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  • #46
    Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

    Originally posted by RcDuck View Post
    Don't know if you know this or not (forgive me if I am pointing out the obvious) but you need to sharpen or purchase a pre-sharpened veneer saw.
    Yes. This is a very important point. I sharpened mine myself, following the instructions @ Joe Woodworker.
    Bryan K.

    Midwest Audio Club

    Speedster | Sub Attachť | The Wildeman | Sean's NLA Towers | CO‹GAR, COUGAR II and CO‹GAR JR | Triton | Lithium | J-Boom | Trym MLTL | Docere MLTL

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    • #47
      Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

      Originally posted by fastbike1 View Post
      I'm sure Bryan has his reasons, but doing the flush trim w/ a veneer saw in lieu of the router is not faster or better. The veneer saw is really best at trimming veneer to splice pieces for a wider area or to fit a pattern.
      I'm too paranoid to use my router and honestly that's my reason. Even when I use masking tape, my heavy hand drives the bearing into the veneer and makes grooves. Then I have to spend more time sanding and swearing.

      I'd love to see a video of the proper technique for flush-trimming veneer on a speaker cabinet. IMO, the saw is indeed easier. Well, at least for me it is.
      Bryan K.

      Midwest Audio Club

      Speedster | Sub Attachť | The Wildeman | Sean's NLA Towers | CO‹GAR, COUGAR II and CO‹GAR JR | Triton | Lithium | J-Boom | Trym MLTL | Docere MLTL

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

        It's a mistake to place excessive pressure onto a power tool like a drill or router. My family owns a hardware store and we get drills back and I can tell if the customer knows how to operate a drill properly by how the bit wears. They will actually place so much pressure that the bit's edge will bend/wear towards the chuck when under normal conditions the bit will wear/unsharpen in the OPPOSITE direction. In the process they usually also damage/bend the drill's axle.

        Owhh and take out the bearings as well duh!

        Let the tool do the work friend!

        PS problem is once you bend the edge of the bit/router bit you then HAVE TO put this pressure on it for it to bite from that point forward... You need to get new bits or have them sharped for you after doing this and damaging the edge on them.

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        • #49
          Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

          Originally posted by bkeane1259 View Post
          I'm too paranoid to use my router and honestly that's my reason. Even when I use masking tape, my heavy hand drives the bearing into the veneer and makes grooves. Then I have to spend more time sanding and swearing.

          I'd love to see a video of the proper technique for flush-trimming veneer on a speaker cabinet. IMO, the saw is indeed easier. Well, at least for me it is.
          Yeah be very careful. IMHO the only power tool more dangerous than a router is a compound mitre saw.

          Dealing with contractors I personally know a handful that have lost digits due to a compound mitre man!

          BE SAFE

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          • #50
            Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

            I'm curious about who gets so hurt so often on a CMS, generally the safest tool in the shed.

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            • #51
              Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

              Originally posted by ROTECH View Post
              I'm curious about who gets so hurt so often on a CMS, generally the safest tool in the shed.

              I'm pretty sure I could screw something up with one. Seriously, though......my Dremel rotary tool is a dangerous little bugger. I was cutting a metal screw with one of the standard cut-off wheels and the damned wheel shattered and shrapnel went everywhere, including a hot shard smack dab on my right eyelid!! No joke. It was red hot and burned like a mother-fukker and the only thing that kept it from embedding in my actual eye was my involuntary eye-closing reflex, courtesy of my brain. I fear that little bastard now, but I did buy safety glasses after that. ;)
              Bryan K.

              Midwest Audio Club

              Speedster | Sub Attachť | The Wildeman | Sean's NLA Towers | CO‹GAR, COUGAR II and CO‹GAR JR | Triton | Lithium | J-Boom | Trym MLTL | Docere MLTL

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                Originally posted by ROTECH View Post
                I'm curious about who gets so hurt so often on a CMS, generally the safest tool in the shed.
                I like the home shows where people push the wood through the table saw with their fingers. Guess they never attended a basic shop class lol

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                • #53
                  Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                  I totally disagree and like I said I personally know 5 contractors off the top of my head missing part of a finger they cut with the CMS.

