power supply capacitors!

[josevergara]

well.I am still getting informations all around.but I have a power supply for an amplifier 50 watts per channel and the capacitors for each channel are "two" 6800mf 50v. and I was wondering if I can up-grade like higher voltage and higher mf.will all these up-grade make a difference in the sound or should I live like it is?

[Wolf]

> well.I am still getting informations all
> around.but I have a power supply for an
> amplifier 50 watts per channel and the
> capacitors for each channel are
> "two" 6800mf 50v. and I was
> wondering if I can up-grade like higher
> voltage and higher mf.will all these
> up-grade make a difference in the sound or
> should I live like it is?

More will not necessarily improve the sound, and more will possibly make your transformer work harder too. Not always a good thing at all.
Later,
Wolf

[josevergara]

> More will not necessarily improve the sound,
> and more will possibly make your transformer
> work harder too. Not always a good thing at
> all.
> Later,
> Wolf
thank you wolf for infomation.

[philiparcario]

> More will not necessarily improve the sound,
> and more will possibly make your transformer
> work harder too. Not always a good thing at
> all.
> Later,
> Wolf
changing voltage is usually wrong. higher uf 10000uf might help bass. it is kind of a crap shoot with uf increase! but changing voltage I dont reccomend! phil

[Wolf]

> changing voltage is usually wrong. higher uf
> 10000uf might help bass. it is kind of a
> crap shoot with uf increase! but changing
> voltage I dont reccomend! phil

As long as the VDC of the capacitor is higher than that of the supply rails, it's a misnomer. Usually you figure 1.5x the VDC of the rails for a reliable value, or at least I do. I don't believe he was meaning to increase the rail voltage.
Later,
Wolf

[josevergara]

> As long as the VDC of the capacitor is
> higher than that of the supply rails, it's a
> misnomer. Usually you figure 1.5x the VDC of
> the rails for a reliable value, or at least
> I do. I don't believe he was meaning to
> increase the rail voltage.
> Later,
> Wolf
well,most people say never put a capacitor lower voltage let say 6800mf 50v can be better 6800mf 80v right? but never lower voltage than the one that was there.that is what I know.maybe I am wrong here.

[j_dunavin]

"Usually you figure 1.5x the VDC of
the rails for a reliable value, or at least I do."
I concure.. Mr. Slone suggests a 10% increase for voltage size ( 63 V for a 50V rail )
and he suggests 1000 uF for every 10W of output power. But he also says that even that may be a little over board, and that a 6800 Uf cap on each rail would be fine for a 100 W amp.

[josevergara]

> As long as the VDC of the capacitor is
> higher than that of the supply rails, it's a
> misnomer. Usually you figure 1.5x the VDC of
> the rails for a reliable value, or at least
> I do. I don't believe he was meaning to
> increase the rail voltage.
> Later,
> Wolf
sorry wolf for many questions but,where can I find good grade for audio electrolytic capacitors 6800mf 80v 105c.thank you.

[josevergara]

> sorry wolf for many questions but,where can
> I find good grade for audio electrolytic
> capacitors 6800mf 80v 105c.thank you.
well,the original capacitors are 6800mf 50v 85c.so I think if I replace them with better grade capacitor.like: 6800mf 80v 105c better quality.

[Wolf]

> sorry wolf for many questions but,where can
> I find good grade for audio electrolytic
> capacitors 6800mf 80v 105c.thank you.

You mean "computer grade" though that is even a misnomer. As far as "audio-grade" PSU caps go, it's a myth, as the PSU does not conduct the audio signal at all. ApexJr sells the PC grade, but it's limited in supply. 105C? you'll look harder for that. The automotive market requires them for amps/electronics due to temperature swings in a car. I don't feel that's necessary for a home-amp. The 50V original VDC is probably fine, and will cost less. Measure the rails, and multiply by 1.5, and you'll have a good VDC value.
Good-luck!
Wolf

[j_dunavin]

[j_dunavin]

er lets try this
<A HREF="http://www.mouser.com/search/Refine.aspx?Ne=1447464">http://www.mouser.com/search/Refine.aspx?Ne=1447464</A>+254016+688315+688767+688737+2203862&N=1323038+4 294826834+4294966455+4294948474+2203862+0&GetRecs= 1&Msb=0&Mkw=capacitors&Ntk=Mouser_Wildcards&Ntx=mo de%20matchall&Ntt=*capacitors*&Ns=P_SField

[Wolf]

But those look like they will work for your application.
Later,
Wolf

[robc]

Look under computergrade capacitors.

