'm a long-time TAS reader):

                  "On balance, I found the SongTower to be an inspired design and integration. So many multiway designs appear to sound like an ill-fitting sonic jigsaw puzzle. By contrast, the SongTower sings with one voice, both on and off axis, almost as cohesively as a full-range driver. As a consequence, this speaker is capable of performing a convincing disappearing act."

                  "...Fidelity of instrumental tembres was excellent, and in particular, female voice was fleshed out with believable harmonic colors."

                  "In my estimation, the Salk Sound SongTower and Ultravalve combo represent the most musical audio dollars you're ever likely to spend during a lifetime of consumption."

                  I left out the couple of criticisms, but they engendered a lack of punch in the bass and a depressed upper bass range. One problem with the ML-TL designs I've heard is that they don't have 'immediacy' in the bass, because like an underdamped reflex system, they take an audible few cycles to reach their steady-state output, while big woofers in a well-damped sealed box (or even some vented alignments that pay extra attention to damping) will reach out of the speaker, grab you by the shirt collar, and demand that you listen to the bass right now, giving that sock-you-in-the-eardrum performance that's so thrilling about a speaker with real low-end muscle. So the criticism of the SongTower's bass being less than engaging is one that I'm not entirely surprised to read.
                  Best Regards,

                  Rory Buszka

                  Taterworks Audio

                  "The work of the individual still remains the spark which moves mankind ahead, even more than teamwork." - Igor I. Sikorsky

                  If it works, but you don't know why it works, then you haven't done any engineering.

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                  • #10
                    Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                    Keep in mind that the anechoic F3 in the STs is only 42 Hz as I modeled it, which is really quite good considering the midwoofers' capabilities, and that will affect some of the lack of punch one might expect/hope to hear/feel. Also I do take exception to your generalization that ML-TLs will not have an immediacy in their bass sound. How the bass performs and sounds is not only dependent on the ML-TL design, it's also dependent on the driver. In my 3-way canTiLenas, also an ML-TL design, the woofer is an 8" SS with an aluminum cone. The modeled anechoic F3 is 30 Hz and the bass performance is outstanding, sounding IMO exactly like you say it won't.
                    Paul

                    Originally posted by Taterworks View Post
                    A few nuggets from the article (which I have here on my lap; I'm a long-time TAS reader):

                    "On balance, I found the SongTower to be an inspired design and integration. So many multiway designs appear to sound like an ill-fitting sonic jigsaw puzzle. By contrast, the SongTower sings with one voice, both on and off axis, almost as cohesively as a full-range driver. As a consequence, this speaker is capable of performing a convincing disappearing act."

                    "...Fidelity of instrumental tembres was excellent, and in particular, female voice was fleshed out with believable harmonic colors."

                    "In my estimation, the Salk Sound SongTower and Ultravalve combo represent the most musical audio dollars you're ever likely to spend during a lifetime of consumption."

                    I left out the couple of criticisms, but they engendered a lack of punch in the bass and a depressed upper bass range. One problem with the ML-TL designs I've heard is that they don't have 'immediacy' in the bass, because like an underdamped reflex system, they take an audible few cycles to reach their steady-state output, while big woofers in a well-damped sealed box (or even some vented alignments that pay extra attention to damping) will reach out of the speaker, grab you by the shirt collar, and demand that you listen to the bass right now, giving that sock-you-in-the-eardrum performance that's so thrilling about a speaker with real low-end muscle. So the criticism of the SongTower's bass being less than engaging is one that I'm not entirely surprised to read.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                      I mean really . . . a pair of 5" woofers is NOT to be expected to have that punch in the bass. I doubt that the intention is to run the Songtower loud enough to engender "punchy" bass. The mids would most assuredly fall apart if someone tried to run them that loud.

                      As you said Paul, you need more woofer to reach that point.
                      R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                      Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                      95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
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                      • #12
                        Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                        Originally posted by Taterworks View Post
                        A few nuggets from the article (which I have here on my lap; I'm a long-time TAS reader):

                        "On balance, I found the SongTower to be an inspired design and integration. So many multiway designs appear to sound like an ill-fitting sonic jigsaw puzzle. By contrast, the SongTower sings with one voice, both on and off axis, almost as cohesively as a full-range driver. As a consequence, this speaker is capable of performing a convincing disappearing act."

