Slightly OT: Why I Won't Be DIYing Anytime Soon

[severius]

I was just notified by the dealer of my car repair bill: $1550. Part failure at on 60,000 miles, and probably my fault on the other problem.

The car's a late 90s GM. This's the last American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or have spoken with goes thru nothing like this. It's appauling.

With that in mind, I was going to treat myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might not actually build a project right away, but I actually find great drivers to be objects de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves. And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of those super-super-sexy tube integrateds being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

No more. Time for austerity. Belt tightening. A little punishment. Time to save money.

[chevyman440]

You take your chances with any car these days.

My aunt's honda with 40k miles just had the u-joint go bad on the driveshaft (4wd CRV)

1,100 dollars for the whole driveshaft, you can't just replace the joints only the whole driveshaft. On your american 4WD suv that's a 40 dollar part. No help from that lousy country either.

Sorry about your luck...maybe you'll inherit some dough

-Matt

[rone]

I'm happy with my Saturn (1996 SC2). It is decades better than my 83 VW GTI - everything works 2002-2006 saturns are so far very lackluster in styling and performance - I wouldn't buy one.

Hondas are expensive to fix when they do break, but they are definitely in another league compared to most american cars.

I hear Toyota Corollas / Geo Prizms run forever.

The Ford Fucus and Taurus are getting very reliable from what I've heard - they beat all european car makers now, according to surveys. My next car might be an FFV Taurus (flexible fuel vehicle)

Hyundais are getting lots better, too.

I'd probably avoid dodge or mitsubishi, though.

------------------------------
> With that in mind, I was going to treat
> myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might
> not actually build a project right away, but
> I actually find great drivers to be objects
> de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves.
> And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

> No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye
> on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new
> PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of
> those super-super-sexy tube integrateds
> being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate
> the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.

[cjd]

That sucks. Never happens at a good time. Though, if you'd been saving, it's better to have the money and use it where you didn't want to than not have the money and have to spend it anyhow...

> This's the last
> American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean
> everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or
> have spoken with goes thru nothing like
> this. It's appauling.

My wife won't ever drive a Civic again. Dumped it at 50k. Her Dodge (Neon at that) just turned 100k and had the timing belt done - it hasn't seen the inside of a shop otherwise (normal maintenance aside). My Dodge isn't quit as good, but the only problems were a battery that shorted internally, and a computer that crapped out because it didn't like it when the battery shorted out. . . not really their fault in either case. Of course, my wife won't own a GM either if she can help it.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.

I hear ya there. Gas bills (for heating) projected to be through the roof. Fueling the car not much better.

Hang in there. Your day will come.

C

[donc]

corolla/prizms do run forever,mazdas run forever but are expensive if repairs are needed,i've had good luck with G.M.and ford.I also would stay away from dodge and mitsubishi.Iacocca (spelling?) is lying to Americans again when he says Dodge has higher resale than ford or chevy

donc

[chichi]

It's hard to really say what an American car is. Japanese auto manufactures actually employ more Americans than any American manufacturer. I've had Chevys with and without problems, Fords with and without problems and Nissans with and without problems. I'd say it's hit or miss, but stay away from the first model year cars (anyone would tell you this). The thing that I noticed when working at a GM/Subaru dealership, that is notable, is how owners of Hondas/Subarus/Toyotas take care of their cars. They always kept up with their scheduled maintenance.

[dzach]

I'm a *gasp* foreign car guy... I have a 97 RAV4 with 95k on it and (knock-knock) it is still running great with really nothing more than regular maintenance. For an all wheel drive SUV with virtually no aerodynamics it gets 21 mpg.
The older RAV4s (like mine) were built off a Corolla engine and chasis.

We had a Solara (2-door Camry) and had good luck with that too (only owned it a couple years though), but just traded it in for an Odyssey... let me tell you there is no pride in purchasing a minivan.

I am looking at the Prius (hybrid). They pull about a realistic 45-50mpg and are pretty fun to drive. They technology is pretty amazing too... bluetooth, smart key, digital info panel.

Last American car I owned was a '90 Cheve Beretta, which pooped out at 67k.

Living in KY (location of US Toyota manuf HQ), Toyotas are more common on the road than anything else.

dzach

> I'm happy with my Saturn (1996 SC2). It is
> decades better than my 83 VW GTI -
> everything works 2002-2006 saturns are so
> far very lackluster in styling and
> performance - I wouldn't buy one.

> Hondas are expensive to fix when they do
> break, but they are definitely in another
> league compared to most american cars.

> I hear Toyota Corollas / Geo Prizms run
> forever.

> The Ford Fucus and Taurus are getting very
> reliable from what I've heard - they beat
> all european car makers now, according to
> surveys. My next car might be an FFV Taurus
> (flexible fuel vehicle)

> Hyundais are getting lots better, too.

