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  • Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

    Hi all.

    Having built a Swope 2.1 system that I'm really satisfied with musically I still wonder about the lowest frequencies in my sub. I used the Yung SD300 unboosted and I can't hear that it reaches anywhere near 20 Hz, more like 30-35.

    I know there is some kind of subsonic filter there, because when I run 20 Hz through the sub the driver barely moves at all.

    I asked about the subsonic (HP) filter in one of my other threads, but this thread is only about the Yung SD300 subsonic filter. Does anyone know which frequencies are cut off in the bottom? And if there is a way to change it to get a little lower end? Can't seem to find the info.

    Thanks
    __________________________________________________ ________
    Thank God the World is bigger than my view of it.

  • #2
    Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

    Originally posted by pastorola View Post
    Hi all.

    Having built a Swope 2.1 system that I'm really satisfied with musically I still wonder about the lowest frequencies in my sub. I used the Yung SD300 unboosted and I can't hear that it reaches anywhere near 20 Hz, more like 30-35.

    I know there is some kind of subsonic filter there, because when I run 20 Hz through the sub the driver barely moves at all.

    I asked about the subsonic (HP) filter in one of my other threads, but this thread is only about the Yung SD300 subsonic filter. Does anyone know which frequencies are cut off in the bottom? And if there is a way to change it to get a little lower end? Can't seem to find the info.

    Thanks
    There's a lot of conflicting information out there about the filters in the Yung amps, so we we contacted Yung when I designed the "Baby Boomer" subwoofer kit. According to them the high pass filter in the SD300 is set to 30 Hz.

    Jeff B.
    Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

      From an HTShack thread located here:

      http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...amplifers.html

      /******
      A rep from PE (Mike V.) had this to say about the Yung amps...

      "Sorry I'm late to the party on this. The Yung SD Series plate amplifiers are flat to 30 Hz, -1.5 dB @ 22.5 Hz, and -3 dB @ 21 Hz. I have no information on modifying this filter and strongly discourage it as Yung has designed the amplifiers to perform to high standards with the filter in place as-is"
      /*****((

      There's a thread either on htshack or diyaudio that shows exactly how to modify the filter frequency. I'm not sure why Yung says the filter Fc is 30Hz as filter frequencies are defined at the 3dB point in which case this would be a 21Hz filter.
      Nichikuros - Peerless 831735 Nomex + Vifa NE25VTA
      Digger8 - Small compact 8" sub with F3 = 20Hz
      Madison-D and Madison-R - Tang Band W4-1720 + Vifa BC25SC06 or Beston RT003C (TM and MTM)
      Jeffrey - Tang Band W5-704D + Beston RT003C
      Jasmine - Fountek FW146 + Fountek NeoCD3.0 Ribbon in Pioneer BS21 Cabinet

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

        Originally posted by jsr View Post
        From an HTShack thread located here:

        http://www.hometheatershack.com/foru...amplifers.html

        /******
        A rep from PE (Mike V.) had this to say about the Yung amps...

        "Sorry I'm late to the party on this. The Yung SD Series plate amplifiers are flat to 30 Hz, -1.5 dB @ 22.5 Hz, and -3 dB @ 21 Hz. I have no information on modifying this filter and strongly discourage it as Yung has designed the amplifiers to perform to high standards with the filter in place as-is"
        /*****((

        There's a thread either on htshack or diyaudio that shows exactly how to modify the filter frequency. I'm not sure why Yung says the filter Fc is 30Hz as filter frequencies are defined at the 3dB point in which case this would be a 21Hz filter.
        That's what I mean by conflicting information. I am perfectly aware of Mike V's post, unfortunately, it must come from old information or incorrect information, but it doesn't match the amplifier's response curve. What I stated above is correct, the Yung amp has a 30 Hz high pass filter. It measures to be 30 Hz and the values on the board match 30 Hz. We talked with an engineer from Yung who confirmed this to us as well.
        Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

