Line array systems

[unknownuser]

I've not been here very long, so I guess I'm a noobie. I've been thinking of building a line array system, but I've not noticed any information here or anywhere.Has anyone here built a set, and where would I go to learn more about this big animal?

Thanks in advance,

Bill


(Originally posted by: Bill Wescott)

[romanbednarek]

Provided Link: http://www.audiodiycentral.com/awpapers.shtml


> I've not been here very long, so I guess I'm
> a noobie. I've been thinking of building a
> line array system, but I've not noticed any
> information here or anywhere.Has anyone here
> built a set, and where would I go to learn
> more about this big animal?

> Thanks in advance,

> Bill

Download Jim G's line array paper at the link below.

[unknownuser]

Yes I have that paper.

I'm more interested in talking to people who actually built one based on the parameters of the paper. It would seem that its pretty straight-forward, but there must be different ways to skin the cat.

Have you built a line array system?

Bill



(Originally posted by: Bill Wescott)

[Jim Holtz]

Hi Bill,

Are you planning on designing your own? Do you have measuring equipment and crossover software?

The same questions would apply if you wanted to design a small 2-way but it's really critical for a line array. Designing a professional line array is not a 1st time project. There are lots of "fun" line array projects based on inexpensive drivers and inexpensive active crosovers but none that are of professional sound quality. I'll probably be taken to task for saying that but I'll stand by it.

Yes, I have built a line array but it was a custom design by Selah Audio.

Jim

> Yes I have that paper.

> I'm more interested in talking to people who
> actually built one based on the parameters
> of the paper. It would seem that its pretty
> straight-forward, but there must be
> different ways to skin the cat.

> Have you built a line array system?

> Bill

[bobblickle]

> I've not been here very long, so I guess I'm
> a noobie. I've been thinking of building a
> line array system, but I've not noticed any
> information here or anywhere.Has anyone here
> built a set, and where would I go to learn
> more about this big animal?

> Thanks in advance,

> Bill

Currently building my first.

You might want to look at the ART Array at Audio Round Table. An inexpensive and relatively simple design that might be a suitable newbie project.

bb

[unknownuser]

Thanks.

You and Jim misunderstood. I said I was a noobie on the parts express forum, not that I was a noobie speaker builder.

I'll go there. On first glance it looks like there are a bunch of people who are building quality line array systems. Doesn't seem all that hard to follow Jim Griffin's advice, just time consuming to be cuttin' so many holes.

Thanks again.

Bill


(Originally posted by: Bill Wescott)

[fredthompson]

> ... There are lots of "fun"
> line array projects based on inexpensive
> drivers and inexpensive active crosovers but
> none that are of professional sound quality.
> I'll probably be taken to task for saying
> that but I'll stand by it.

I'm guilty of designing a few of those "fun" line arrays, but I agree with Jim about the importance of having the experience, knowledge, software, and testing equipment to design and build a high quality line array. If you'e only spending a small amount you can throw some drivers together and have some fun, as I did with the ART Array. Total cost of all the parts except the enclosures is $275, and the enclosures are relatively easy to build. Most who have heard them concluded the sound is good considering the cost, but no experienced listener will confuse these with high end speakers.

If you're spending more than play money it's better to build a tested design. I'm not aware of any high end designs in the public domain, but Selah Audio and GR Research offer kits for not much more than the retail cost of the drivers and crossover parts. All these kits are designed and tested by line array experts, and the sound quality reflects that fact.

[romanbednarek]

> Yes I have that paper.

> I'm more interested in talking to people who
> actually built one based on the parameters
> of the paper. It would seem that its pretty
> straight-forward, but there must be
> different ways to skin the cat.

> Have you built a line array system?

> Bill

Nope, never built a line array... probably becuase I don't like building speakers that are bigger than me (6'3", 190lbs) and I mostly listen at lower listening levels. I've read that they have a different spatial presentation than most point source speakers and I'm not quite sure if that would agree with me. I really need to just listen to a pair sometime and generate a true opinion about them.