> I'd probably avoid dodge or mitsubishi,
> though.

> ------------------------------

[biff]

> I was just notified by the dealer of my car
> repair bill: $1550. Part failure at on
> 60,000 miles, and probably my fault on the
> other problem.

> The car's a late 90s GM. This's the last
> American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean
> everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or
> have spoken with goes thru nothing like
> this. It's appauling.

> With that in mind, I was going to treat
> myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might
> not actually build a project right away, but
> I actually find great drivers to be objects
> de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves.
> And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

> No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye
> on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new
> PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of
> those super-super-sexy tube integrateds
> being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate
> the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.
Sold my wife's Honda last year, she was bored with it - understandable after 276K - the guy we sold it too said he was doing a JDM swap as soon as it crapped out, so he didn't care about condition. Over 310 now and it won't die! Timing belts evry 80, oil every 3.

Also sold my 535, around 300K on it, did have a broken odo gear. Owned a GM once, shocks at 8K, dealer said I was nuts so I stood on the bumper and jumped off and yo-yo, yo-yo. Had to call zone office to help, but they would only pay parts, I had to cover labor. Short time later, while fixing leaky radiator (stiil less than a year old) the nimrod put the cap on the top of the strut and slammed the hood, bent, cracked paint. Watched as two guys bent the hood sort of straight by hand, then got a fingernail polish type bottle of touch up, graciously gave me the remainder and pronounced it "as good as new". Probably right.
The only American cars I have bought since are Hondas from Ohio, and Bimmers from South Carolina. Apparently it's not where, but who makes them.

After about 9 Hondas in the extended family, all over 200k, I think you are headed the right direction. Good luck!

[edlafontaine]

Sorry, I have one of a rare breed, a '98 Dakota v-6 with 229,000 miles, original engine. It's been good to me, but any of them could die tomorrow.

[bill]

My Aztek (don't snicker) was hecho in Mexico (so much for buying American.) The warranty ran out at 36,000; the left front wheel bearing died at 40,000. Fortunately, since I know GM's rep, I bought an extended warranty on the car (I figured that into the cost of ownership), so the bearing cost me just the $50 deductible.

That was last week. Since then I've put about 750 miles on the car (overnight roundtrips to DC do that), and it feels like the right front bearing may be starting to go. No big surprise; I'm sure both bearings were from the same lot. That'll be another $50.

BTW, this car hasn't been to a dealer for service since about a month after I bought it, when I discovered how the "service writer" system works. You aren't allowed to talk to the mechanic; instead, you talk to a service writer, whose job it is to misinterpret what you say and type that into the dealership's computer. Based on that, the mechanic checks the wrong thing, finds nothing wrong with it, and returns the car to you unfixed. In the rare instance that he does find something wrong, he swaps out the minimum number of parts, ignoring the one that caused the problem in the first place.

Pardon me, but I used to run a maintenance shop. I found out a long time ago that the only way to get the problem fixed properly the first time was to have the technician talk directly with the customer. Mr. Goodwrench, my ***. Fortunately, the extended warranty is third-party, so they don't care where the work gets done.

And I'm never buying GM again. Not after getting 110K on a Mazda 626 and 80K on an Acura Integra. My only bitch with the Japanese, particularly Honda, is that there just isn't enough room in the driver's seat, even with it all the way back, at least in the smaller vehicles.

Sorry about your problems, dude, even if we do disagree on how to use our discretionary funds (I'm no great fan of tubes.)

Best regards,
Bill

> I was just notified by the dealer of my car
> repair bill: $1550. Part failure at on
> 60,000 miles, and probably my fault on the
> other problem.

> The car's a late 90s GM. This's the last
> American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean
> everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or
> have spoken with goes thru nothing like
> this. It's appauling.

> With that in mind, I was going to treat
> myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might
> not actually build a project right away, but
> I actually find great drivers to be objects
> de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves.
> And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

> No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye
> on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new
> PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of
> those super-super-sexy tube integrateds
> being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate
> the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.

[glennt]

Sorry about the bad news. Unforunately, nobody can guarantee that any particular car is going to last beyond the warranty. I'm a GM guy, and I won't insult you by saying they're the best, but don't think that shelling out for a Honda will guarentee happiness either.

I personally think maintence, how prior owners treated the vehicle, and luck are just as important as the manufacturers quality. 60k miles is way early... I don't know what failed, but even the worst cars of today roll past 100k with ease, yours is definately an exception to the norm. Our '97 Olds Cutlass is a GM throw away car, and one of the junkiest, a first model year, but has had 172k extremely reliable miles. It was also dirt cheap and gets 31 mpg all day long. BTW, the last 20k miles were after a service mistake (long story) that resulted in complete oil loss. No repairs done, and it still runs fine, but I was sure it would've hit a min 225k miles before that happened.

