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The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

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  • The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

    So, I'd like to present the forum with my second design - The Mariposas. These were conceptualized to be an ultra small, computer speaker set for my daughter. Her favorite movie is Barbie Mariposa and her favorite insect is a butterfly, so it just fits.

    When I finished the design, I spent a little time moving them around into different spaces, and they seem to work just about everywhere. In addition to computer monitors, I could see these being used as bookshelf speakers, surround speakers, or even built-in to a soundbar type thing for TV audio.

    The concept behind the design was to start with something simple and small (the PE "Micro" knock-down cabinets) and stuff them with the largest and most inexpensive speakers that would fit. So, being curious about the $6 HiWave speaker and noting that it would fit (just barely), I decided to go for it. Just note that the price of these HiWave's have been upped to almost $10 now.

    The tweet would have to be something that would fit in the leftover space, which really isn't much. The ND16FA fit the bill, and it fit.

    Being honest, I didn't actually buy the PE cabinets - I just copied the design and size and made it from some leftover 1/2" MDF that I had laying around. You can't really imagine just how small these things are without actually holding them in your hand. They're tiny cabinets, but it works for the intended usage (computer speakers).

    I'm not going into much detail about how to build these cabinets. To be honest, it's probably well worth anyone's time to just buy the cabinets from PE and build them. I will, however, detail the baffle:
    • The tweeter is a 1.25" hole that's centered 1.25" from each corner. Note that the tweeters are offset, so make sure to build one speaker with the tweet on the left, and one speaker with it on the right.
    • The woofer is centered on the baffle (2.25" from each side, and located 2.625" from the bottom edge). That's 2 5/8" in case you're wondering.
    • The woofer flange is 4.25" by 3/16" deep. The cutout hole is 3.25".
    • The woofer needs to have the back of the baffle chamferred around the screw holes in order to allow for better airflow around the back of the woofer. See the pic for details.


    The enclosure is completely sealed, and I placed in 5 large handfulls of ploy-fill (acousti-stuff should work as well). Basically, this is about 2 ounces of poly-fill, and it's stuffed to the max. In fact, the poly will actually push the woofer out if you don't have the screws holding it in. So, stuff it until it's full, and then add about twice as much again.

    Here's how the speakers look in their "unfinished" state:

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    Last edited by tyger23; 12-25-2014, 01:54 AM.
    DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
    The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
    The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
    The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
    AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

  • #2
    Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

    Again, I had conceptualized these to be small, affordable computer monitors. With that in mind, I took the FRD and tuned them in this environment:

    Click image for larger version

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    Basically, I set up the speakers flanking a 15" laptop. This tuning turned out surprisingly well, because the speakers worked as bookshelf speakers placed slap up against the wall, or as free-standing speakers (more on that later). Essentially, these guys just work well in most environments.

    I will note one word of caution - when flanking a computer monitor or laptop, make sure the tweeters are on the OUTSIDE of the computer. For some reason, this made a tremendous difference in the phasing, and the tuning turned out much better this way.

    Since this is a low-cost build, I wanted to keep with a low-cost crossover. So, there's just 5 parts total!

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    It's ultra-simple, very small, and very cheap. I used NPE caps for this build mostly because I don't think the drivers deserve anything better than that. They're crossing over around 3K. It's tough to really nail down an exact crossover point because of the way the HiWave's dip at 2K affects it's frequency response. However, there's a decent reverse null occurring around 3K when you reverse the tweet. Here's how the individual driver response looks:

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    In the above environment (flanking the comptuer), the response turns out quite well. Here's the response curve at 0deg, 30deg, and 45deg:

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    And here's the distortion curve in the nominal listening environment:

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    Last edited by tyger23; 09-17-2013, 08:39 AM.
    DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
    The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
    The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
    The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
    AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

      Now, as I mentioned above, I also tried them out in different environments and they seem to be a butterfly of sorts. They can fly around and land just about anywhere and sound pretty once they lite.

      Here's the frequency response of the Mariposas when up on a stand in the middle of the room. These measurements were taken in a more normal method (at 1M and 1W). The graph shows a 0, 15, 30, and 45 degree response. It's pretty darn'd flat up until you get to around 45 degrees.

      Click image for larger version

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      Here's the associated distortion curve when on a stand (not much change from the flanked environment):

      Click image for larger version

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      For anyone who's wondering, the sensitivity of these measured at 81dB. They'll take just about anything you want to throw at them power wise. I was using a class-AB 20W amp, and the amp was giving out before these were. I do think these would be a perfect match for a little Lepai amp in the computing environment, but they can take more.

