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Summer Vacation III: Next phase

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  • #31
    Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

    New Day, new measurements. BTW, if you use a 30uf to protect the tweeter, take it out when you measure the other drivers!
    Anyway,
    Attached Files
    " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

    Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
    Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

    http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
    http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

      Here's a question, which impedance chart can one take as true? Why does the summed chart not reflect the changes in the tweeter chart?
      Attached Files
      " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

      Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
      Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

      http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
      http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

        Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
        Here's a question, which impedance chart can one take as true? Why does the summed chart not reflect the changes in the tweeter chart?
        Actually it looks as if it does. In both graphs the tweeters impedance drops below 6 ohms at 1k, bottoms out at 2.5k and ends at 5 ohms at the 20k point. Both graphs reflect that (to me at least).

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

          I see 2 ohms on the summed, don't you? Am I missing something here?
          " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

          Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
          Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

          http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
          http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

            Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
            I see 2 ohms on the summed, don't you? Am I missing something here?
            No, it looks like 2 ohms to me too.
            Kenny

            http://www.diy-ny.com/
            DIY NY/NJ 2014 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGwA...ature=youtu.be
            Man does not live by measurements alone, a little music helps.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

              I think the turquoise line indicates the compensation its just not reflected in the summed.
              " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

              Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
              Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

              http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
              http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
                I think the turquoise line indicates the compensation its just not reflected in the summed.
                Turquoise is the line BEFORE the xover is applied, but after the compensation. The red line is everything. You'll see the red line in the system impedance looks the same as in the tweeter pane.

                System and tweeter both dip to 2 ohms.

                Later,
                Wolf
                "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                *InDIYana event website*

                Photobucket pages:
                http://photobucket.com/Wolf-Speakers_and_more

                My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
                http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                  Originally posted by Wolf View Post
                  System and tweeter both dip to 2 ohms.
                  This was what I was trying to say...poorly worded on my part. Sorry Lowell.

                  M.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                    That's ok Marty, I'm still a bit confused. As I add resistance, the turquoise line goes up but I should ignore this and only believe the red line that stayed in place.
                    This would be a great time for Jeff Bagby to drop in.
                    " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

                    Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
                    Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

                    http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
                    http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      John H

                      Synergy Horn, SLS-85, BMR-3L, Mini-TL, BR-2, Titan OB, B452, Udique, Vultus, Latus1, Seriatim, Aperivox,Pencil Tower

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                        Originally posted by jhollander View Post
                        Not sure what to use that information for so I turn it off.
                        I use the impedance comp curve in the driver pane to tweak the values of RLC circuits.
                        Craig

                        The lowest possible F3 box alignment is not always the best alignment.

                        Designing and building speaker projects are like playing with adult Lego Blocks for me.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                          Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
                          That's ok Marty, I'm still a bit confused. As I add resistance, the turquoise line goes up but I should ignore this and only believe the red line that stayed in place.
                          This would be a great time for Jeff Bagby to drop in.
                          What do you want me to chime in about? Wolf already explained things. Your crossover is causing your tweeter impedance to drop to two ohms, that's reflected in both the red line in the tweeter impedance plot and your final summed impedance. This drop is caused by the Q of the high pass circuit you are using. It must have some peaking near the crossover point. I would recommend changing the high pass circuit to raise the impedance.
                          Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                            Originally posted by Jeff B. View Post
                            What do you want me to chime in about? Wolf already explained things. Your crossover is causing your tweeter impedance to drop to two ohms, that's reflected in both the red line in the tweeter impedance plot and your final summed impedance. This drop is caused by the Q of the high pass circuit you are using. It must have some peaking near the crossover point. I would recommend changing the high pass circuit to raise the impedance.
                            Thank you for your gentle reply. Does anybody else know what the turquoise line is for? Should it just be turned off as if it is no use at all? Is there an good time to recognize it?
                            " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

                            Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
                            Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

                            http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
                            http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                              Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
                              Thank you for your gentle reply. Does anybody else know what the turquoise line is for? Should it just be turned off as if it is no use at all? Is there an good time to recognize it?
                              My understanding of the electrical phase requirements is weak, but I'll repeat what I've been told on this forum at some point. That line is the electrical phase, and optimally you'd want an impossible flat line to make it easy to drive for the amplifier. However, just trying to minimize the shifts and keeping it from +/- 30 should be enough. I normally don't worry about it too much unless some wild swing occurs. You have something close to that between 2 and 4 khz in my opinion, but its nothing too insane.
                              Audio: Media PC -> Sabre ESS 9023 DAC -> Behringer EP2500 -> (insert speakers of the moment)
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                              • #45
                                Re: Summer Vacation III: Next phase

                                Originally posted by arlis_1957@yahoo.com View Post
                                Thank you for your gentle reply. Does anybody else know what the turquoise line is for? Should it just be turned off as if it is no use at all? Is there an good time to recognize it?
                                That's the "tweeter + compensation" line. It is an intermediate step showing the effects on the impedance of any Zobels, L-pads, series resistors, shunt circuits, etc. It is sometimes useful in helping adjust the impedance before applying the high pass circuit.
                                Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

                                Comment

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