Not telling you what to buy... I live in Michigan, and imports are still a minority. But it seems that more import owners, particularly Hondas and Toyotas, take extremely good care of their vehicles. At the same time, everyone I know personally, that has done the same with their GM, has never been let down. Then there's my neighbor that simply drives the wheels off, and buys another. *shrug*

Just my 2 cents.

[chichi]

Good point about the service writer. That was my position at a GM dealership. I was 18, knew very little about cars, and had little to no training. Some customers had purchased the "Gold" service plan that was offered when they bought their car. I had no idea what this was, and wrote a ticket up for what was recommended by the dealerships own scheduled maintenance plan. Man did I catch hell for that one! I found out the quick and hard way, the difference from what a GM dealership recommends and what the manufacturer recommends for a mileage interval. I could go on and on about what I saw from that place, and it would scare most people. Very interesting job though.

[bogie]

A Honda CRV and you couldn't find one that'd been wrecked and was in a salvage yard? I mean, sheesh! Those places are your friend, and most of the repairs ain't even really that hard...

> My aunt's honda with 40k miles just had the
> u-joint go bad on the driveshaft (4wd CRV)

> 1,100 dollars for the whole driveshaft, you
> can't just replace the joints only the whole
> driveshaft. On your american 4WD suv that's
> a 40 dollar part. No help from that lousy
> country either.

> Sorry about your luck...maybe you'll inherit
> some dough

> -Matt

[westrock2000]

You bought an Aztek....[Nelson]Haha[/Nelson] j/k

My last car was an '96 Integra and that was the best car I have ever sat in...it was an excellent car from the drivers point of view. 6'3" 235lbs here. That car served me very well despite me learning how to swap drivetrains and suspensions on it.

Now I have a Dodge SRT-4. I bought it strictly for power output, and so far ( 1 year 13K ) I haven't had any problems.

My first car was a '86 F250 (460 3 speed) with about 160K miles on it...aside from general maintenance, that thing worked great.

[jonathan]

Dealership...don't you mean Stealership???? I thought this was a DIY community? What's wrong with your car? Something you could research on the net and fix yourself???

My wife bought a 2000 jetta (used) and the entire computer would malfunction continuously even after they replaced it several times, the car was just a lemon. Traded it in for a brand new 03 jetta and there's been ZERO problems...it's been 3 years and she's put 75,000 on it and it's been a complete pleasure to drive. Next car might be an audi, with a standard warranty of 100K or 10 years, it's hard to pass up, which includes all fluid changes.

My friend rolled over 300,000 miles in his honda then it crapped, motor and tranny at the same time. His previous car was a pontiac, it went 275,000.....he's meticulous about his car care.

If you own a car....doesn't matter what model or make it is....one day you're going to have to sink money into it for repairs...or maybe you'll get lucky with your next car, your honda....but then again, someone has to be the guy that gets the lemon...

When something goes wrong with my jeep, I spend hours researching on the net and asking the online Jeep communities about how to fix the problem. Once it was a $10 seal and a few hours of labor....would have cost $500 from the dealership though (wanted to bill for 6hrs of labor and $50 for the seal). Next on the list is my exaust manifold ($1,000 from the dealership, or $125 for myself to fix...hmmm, which one to choose).

[edwardc]

> Sold my wife's Honda last year, she was
> bored with it - understandable after 276K -
> the guy we sold it too said he was doing a
> JDM swap as soon as it crapped out, so he
> didn't care about condition. Over 310 now
> and it won't die! Timing belts evry 80, oil
> every 3.

> Also sold my 535, around 300K on it, did
> have a broken odo gear. Owned a GM once,
> shocks at 8K, dealer said I was nuts so I
> stood on the bumper and jumped off and
> yo-yo, yo-yo. Had to call zone office to
> help, but they would only pay parts, I had
> to cover labor. Short time later, while
> fixing leaky radiator (stiil less than a
> year old) the nimrod put the cap on the top
> of the strut and slammed the hood, bent,
> cracked paint. Watched as two guys bent the
> hood sort of straight by hand, then got a
> fingernail polish type bottle of touch up,
> graciously gave me the remainder and
> pronounced it "as good as new".
> Probably right.
> The only American cars I have bought since
> are Hondas from Ohio, and Bimmers from South
> Carolina. Apparently it's not where, but who
> makes them.

> After about 9 Hondas in the extended family,
> all over 200k, I think you are headed the
> right direction. Good luck!

Got myself an 01 Civic bearing 90k, still giong strong. it squeaks a little more than it use to, but i can still do 42 mpg on the highway and mid 30s local [not hybrid].