[josevergara]

> Look under computergrade capacitors.
Thank you very much.

[davidellis]

> well.I am still getting informations all
> around.but I have a power supply for an
> amplifier 50 watts per channel and the
> capacitors for each channel are
> "two" 6800mf 50v. and I was
> wondering if I can up-grade like higher
> voltage and higher mf.will all these
> up-grade make a difference in the sound or
> should I live like it is?

I suggest living with it like it is for a while. Then upgrade the capacitors later. As mentioned previously, bigger isn't necessarily better. Better quality is better, but the impact is system dependent. Sometimes tweaks have little/no impact. Other tweaks will have a profound impact.

Consider that power supply capacitors have two functions - storage and filtering. The latter is profoundly important. The quality and size (smaller is better) of capacitor will impact it's filtering ability.

Presumably you already have the standard electrolytics. As such, I suggest bypassing these normal electrolytic with a Black Gate - perhaps 100 or 470uf. I then suggest you bypass with a 1uf or .1 uf metallized poly capacitor (any flavor). This will be fairly inexpensive. The goal is to improve the filtering ability of the capacitor. Reducing ringing and ripple will be reduced by the damping of the Black Gate cap and the fast time constant and low DA of the small Metallized Poly.

If you are willing to spend $$, the 50V 4700uf Black Gate caps would be dandy in a 50wpc amp IMO. But, they are expensive.

My 2c.

Dave

[josevergara]

> I suggest living with it like it is for a
> while. Then upgrade the capacitors later. As
> mentioned previously, bigger isn't
> necessarily better. Better quality is
> better, but the impact is system dependent.
> Sometimes tweaks have little/no impact.
> Other tweaks will have a profound impact.

> Consider that power supply capacitors have
> two functions - storage and filtering. The
> latter is profoundly important. The quality
> and size (smaller is better) of capacitor
> will impact it's filtering ability.

> Presumably you already have the standard
> electrolytics. As such, I suggest bypassing
> these normal electrolytic with a Black Gate
> - perhaps 100 or 470uf. I then suggest you
> bypass with a 1uf or .1 uf metallized poly
> capacitor (any flavor). This will be fairly
> inexpensive. The goal is to improve the
> filtering ability of the capacitor. Reducing
> ringing and ripple will be reduced by the
> damping of the Black Gate cap and the fast
> time constant and low DA of the small
> Metallized Poly.

> If you are willing to spend $$, the 50V
> 4700uf Black Gate caps would be dandy in a
> 50wpc amp IMO. But, they are expensive.

> My 2c.

> Dave

Thank you very much Dave!

[jtaylor]

> well.I am still getting informations all
> around.but I have a power supply for an
> amplifier 50 watts per channel and the
> capacitors for each channel are
> "two" 6800mf 50v. and I was
> wondering if I can up-grade like higher
> voltage and higher mf.will all these
> up-grade make a difference in the sound or
> should I live like it is?

The Higher Voltage rating makes finding larger farad caps more expensive. The voltage factor is mostly a safety factor to prevent Cap Failure. The larger Farad Caps will make profound differences in various applications. I used huge caps on my mobile Ham Equipment and it made a huge difference in transmission distance. Large 4 guage wire also made a big difference.

For Audio Gear I think I would save my Money and buy a true 200 watt RMS amp for the headroom. Those big power amps running at idle sound so clean and smooth. They will sound better than any mods on a small 50 watt amp. my 2 cents...

J. Taylor

[josevergara]

> The Higher Voltage rating makes finding
> larger farad caps more expensive. The
> voltage factor is mostly a safety factor to
> prevent Cap Failure. The larger Farad Caps
> will make profound differences in various
> applications. I used huge caps on my mobile
> Ham Equipment and it made a huge difference
> in transmission distance. Large 4 guage wire
> also made a big difference.

> For Audio Gear I think I would save my Money
> and buy a true 200 watt RMS amp for the
> headroom. Those big power amps running at
> idle sound so clean and smooth. They will
> sound better than any mods on a small 50
> watt amp. my 2 cents...

> J. Taylor
Thank you Taylor!

[blair]

Elna Cerafine and Nichicon Muse are supposed to be really good audio grade capacitors at a fraction of the Black Gate caps Dave is recommending. I have used bot with good results. His suggestion of the small value bypass caps also yields good results. You can use 1% Dayton caps for these if you want. These types of caps will provide you with the experimentation you are seeking on a much better budget than the Black Gates, and if you do not experience anything better, at least you did not toss 100 bucks at you r amp. HTH

Blair