          Ah ok. That's a weird choice for a sub amp.
          Nichikuros - Peerless 831735 Nomex + Vifa NE25VTA
          Digger8 - Small compact 8" sub with F3 = 20Hz
          Madison-D and Madison-R - Tang Band W4-1720 + Vifa BC25SC06 or Beston RT003C (TM and MTM)
          Jeffrey - Tang Band W5-704D + Beston RT003C
          Jasmine - Fountek FW146 + Fountek NeoCD3.0 Ribbon in Pioneer BS21 Cabinet

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

            Hi Jeff,

            So does that mean -3db at 30hz or it's flat to 30?
            Any idea of the slope, I'd assume it's first order?

            Originally posted by Jeff B. View Post
            That's what I mean by conflicting information. I am perfectly aware of Mike V's post, unfortunately, it must come from old information or incorrect information, but it doesn't match the amplifier's response curve. What I stated above is correct, the Yung amp has a 30 Hz high pass filter. It measures to be 30 Hz and the values on the board match 30 Hz. We talked with an engineer from Yung who confirmed this to us as well.
            ~99%
            Make me an angel that flies from Montgomery
            Make me a poster of an old rodeo
            Just give me one thing that I can hold on to
            To believe in this livin' is just a hard way to go

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

              Originally posted by bobbarkto View Post
              Hi Jeff,

              So does that mean -3db at 30hz or it's flat to 30?
              Any idea of the slope, I'd assume it's first order?
              If I remember correctly the standard filter has a Q of 1.0 , so it is fairly flat to 30Hz and rolls off second order below that. The +6 dB version is the same except with a Q of 2.0. This gives it a peak of 6 dB at 30 Hz, so it over-shoots into the the mid-20's and then it rolls off second order as well.
              Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                Originally posted by pastorola View Post
                Hi all.



                I know there is some kind of subsonic filter there, because when I run 20 Hz through the sub the driver barely moves at all.
                The cone will move less at the tuning frequency if it is a ported sub. Not sure what your sub is tuned to or if it is even ported.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                  Thanks, Jeff!

                  Originally posted by Jeff B. View Post
                  If I remember correctly the standard filter has a Q of 1.0 , so it is fairly flat to 30Hz and rolls off second order below that. The +6 dB version is the same except with a Q of 2.0. This gives it a peak of 6 dB at 30 Hz, so it over-shoots into the the mid-20's and then it rolls off second order as well.
                  ~99%
                  Make me an angel that flies from Montgomery
                  Make me a poster of an old rodeo
                  Just give me one thing that I can hold on to
                  To believe in this livin' is just a hard way to go

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                    Originally posted by Jeff B. View Post
                    There's a lot of conflicting information out there about the filters in the Yung amps, so we we contacted Yung when I designed the "Baby Boomer" subwoofer kit. According to them the high pass filter in the SD300 is set to 30 Hz.

                    Jeff B.
                    Thank you for that info. I trust you know your stuff.

                    However that really disappoints me. I'm building a sub that goes more or less flat down to 20 Hz and then my amp cuts off at 30! Really disappointed in the info, neither Parts Express or the amp spec sheet available at PE says NOTHING about that. I mean, isn't a 30Hz rolloff relevant information to give to the customer? I have had this thing shipped over the Atlantic, paying shipping fee, 25% VAT plus customs fees and then I get this...?

                    I'm not angry, just really disappointed. How can a dealer to the DIY commuity withhold crucial info like this?
                    __________________________________________________ ________
                    Thank God the World is bigger than my view of it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                      Originally posted by pastorola View Post
                      I'm not angry, just really disappointed. How can a dealer to the DIY commuity withhold crucial info like this?
                      You're not alone. I have the unboosted Yung 500 and it's the same, a HPF where none is mentioned either in Yung's literature or the PE product page, despite it being a VERY well known fact. PE really dropped the ball on this one.