It was build here in Ohio, which is also where I happen to be working now for the semester. Awesome plant here at East Liberty!

I do make sure to maintain it very regularly, atleast a quick oil change when the time comes, a lot sooner than the manual's recommended 10k miles.

[christianb]

Sorry about your luck. My father works for GM and that's all our family drives.

Here are some REAL numbers of vehicles we've purchased new (5 family members). Not a single one has needed a major repair, aside from your typical radiator or starter, which is cheap and cake to fix:

1984 Olds Cutlass (305cu in): 180,000 miles
1986 Chevy Celebrity (2.8l 3 speed): 225,000 miles (tranny went)
1989 Chevy Cavalier (2.2l 3 speed): 262,000 miles (radiator went again and decided to get a new car)
1996 Buick Roadmaster Wagon (5.7l V8!): 70,000 and going
1998 Chevy S10 (2.2l): 105,000
2000 Chevy Cavalier (2.2l): 65,000
2003 Olds Alero (2.2l Ecotec): 19,500 (my car)
2005 Chevy Impala (3.4l): 15,000

Yes, we've been lucky, but we're also very strict on maitenance. I'm not saying you aren't but it's key.

> I was just notified by the dealer of my car
> repair bill: $1550. Part failure at on
> 60,000 miles, and probably my fault on the
> other problem.

> The car's a late 90s GM. This's the last
> American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean
> everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or
> have spoken with goes thru nothing like
> this. It's appauling.

> With that in mind, I was going to treat
> myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might
> not actually build a project right away, but
> I actually find great drivers to be objects
> de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves.
> And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

> No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye

> on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new
> PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of
> those super-super-sexy tube integrateds
> being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate
> the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.

[kduggan]

> Japanese cars are not better than American cars, the dealers are. It's a mute point since I drive a 4 door Dually because of my constant need to pull trailers. I would buy a bigger pickup if they made one. And please don't tell me how great a T-100 and a Titan are only one company makes TRUCKS and we all know who that is.

I was just notified by the dealer of my car
> repair bill: $1550. Part failure at on
> 60,000 miles, and probably my fault on the
> other problem.

> The car's a late 90s GM. This's the last
> American car I'll buy. Everyone, and I mean
> everyone, who owns a Honda whom I know or
> have spoken with goes thru nothing like
> this. It's appauling.

> With that in mind, I was going to treat
> myself to buying some drivers. Sure, I might
> not actually build a project right away, but
> I actually find great drivers to be objects
> de art. Esthetically pleasing in themselves.
> And heck, eventually I'd build and finish.

> No more. No more indulgences. I had my eye
> on some new pre-amps, such as the sleek new
> PS Audio phono-section, and maybe one of
> those super-super-sexy tube integrateds
> being sold by Acoustic Sounds that replicate
> the Dyna Stereo 70 or the Mac.

> No more. Time for austerity. Belt
> tightening. A little punishment. Time to
> save money.

[kduggan]

> What is all this Maintenance talk. Changing the oil ever 3k miles? Most people never do anything but change the oil. I run my engine oil (syntentic) 20K and change the tranny oil Every 40K and I average 250K miles before replaceing the truck. Other than that I Grease the Chassi and Change the filters. I personally think changing your oil every 3000 miles is insane.

Sorry about your luck. My father works for
> GM and that's all our family drives.

> Here are some REAL numbers of vehicles we've
> purchased new (5 family members). Not a
> single one has needed a major repair, aside
> from your typical radiator or starter, which
> is cheap and cake to fix:

> 1984 Olds Cutlass (305cu in): 180,000 miles
> 1986 Chevy Celebrity (2.8l 3 speed): 225,000
> miles (tranny went)
> 1989 Chevy Cavalier (2.2l 3 speed): 262,000
> miles (radiator went again and decided to
> get a new car)
> 1996 Buick Roadmaster Wagon (5.7l V8!):
> 70,000 and going
> 1998 Chevy S10 (2.2l): 105,000
> 2000 Chevy Cavalier (2.2l): 65,000
> 2003 Olds Alero (2.2l Ecotec): 19,500 (my
> car)
> 2005 Chevy Impala (3.4l): 15,000

> Yes, we've been lucky, but we're also very
> strict on maitenance. I'm not saying you
> aren't but it's key.

[thenoid]

Provided Link: theNoid's DIY Raffle


I refuse to drive anything made other than the USA!!! Take my 160K mileage "Ford" Festiva for example, it's made in the USA right? NOT!!! Can you say made by Kia for Ford and powered by Mazda...HA!!! It's all a wash nowadays man. More important then the origin of the car's manufacturing is the owners willingness and ability to take care of the car on a regular basis...end of story.

My wifes 1996 Jeep Grand Cherokee rolled over 200K last month, never a major repair that I know of.

Noidster



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