                  As a retailer and not a contractor I don't know why this power tool seems to cause more digit loss LOL

                  Perhaps smooth linear bearing action and quick cut time due to larger diameter blade?

                  I dunno...

                  Owhh wait I do!

                  They don't lock the miter index down and slip, the blade guard always breaks and they don't fix it, and the clutch/break goes and they keep using it. (VERY COMMON)

                  I don't know the stats but I'd place money on the CMS as the powertool causing the most injuries in a DIY setting but it's prob a table saw that's #1.

                  PS some models IMHO are dangerously designed though recent years they are all pretty good and safer these days

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                  • #54
                    Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                    Originally posted by ROTECH View Post
                    I'm curious about who gets so hurt so often on a CMS, generally the safest tool in the shed.


                    Actually now that I think of it I believe they mostly said radial arm saw. You don't see these much anymore due to how good the CMS have become with sliding "dual compound miter saw". This is the type I'm thinking to when I say CMS.

                    Heck they are ALL DANGEROUS but with a little common sense, education and precaution they are safe.

                    Come to think of it all of those guys with missing fingers are yahoos...

                    LOL

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                    • #55
                      Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                      Make sure you sharpened it completely. The teeth need to come to a very fine point. Look for shiny spots on the tips of the teeth and also for burrs on the flat side. Both contribute to ragged cuts.

                      Also, use a very light touch, "Herc". Let the saw do the work! Just push it forward and pull it backward. Only enough downward pressure to keep it on the wood. Rapidity is the key to speedy cuts, not muscle!

                      I still prefer a knife for much cross grain work. I save the saw for mostly with the grain, where the knife tends to wander. Some veneers respond better to one or the other on any given day so weigh my preference accordingly.

                      I also like the 60 degree or french style teeth much better (they are shaped much like the "mountains" that Joe depicts). The "ramps" style (similar to the old 90 deg. english pattern but more forward rake) are a little too agressive for my taste. But they do cut faster with the grain than the other shapes.


                      Originally posted by bkeane1259 View Post
                      I'm too paranoid to use my router and honestly that's my reason. Even when I use masking tape, my heavy hand drives the bearing into the veneer and makes grooves. Then I have to spend more time sanding and swearing.

                      I'd love to see a video of the proper technique for flush-trimming veneer on a speaker cabinet. IMO, the saw is indeed easier. Well, at least for me it is.
                      ~99%
                      Make me an angel that flies from Montgomery
                      Make me a poster of an old rodeo
                      Just give me one thing that I can hold on to
                      To believe in this livin' is just a hard way to go

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                        Good stuff Bob, thanks.

                        Originally posted by bobbarkto View Post
                        Also, use a very light touch, "Herc". Let the saw do the work! Just push it forward and pull it backward. Only enough downward pressure to keep it on the wood. Rapidity is the key to speedy cuts, not muscle!
                        I'm pretty sure this was the reason for any of my jagged edges. Like my heavy hand, my heavy (lead) foot can also get me into trouble at times.

                        Correct me if I'm wrong though......You should only apply downward pressure on the pull stroke with the veneer saw, right? I didn't saw in both directions. After the pullback stroke, I picked up the saw and placed it back to the beginning of the cut.



                        I still prefer a knife for much cross grain work. I save the saw for mostly with the grain, where the knife tends to wander. Some veneers respond better to one or the other on any given day so weigh my preference accordingly.
                        I have indeed noticed this with the veneer saw. It's slices thru "with grain" cuts like butter. Cross cuts require many more "strokes." What sort of knife do you recommend for cross cut trimming?
                        Bryan K.

                        Midwest Audio Club

                        Speedster | Sub Attachť | The Wildeman | Sean's NLA Towers | CO‹GAR, COUGAR II and CO‹GAR JR | Triton | Lithium | J-Boom | Trym MLTL | Docere MLTL

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                          With Joes saw, forward cuts (if his depiction is accurate).
                          But it might be unpleasant cross cutting due to the extreme angle of the teeth, so a pull stroke might "feel" right to you. This would also explain the slower cutting.
                          The 60 degree teeth cut equally, either way, speed of cut is moderate both cross cut and rip.