                      I bought the amp to power a sub setup that's designed to run well into the teens (LMS-R 12 and two PRs) and this amp will cut its output almost a whole octave higher. "Sub" bass doesn't even start until 30Hz... How can you sell a "sub" amp that doesn't even go there?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                        your amp wont cut off at 30hz, it will roll off at 12db/octave below 30 hz. Also, I'm not so sure you're sub response will be the same as the hivi. give me the sub dimensions and I will run a quick sim. when I looked at a rss265 in pauls box it didn't give the response that Paul quotes.


                        Originally posted by pastorola View Post
                        Thank you for that info. I trust you know your stuff.

                        However that really disappoints me. I'm building a sub that goes more or less flat down to 20 Hz and then my amp cuts off at 30! Really disappointed in the info, neither Parts Express or the amp spec sheet available at PE says NOTHING about that. I mean, isn't a 30Hz rolloff relevant information to give to the customer? I have had this thing shipped over the Atlantic, paying shipping fee, 25% VAT plus customs fees and then I get this...?

                        I'm not angry, just really disappointed. How can a dealer to the DIY commuity withhold crucial info like this?
                        I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now.
                        OS MTMs http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=220388
                        Swope TM http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=221818
                        Econowave and Audio Nirvana AN10 fullrange http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=216841
                        Imperial Russian Stouts http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...=1#post1840444
                        LECBOS. http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...ghlight=lecbos

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                          Originally posted by fastbike1 View Post
                          your amp wont cut off at 30hz, it will roll off at 12db/octave below 30 hz. Also, I'm not so sure you're sub response will be the same as the hivi. give me the sub dimensions and I will run a quick sim. when I looked at a rss265 in pauls box it didn't give the response that Paul quotes.
                          You've had patience with me and I appreciate that. The cabinet internal volume is 42 litres before subtracting port, double baffle, brace, partial double bottom, driver and amp. I would say maybe 37 litres or so. Port is 3"x25".

                          It may not be cutting, but the sub barely does anything below 30 Hz. And I'm pretty sure it's not over excursion that's the problem, because the driver barely moves at all when fed with freq below 30. It sounds, but more like a clipped, silent sound, and as I said barely any cone excursion at all.

                          It's so frustrating. The sub almost tells me to feed it with some serious bass because +30 peformace is really satisfying. And suddenly, when passing the 30 mark it just stops and dies.

                          But regardless of my sub's performance below 30, I think it's really bad not to tell the customers that a 300W sub amp has a 30 Hz highpass. Won't you agree? It's like not telling the customer that the brand new 300bhp car has a limiting circuit that won't allow you to go beyond 55 mph...
                          __________________________________________________ ________
                          Thank God the World is bigger than my view of it.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                            Originally posted by killa View Post
                            The cone will move less at the tuning frequency if it is a ported sub. Not sure what your sub is tuned to or if it is even ported.
                            Built to Paul Carmody's specs for the Swope sub. 3"x25" port, gives a tuning slightly below 25 Hz right?
                            __________________________________________________ ________
                            Thank God the World is bigger than my view of it.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Yung SD300 subsonic filter?

                              based on 37l net and 3x25, your box is tuned to21.9hz. your tuning droops from 100 hz to a knee at 21.9 for an f3 of 40hz. your f6 is 30 hz w/ the high pass. it is definitely killing your low end. if you can shorten the port to 17 it will drop the f3/f6 to 30.8/25.9. better but not what you expected. I would be mad as well. PE should be posting this data.

                              Originally posted by pastorola View Post
                              Built to Paul Carmody's specs for the Swope sub. 3"x25" port, gives a tuning slightly below 25 Hz right?
                              I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now.
                              OS MTMs http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=220388
                              Swope TM http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=221818
                              Econowave and Audio Nirvana AN10 fullrange http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=216841
                              Imperial Russian Stouts http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...=1#post1840444
                              LECBOS. http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...ghlight=lecbos

                              Comment

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