[Paul K.]

That's probably a wise decision. I've heard line arrays on three occasions and was bothered by their "in your face" sound. Two of them, for sure, were properly designed and executed, yet all three had that unflattering characteristic. Perhaps one would get used to it over time and then be able to appreciate their positive attributes.
Paul

> Nope, never built a line array... probably
> becuase I don't like building speakers that
> are bigger than me (6'3", 190lbs) and I
> mostly listen at lower listening levels.
> I've read that they have a different spatial
> presentation than most point source speakers
> and I'm not quite sure if that would agree
> with me. I really need to just listen to a
> pair sometime and generate a true opinion
> about them.

[Andy_G]

> That's probably a wise decision. I've heard
> line arrays on three occasions and was
> bothered by their "in your face"
> sound. Two of them, for sure, were properly
> designed and executed, yet all three had
> that unflattering characteristic. Perhaps
> one would get used to it over time and then
> be able to appreciate their positive
> attributes.
> Paul

I think that there may be a tendancy when you have that many mid drivers to design them that way, it may also be a facet of designing by measurement rather than ear.
They don't have to have that problem you know.... like any speaker its all in the design choices and tweaking.

[Paul K.]

In my situation it's all pretty much a moot point as I simply have no room for a line array.
Paul

> I think that there may be a tendancy when
> you have that many mid drivers to design
> them that way, it may also be a facet of
> designing by measurement rather than ear.
> They don't have to have that problem you
> know.... like any speaker its all in the
> design choices and tweaking.

[akgapong]

> Thanks.

> You and Jim misunderstood. I said I was a
> noobie on the parts express forum, not that
> I was a noobie speaker builder.

> I'll go there. On first glance it looks like
> there are a bunch of people who are building
> quality line array systems. Doesn't seem all
> that hard to follow Jim Griffin's advice,
> just time consuming to be cuttin' so many
> holes.

> Thanks again.

> Bill

Hi Bill

I will cheer you up....go for it...fun

Later

IGGY

[akgapong]

[unknownuser]

> There are lots of "fun"
> line array projects based on inexpensive
> drivers and inexpensive active crossovers but
> none that are of professional sound quality.

What would be inexpensive drivers, and what would be inexpensive active crossovers, as an example.

I've not been able to find any inexpensive active crossovers---at least inexpensive to me, except the Behringer digital one at $250.

Thanks,

Bill


(Originally posted by: bill wescott)

[Jim Holtz]

Hi Bill,

There are a number of designs by folks that post here using buy out drivers and the Behringer crossover you referred to. I think some have made it into the project showcase. I think a guy named Marlboro picked some active crossovers up off Ebay for an active line array he came up with.

If you wanted to sample a line array and not spend a lot of money, the Dayton drivers are a good start. The RS180's or RS150's with the new Dayton Planar would make a nice budget line array. The DA175's are less expensive but sound best crossed lower than a line array requires. Actually, the RS drivers are past where they sound best with a line array crossover but are still accepable.

If you don't mind kits, the Linus II is still available from Selah Audio or Jim Griffin. Rick is also working on a new budget line array that you might find of interest. If you want to roll your own the GR research M130's are another good inexpensive driver.

The thing is, even if you go active, you still need measuring equipment to come up with a satisfactory result.

Jim

> What would be inexpensive drivers, and what
> would be inexpensive active crossovers, as
> an example.

> I've not been able to find any inexpensive
> active crossovers---at least inexpensive to
> me, except the Behringer digital one at
> $250.

> Thanks,

> Bill

[Jim Holtz]

If you'd really like to play at a low price point, Fred's ART array has gotten some good feedback. That would certainly give you a good taste of what an array has to offer.

Jim

> What would be inexpensive drivers, and what
> would be inexpensive active crossovers, as
> an example.

> I've not been able to find any inexpensive
> active crossovers---at least inexpensive to
> me, except the Behringer digital one at
> $250.

> Thanks,

> Bill