                          Anything sharp, really. Exacto knives work, so do the snap off disposable box cutters.
                          I tune them on a stone a little. Basically polish them and relieve the back of the tip a little.
                          I made a knife that I lost somewhere... I liked it best.



                          Originally posted by bkeane1259 View Post
                          Good stuff Bob, thanks.



                          I'm pretty sure this was the reason for any of my jagged edges. Like my heavy hand, my heavy (lead) foot can also get me into trouble at times.

                          Correct me if I'm wrong though......You should only apply downward pressure on the pull stroke with the veneer saw, right? I didn't saw in both directions. After the pullback stroke, I picked up the saw and placed it back to the beginning of the cut.




                          I have indeed noticed this with the veneer saw. It's slices thru "with grain" cuts like butter. Cross cuts required many more "strokes." What sort of knife do you recommend for cross cut trimming?
                          ~99%
                          Make me an angel that flies from Montgomery
                          Make me a poster of an old rodeo
                          Just give me one thing that I can hold on to
                          To believe in this livin' is just a hard way to go

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                            Originally posted by bobbarkto View Post
                            With Joes saw, forward cuts (if his depiction is accurate).
                            But it might be unpleasant cross cutting due to the extreme angle of the teeth, so a pull stroke might "feel" right to you.
                            Please correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm starting to think I sniffed too much lacquer earlier.

                            I have THIS SAW.

                            This is what Joe says: "The saw is designed to cut on the pull stroke only. Start in front of the veneer so the blade is already in motion when it comes in contact with the veneer. Place adequate pressure downward on saw and be certain to keep it pressed against the straight-edge. It typically takes 4 to 7 passes with most species to cut through a veneer. Keep the saw moving past the veneer so the ends are cut cleanly."

                            http://www.joewoodworker.com/veneering/seams.htm

                            Click image for larger version

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                            Bryan K.

                            Midwest Audio Club

                            Speedster | Sub Attachť | The Wildeman | Sean's NLA Towers | CO‹GAR, COUGAR II and CO‹GAR JR | Triton | Lithium | J-Boom | Trym MLTL | Docere MLTL

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                              Ok.
                              Not too much lacquer, then.
                              I was going by the image he has on the site, that blade is shpaed to cut on the push stroke.
                              I can see why one would want to pull it though, as I mentioned it would be quite agressive otherwise.


                              Originally posted by bkeane1259 View Post
                              Please correct me if I'm wrong, because I'm starting to think I sniffed too much lacquer earlier.

                              I have THIS SAW.

                              This is what Joe says: "The saw is designed to cut on the pull stroke only. Start in front of the veneer so the blade is already in motion when it comes in contact with the veneer. Place adequate pressure downward on saw and be certain to keep it pressed against the straight-edge. It typically takes 4 to 7 passes with most species to cut through a veneer. Keep the saw moving past the veneer so the ends are cut cleanly."

                              http://www.joewoodworker.com/veneering/seams.htm

                              [ATTACH=CONFIG]30225[/ATTACH]
                              ~99%
                              Make me an angel that flies from Montgomery
                              Make me a poster of an old rodeo
                              Just give me one thing that I can hold on to
                              To believe in this livin' is just a hard way to go

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Jeff B's CSS Triton High Resolution Monitor - build thread

                                Are you using the lacquer as an MDF sealant?

                                I know some people that work in production and they turned me onto this glue that they use for set building with MDF.

                                http://www.smithandcompany.org

                                The MultiWoodPrime is amazing stuff to seal MDF and burnish for piano finish.

                                Steve Smith's glue is also unmatched for gluing MDF together and why those Hollywood people use it right!

                                I also know a lot of luthiers use it in instrument production.

                                I've seen PIANO finish dude with CPES burnished MDF in about a tenth the time it takes using traditional methods.

                                It's really amazing stuff!

                                The set builder guys use the Tropical Hardwood Epoxy because they can use hot air guns to rip down sets easily and even reuse the mdf right!

                                http://www.star-distributing.com/smith/differences.html

                                CPES is now called MultiWoodPrime if any of you are looking for it to use as MDF sealant.

                                In my short time doing DIY and working with MDF that primer and glue is HANDS DOWN THE BEST adhesive and primer I've ever used.

                                AMAZING STUFF

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