New TB W4 speaker systems in development *PIC*

[Jed K.]

Provided Link: Lineup Series


I thought you all might be interested in the Lineup series I'm working on. It's been a lot of work, but I think there will be a speaker for everyone in just about every imagineable configuration. There is a lot of information posted in the link provided at the bottom of the page. To sum it up the speakers will be a MT, MTM, fullrange, and an MTMWWWW. All using the Tangband W4 titanium driver, Vifa D26 or Fountek NeoCD3.0m, and the subs are TB W5s.

[olddude50]

Hi, Jed. I've been following this buildup on another site with a great deal of interest. Site won't let me post. Don't know why.

Anyway, I wondered a little about the above lineup. Very logical progression on the use of drivers, from full-range to MT to MTM to other configurations. But I wondered, if you can get the Tangband to run full-range, why not a MM? It would seem to me that if you can solve the issues with running a Tangband fullrange, then logically, the next step wouldn't be MT, but MM, because the same cross-over could be used to smooth both MM drivers to run full-range. Or not?

Anyway, let me add my thanks to all the others for taking on this project and sharing the construction and results with everyone. I will continue to follow the buildup as a lurker and look forward to the seeing the final results. Is there a Tangband order in my future? Beginning to look like it.

[howard]

> Hi, Jed. I've been following this buildup on
> another site with a great deal of interest.
> Site won't let me post. Don't know why.

> Anyway, I wondered a little about the above
> lineup. Very logical progression on the use
> of drivers, from full-range to MT to MTM to
> other configurations. But I wondered, if you
> can get the Tangband to run full-range, why
> not a MM? It would seem to me that if you
> can solve the issues with running a Tangband
> fullrange, then logically, the next step
> wouldn't be MT, but MM, because the same
> cross-over could be used to smooth both MM
> drivers to run full-range. Or not?

> Anyway, let me add my thanks to all the
> others for taking on this project and
> sharing the construction and results with
> everyone. I will continue to follow the
> buildup as a lurker and look forward to the
> seeing the final results. Is there a
> Tangband order in my future? Beginning to
> look like it.
Jed,
Very nice work. Well organized with something for everyone. Howard

[AJ]

That can work, but i would use one driver as a .5 driver. Just for BSC compensation. That would give you more cone area but still keeping it a one way fullranger.

[Pete Schumacher ®]

> That can work, but i would use one driver as
> a .5 driver. Just for BSC compensation. That
> would give you more cone area but still
> keeping it a one way fullranger.

Use the center driver for tweeter duty, crossed low (800Hz) with LR2 slopes.

[Wolf]

> Use the center driver for tweeter duty,
> crossed low (800Hz) with LR2 slopes.

That would definitely hinder the off-axis response of the MTM he already has, and the D26 is cheaper than buying another W4. I think his market is cornered pretty well. He certainly chose nice drivers! =-)
Later,
Wolf

[Jed K.]

Thank you for the kind words. As for using 2 TB W4s in parallel, nothing is stopping you from doing that, however this is why the 2 way is better than a fullrange driver playing up to 20K. A tweeter almost always has better dispersion and off axis response.

The picture is of a single W4 off axis response to illustrate- using 2 fullrange is identical.

[Wolf]

To sum it up the
> speakers will be a MT, MTM, fullrange, and
> an MTMWWWW. All using the Tangband W4
> titanium driver,

Are these going to be kits, or plans, etc? I loked at the tentative graphs, and they look alright, but I'm sure you're getting a diffraction issue in the full-range measurements, and you might be compensating that issue before you round the edges, and possibly mitigate the problem you just solved. What's your schem's?

Vifa D26 or Fountek
> NeoCD3.0m, and the subs are TB W5s.

Why not the W5-1138, besides price? It's a better sub.
Later,
Wolf

[Jed K.]

> To sum it up the

> Are these going to be kits, or plans, etc? I
> loked at the tentative graphs, and they look
> alright, but I'm sure you're getting a
> diffraction issue in the full-range
> measurements, and you might be compensating
> that issue before you round the edges, and
> possibly mitigate the problem you just
> solved. What's your schem's?

> Vifa D26 or Fountek

> Why not the W5-1138, besides price? It's a
> better sub.
> Later,
> Wolf

These will be available to DIYers. All free. I'll post schematics when I'm done. I've taken measurements in box, and the plots are mostly +- 1.5db or better. Once I listen with the proposed crossovers in place I'll take final measurements and update the thread at Htguide.

If people want rounded edges (harder to veneer), that can be arranged with new measurements.

I chose the W5 I did because of the higher effecicency and the distortion testing I saw in Klang And Ton looked good enough for the job. 4 per side should be interesting in the Lineup Max design.

[romanbednarek]

> These will be available to DIYers. All free.
> I'll post schematics when I'm done. I've
> taken measurements in box, and the plots are
> mostly +- 1.5db or better. Once I listen
> with the proposed crossovers in place I'll
> take final measurements and update the
> thread at Htguide.

> If people want rounded edges (harder to
> veneer), that can be arranged with new
> measurements.

> I chose the W5 I did because of the higher
> effecicency and the distortion testing I saw
> in Klang And Ton looked good enough for the
> job. 4 per side should be interesting in the
> Lineup Max design.

I'm curious how the TB drivers compared to each other. I've had issues with their drivers measuring differently even with sequential serial numbers and am wondering if their production methods have improved. The only other thing you have to worry about is the driver model changing in the future. This happened with my Cerberus design twice.

I'm curious how you feel about the off axis sound of the fullrange design. I was never that happy with my Bandit design because of this.

[Jed K.]

> I'm curious how the TB drivers compared to
> each other. I've had issues with their
> drivers measuring differently even with
> sequential serial numbers and am wondering
> if their production methods have improved.
> The only other thing you have to worry about
> is the driver model changing in the future.
> This happened with my Cerberus design twice.

> I'm curious how you feel about the off axis
> sound of the fullrange design. I was never
> that happy with my Bandit design because of
> this.

I definitely have a lot of listening to do Roman. I'm also very curious about the ribbon tweeter that everyone raves about versus the D26, which is so low in distortion.

I've basically been building and testing the Lineup Series of loudspeakers full time (overtime) for the last 2 weeks or so. It's been a blast but hard work. It does seem like there is a lot of interest though, which is a huge motivator for me. I just want to give a little to the DIY community, like you did for me. And maybe one of these speakers will make it to a DIY loudspeaker events. That would be neat.

All the drivers I've tested have been pretty close in performance, which is fairly consistent overall. One of the TB did have a bit of a dip in the 600hz area, but I think it was difraction related, because it was only on the cabinet design that places the TB W4 higher up on the baffle. That doesn't appear to be the best place for it, but I want to keep these as compact as possible.

I'm also impressed with the TB W4 distortion. Hangs in there pretty nicely with my Accuton C79s, though the Accutons have much lower even order distortion. For the price the TB W4 appear to be very good performers. Actually, at any price, within reason of course.

I sure hope TB doesn't change all these drivers because they are very good just the way they are. I realize marketing often rules decision making, but I can always cross my fingers.

Jed