Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

    Ive been using Eminence Designer. While designing a new cab, I can not get the Q to be .707

    The only way I can get the cab to reach that, it is insanely huge. My 4x12's are usually 29.875 x 29.875 with a depth of 14.5 inches. Front baffle being recessed about 2.625 inches. The only way for me to reach my desires Q in this program is to make the height of these like 48" which is absurd. Tried multiple eminence speakers. All the same way. Do I need to try a different program?

  • #2
    Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

    Probably. A brief search should find plenty on info about cab design programs. Might also find that .707 isn't the only way to design a cab.

    Besides it's a guitar cab. most are unbraced five sided boxes. No point worrying about fidelity when one is intentionally overdriving an amp and running through a pedalboard. 4x12 also has pretty bad comb filtering.


    Originally posted by RDK View Post
    Ive been using Eminence Designer. While designing a new cab, I can not get the Q to be .707

    The only way I can get the cab to reach that, it is insanely huge. My 4x12's are usually 29.875 x 29.875 with a depth of 14.5 inches. Front baffle being recessed about 2.625 inches. The only way for me to reach my desires Q in this program is to make the height of these like 48" which is absurd. Tried multiple eminence speakers. All the same way. Do I need to try a different program?
    I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now.
    OS MTMs http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=220388
    Swope TM http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=221818
    Econowave and Audio Nirvana AN10 fullrange http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=216841
    Imperial Russian Stouts http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...=1#post1840444
    LECBOS. http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...ghlight=lecbos

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

      Welcome to Tech talk,
      There are other programs that will model sealed boxes. I use winisd. You can find the latest version on facebook.

      As far as the box size goes the box q is determined by the qts and Vas of the speaker, iirc. So starting with drivers with a lower qts or Vas should allow for a smaller box.

      If you go with a bigger box making it deeper will make a bigger change in the volume of the box because it is the smallest dim.

      All that said q is just one thing to look at in speaker design. If you can give some more detail as to what you want from this design I'm sure that someone can tell you how to get there. (I am not a proaudio guy. So I can only give general answers)

      Duane

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

        Originally posted by duanebro View Post
        Welcome to Tech talk,
        There are other programs that will model sealed boxes. I use winisd. You can find the latest version on facebook.

        As far as the box size goes the box q is determined by the qts and Vas of the speaker, iirc. So starting with drivers with a lower qts or Vas should allow for a smaller box.

        If you go with a bigger box making it deeper will make a bigger change in the volume of the box because it is the smallest dim.

        All that said q is just one thing to look at in speaker design. If you can give some more detail as to what you want from this design I'm sure that someone can tell you how to get there. (I am not a proaudio guy. So I can only give general answers)

        Duane
        Yup.

        If you're shooting for a final Q of 0.707, you can't get there reasonably with a driver whose Qts is 0.65, try lower (or raise your final up more toward 1.0).

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

          Originally posted by RDK View Post
          Do I need to try a different program?
          Guitar cabs are not "designed" using the same ( T/S driven ) goals as a stereo cab.
          "Not a Speaker Designer - Not even on the Internet"
          “Pride is your greatest enemy, humility is your greatest friend.”
          "If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter."

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

            Originally posted by RDK View Post
            Ive been using Eminence Designer. While designing a new cab, I can not get the Q to be .707
            You don't want a Q of .707 with a guitar cab. A Q between 1 and 1.5 is what you'll generally end up with. Guitar cabs aren't supposed to have flat response, and a high Q that usually would indicate a boomy midbass is actually desirable, to offset the peaky break-up mode midrange.
            You'll also get a much better result with a vertically aligned 2x12 than a traditional 4x12, which could serve as the poster child of how not to build a speaker.
            www.billfitzmaurice.com
            www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

              Thanks guys. I was just always taught that a .707 is where I need to be on a 4x12.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

                While the technical criticisms of 4x12 guitar cabs given above are correct from an engineering perspective, there are very good reasons to disregard them if you're a guitar player.

                Guitar cabs help a guitarist create tone. If the tone you're getting out of a cab makes your ears happy, then it's a good cab (and utterly irrespective of any engineering considerations).

                Pick any guitar-oriented rock song you like from the past 40 years -- chances are, the guitar parts were recorded (comb-filtering and all) through a poorly engineered 4x12 cab.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

                  Pick any guitar-oriented rock song you like from the past 40 years -- chances are, the guitar parts were recorded (comb-filtering and all) through a poorly engineered 4x12 cab.
                  While that may have been true during the 60's and early 70's ( FOH support wasn't common practice then ) for live Concert recordings; it is much easier to use a small combo amp to obtain tone without excessive SPL.
                  All the musicians I know have switched to smaller amps, and realize that large "Plexi" stacks and power brakes are impractical and are just used for "Posing"
                  Granted there are music genres that use multiple 4x12 stacks ( very often using 1 real amp and many "fake" amps ) for "the look". Usually with a single mic close-in on 1 bottom speaker; placed this way the direct sound from one driver is what is picked up by the mike and the output from the other driver(s) and floor bounce is not picked up to cause "comb"
                  Last edited by Sydney; 05-24-2012, 09:33 AM. Reason: spl
                  "Not a Speaker Designer - Not even on the Internet"
                  “Pride is your greatest enemy, humility is your greatest friend.”
                  "If the freedom of speech is taken away, then dumb and silent we may be led, like sheep to the slaughter."

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Guitar enclosure not adding up Using eminence designer.

                    Originally posted by 50 watt head View Post
                    Pick any guitar-oriented rock song you like from the past 40 years -- chances are, the guitar parts were recorded (comb-filtering and all) through a poorly engineered 4x12 cab.
                    With a mic stuck in front of the cab for recording the comb-filtering in the highs and halved midrange dispersion angle compared to a single twelve or a vertical pair is of no consequence. For live use knowledgeable players might give those issues some thought.
                    www.billfitzmaurice.com
                    www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

                    Comment

                    Working...
                    X