      I hope anyone who tries these enjoys them! They're certainly not up to the snuff that my Aria's can accomplish, but these are about 1/3 the cost. The current cost for these designs (including the cabinets) is $77.90.

      The overall sound is pretty mellow, but it has a very detailed top end and quite a bit of punch around 100hz. I'm actually really impressed by that ND16FA. The HiWave is OK. It's got great off-axis response (as advertised), but that suck-out at 2K is problematic, and the paper cone just isn't as detailed as a RS series (obviously). I enjoy them, and I think they'd be better than most any computer speaker you can purchase for the same money! Add a little sub, and these are amazing.
      DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
      The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
      The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
      The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
      AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

        Here's the PE cart, just in case anyone wants to know:

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        Last edited by tyger23; 09-17-2013, 08:40 AM.
        DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
        The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
        The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
        The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
        AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

          Very nice little project. Thanks for sharing.
          Don't worry, if your parachute fails, you have the rest of your life to fix it.

          If we all did the things we are capable of doing, we would literally ASTOUND ourselves - Thomas A. Edison

          Some people collect stamps, Imelda Marcos collected shoes. I collect speakers.:D

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

            nice Ty. Your little girl should love them.
            " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

            Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
            Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

            http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
            http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

              Is that 5 microphones in the pictures that you're taking measurements in???

              रेतुर्न तो थे स्रोत
              return to the source
              leviathan system thread
              deadhorse thread
              shockwave build thread

              instagram :: greywarden_13

              in war, victory . . . in peace, vigilance . . . in death, sacrifice.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                Awesome job, Tyger!
                Don't listen to me - I have not sold any $150,000 speakers.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                  I heard the Arias at Lone Star and had a pair of Vifa XT25 and went out and bought the Dayton Reference 150 - 4 ohms. Nice to have a budget crossover to go with budget speakers. Maybe I will get a chance to hear them at this year's Lone Star?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                    Originally posted by greywarden View Post
                    Is that 5 microphones in the pictures that you're taking measurements in???
                    Yep - but only the center one (silver) was used for this project. The silver mic is my personal Omnimic setup. The four black mics (Beyerdynamic MM1's) are the work setup. Believe it or not, many of the computers you use in your day-to-day life were "tuned" on that table with those 4 black mics.
                    DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
                    The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
                    The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
                    The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
                    AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                      Originally posted by billcurrier View Post
                      I heard the Arias at Lone Star and had a pair of Vifa XT25 and went out and bought the Dayton Reference 150 - 4 ohms. Nice to have a budget crossover to go with budget speakers. Maybe I will get a chance to hear them at this year's Lone Star?
                      Perhaps ;). I'm still hoping to pull together a Texas DIY event sometime this spring, so we'll have to see where they make their debut.

                      Did you ever get around to building the Aria's? Let me know what you think if you did, or if you just have any questions!
                      DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
                      The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
                      The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
                      The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
                      AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                        Very interesting. Naming your ultra-small speakers as Marisosas, this reminds me
                        of Mariposa Grove, Yosemite National Park as I just came back visiting that place.

                        http://www.sunset.com/travel/outdoor...984/page6.html

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                          Originally posted by tyger23 View Post
                          Perhaps ;). I'm still hoping to pull together a Texas DIY event sometime this spring, so we'll have to see where they make their debut.

                          Did you ever get around to building the Aria's? Let me know what you think if you did, or if you just have any questions!
                          Thanks, I just bought the RS150-4 in the last two weeks. The Vifa XT25's are in Arkansas and the Dayton RS are in New Mexico. Will probably be my Spring Break project.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                            Originally posted by billcurrier View Post
                            Thanks, I just bought the RS150-4 in the last two weeks. The Vifa XT25's are in Arkansas and the Dayton RS are in New Mexico. Will probably be my Spring Break project.
                            That seems geographically challenging. Let me know how it goes and if I can help out at all!
                            DARPA Jr - 2015 InDIYana Winner - RS180-8 + RS100P-8 + ND25FA
                            The Aria's - RS150-4 (or RS150-8) + XT25SC90
                            The Mariposa's - TEBM65C20F-8 + ND16FA
                            The Canzonetta's - RS100P-8 and ND16FA
                            AudioSource AMP-100 Mods OR Pyle PAMP1000 Mods

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: The Mariposas - An ultra small, extremely versatile 2-way (ND16FA + HIBM65C20-8)

                              These look very interesting... I need to find a place where I can make sawdust...
                              My Statement monitors
                              My Piccolatas
                              My LM3886 amp

                              Comment

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