                        "...Fidelity of instrumental tembres was excellent, and in particular, female voice was fleshed out with believable harmonic colors."

                        "In my estimation, the Salk Sound SongTower and Ultravalve combo represent the most musical audio dollars you're ever likely to spend during a lifetime of consumption."

                        I left out the couple of criticisms, but they engendered a lack of punch in the bass and a depressed upper bass range. One problem with the ML-TL designs I've heard is that they don't have 'immediacy' in the bass, because like an underdamped reflex system, they take an audible few cycles to reach their steady-state output, while big woofers in a well-damped sealed box (or even some vented alignments that pay extra attention to damping) will reach out of the speaker, grab you by the shirt collar, and demand that you listen to the bass right now, giving that sock-you-in-the-eardrum performance that's so thrilling about a speaker with real low-end muscle. So the criticism of the SongTower's bass being less than engaging is one that I'm not entirely surprised to read.
                        Not sure how you're equating MLTL with "underdamped", if anything, it tends toward overdamped, but that is adjustable. Having listened to several of Jim's MLTL speakers that were designed by Paul I can tell you that the bass impressed me as deeper and cleaner than I had expected it to be, and I don't think it lacked anything in comparison to sealed or standard vented alignments. In fact, I was surprised that it seemed to surpass them in terms of extension and accuracy.

                        Remember, the Songtower is only using two 5" drivers - given the bass output that it has, that is quite impressive for those woofers. I don't think a typical vented alignment could do that.

                        It is also surprising to me that I am posting this :eek:, since I have been skeptical of MLTL's in the past as just another vented box, but I now see that they do, indeed, function a bit differently, and allow some advantages. Martin did a great job on the software, and Paul did as well on the implementation.

                        Having said all of this, I can't agree with you on your analyis of the system after listening to these speakers and some of the other Salk models as well.

                        Jeff B.
                        Last edited by Jeff B.; 08-04-2010, 12:13 PM. Reason: fixed a typo
                        Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

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                        • #13
                          Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                          Originally posted by Jeff B. View Post
                          It is also surprising to me that I am posting this :eek:, since I have been skeptical of MLTL's in the past as just another vented box, but I now see that they do, indeed, function a but differently, and allow some advantages. Martin did a great job on the software, and Paul did as well on the implementation.
                          Thank you Jeff. I have taken a lot of grief on forums and from the web-zines and magazines in the past 9 years over the ML TL label and it being only a tall bass reflex. It is a little different and has some advantages if done correctly. Paul does a nice job in his designs.
                          Martin

                          Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
                          www.quarter-wave.com

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                          • #14
                            Re: Thanks Jeff and Martin

                            I really appreciate the kudos from both of you. I have become pretty good at designing TLs but I always remember to tell myself and others the real credit for my achieving good results must go to Martin. Without his worksheets and their improvements and expansion over the years, I would not have been able to accomplish what I have. Martin made the hammer and I've become good at driving nails with it, so to speak.

                            I so wanted to write a letter to the reviewer at TAS to explain and illustrate why the SongTowers' ML-TL is not just a tall vented system, but I figured my comments would pretty much fall on deaf ears.
                            Paul

                            Originally posted by martin View Post
                            Thank you Jeff. I have taken a lot of grief on forums and from the web-zines and magazines in the past 9 years over the ML TL label and it being only a tall bass reflex. It is a little different and has some advantages if done correctly. Paul does a nice job in his designs.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: High praise for Salk Sound Songtower in the August issue of The Absolute Sound

                              Originally posted by martin View Post
                              Thank you Jeff. I have taken a lot of grief on forums and from the web-zines and magazines in the past 9 years over the ML TL label and it being only a tall bass reflex. It is a little different and has some advantages if done correctly. Paul does a nice job in his designs.
                              Martin,
                              Not sure how anyone could reach the conclusion that an ML TL is a BR. This is electro-acoustics 101.

                              The TS papers, Beranek, etc all show that lumped analysis starts to fall appart if the acoustic structure is large enough relative to wavelength. Then there are the diffreneces in port o/p resonance, enhanced mid range solidity of the box, enhanced mid range clarity due to the stuffing and reduction in back wave etc.

                              IMO MLTL melds some of the best aspects of closed and BR while adding additional tuning felxibility. No brainer!

                              Dave

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