How "green" are your electronics?

[the kid]

According to the article, we are lagging behind the new age of green.

http://images.google.com.pr/imgres?i...3D144%26um%3D1

[donparsons]

Yes, but we have cars for clunkers...

[MagicO309d]

I'll worry about sustainable speaker building materials after I can finally convince my family to shut off their TV's, computers, and lights when they are not using them.

So far I feel like I'm playing one of those "hit the gopher" games with all of our power switches every day!

[johnnyrichards]

I'll worry about sustainable speaker building materials after I can finally convince my family to shut off their TV's, computers, and lights when they are not using them.

So far I feel like I'm playing one of those "hit the gopher" games with all of our power switches every day!

I hear that!

[Mark65]

MDF is made from the ground up remains of other wood producing operations. How much greener do we need to be?

Mark

[Face]

MDF is made from the ground up remains of other wood producing operations. How much greener do we need to be?

Mark

MDF without formaldehyde would be nice.

[the kid]

I suppose for starters, we could saw up a mess of standard 2x4's & then combine the dust/pieces with some sort of eco-friendly adhesive to make panels. You would have to make molds, but they don't count those any in the articles, just the 'ingredients' of the product.

You could finish them with environment friendly paint that HD offers. Certainley use paper cones. Use recycled newspaper for cabinet fill. Recycled cardboard for the port. Mount individual binding posts onto cardboard & then use the same glue to attach to the cabinet. Maybe use some old coat hangers for wiring. Cover these with the recycled newspaper for sleeving. Tape all connections as soldering adds to global warming. And use mounting screws made from recycled plastic.

A real diy if I ever saw one!

[Face]

http://www.coolest-gadgets.com/20060...-box-speakers/



or

[spasticteapot]

The "greeness" of quality audio equipment can be very high. A good pair of speakers can easily last a decade, and I used to use a receiver older than I am.

Ironically, the least green of stereo equipment is all the shiny new RoHS-compatible stuff. Sure, your $400 Onkyo HT receiver is probably greener than my old Rotel, but the lack of upgrades combined with the constant changes in video output formats leaves relatively new equipment obsolete. (Ironically, Onkyo actually produced a receiver capable of upgrades, but abandoned it when they realized sales would plummet and all their dealers would go bankrupt.)

[WWWJD]

The "greeness" of quality audio equipment can be very high. A good pair of speakers can easily last a decade, and I used to use a receiver older than I am.

Ironically, the least green of stereo equipment is all the shiny new RoHS-compatible stuff. Sure, your $400 Onkyo HT receiver is probably greener than my old Rotel, but the lack of upgrades combined with the constant changes in video output formats leaves relatively new equipment obsolete. (Ironically, Onkyo actually produced a receiver capable of upgrades, but abandoned it when they realized sales would plummet and all their dealers would go bankrupt.)

Ahhh!!! Thus cracking the seal on the dirt behind the "green" movement.. My favorite analogy for this downward spiral: Lightbulbs.

A 60W incandescent costs a penny or two to make... a dollar to buy, simple materials.. and @ $0.08 / kWh left on year round costs $42 per year to operate...

A new "green" fluorescent 15W with equivalent light output takes a ballast, phosphors, more expensive and complex manufacturing process, creates more waste in manufacturing (I used to work for Sylvania.. yuck), two to three dollars to buy. @ $0.08 / kWh left on year round costs $11 to operate.

While we the consumer don't think about it too much, and think we're doing the world some big favor by saving our $31 per year to run our light bulb, it cost someone upstream 10 times as much to manufacture.. Energy's still being paid for, and burned in the end.

I can give myself a headache coming up with ways to support my whole "regardless of what you do or what you're told, a watt is a watt is a watt and there's an almost fixed dollar figure behind said watt." Don't even get me started on hybrids. All we're managing to do is move the carbon footprint and money transference up the food chain a bit. If someone really wanted to save the planet, they'd be giving me those light bulbs, and that hybrid.

Of course, this is all strictly a matter of opinion. I'm not bitter.

[Jason]

Elemental Designs is using a product called EFS (Environmentally Friendly Substrate) that is similar to MDF, but with a couple of advantages. It's "greener" if that matters to you, but it also has some measurable improvements over MDF. Another cool thing is that it's much more stable to humidity, which could actually be a huge benefit if you are building a painted cabinet.

I have no idea where they get the stuff or who makes it. I seem to remember them saying it was quite a bit more expensive than MDF (maybe 50-100% more or something like that).

http://www.edesignaudio.com/elementaldesigns_efs.php

And as a dirty cross post, if you're interested in the material, come to the Iowa DIY event - we'll have drink coasters made from EFS for everyone as door prizes

[spasticteapot]

While we the consumer don't think about it too much, and think we're doing the world some big favor by saving our $31 per year to run our light bulb, it cost someone upstream 10 times as much to manufacture.. Energy's still being paid for, and burned in the end.

With CFLs, you still come out ahead - especially for high-use bulbs. Sure, they take more electricity to make, but once you factor in the power used for transportation and retail sale, the difference isn't that big. And the power use is a lot less.

The real problem is the mercury....and how too many idiots just chuck the used bulbs.

I can give myself a headache coming up with ways to support my whole "regardless of what you do or what you're told, a watt is a watt is a watt and there's an almost fixed dollar figure behind said watt."

A watt is never just a watt.

The energy density of gasolene is astronomical - way beyond any battery mankind will ever build (except possibly for ones that run on nuclear isotopes, and while these certainly can provide a lot of power, you can't really get at it very quickly.) However, the internal combustion engine is a massively inefficient object - depending on engine, current RPMs, temperature, and lots of other fiddly little factors, efficiency ranges from 10% to 20%. Furthermore, cars simply can't support a lot of emissions-reducing equipment simply because it's usually too heavy and won't fit.

On the other hand, the turbines used in power plants are far more effective - a small diesel-powered turbine can be over 40% efficient, and large steam-driven turbine systems (as can be found in many coal plants) can do 60% or more. While a combination of high cost and infinitesmally narrow powerband make them useless for driving a set of wheels through a gearbox, a good power plant can deliver triple the wattage from the same fuel as a car - and with less emissions.

More efficient than any of these, however, is the electric motor. The same recent advances in electromagnetic engineering that give you a subwoofer with a 2" Xmax allow for electric motors with terrific efficiency - the Tesla Roadster's powerplant is rated at an impressive 92%. Furthermore, the extremely flat torque curve of an electric motor gives as much low-end power as a much larger internal combustion engine, making it extremely useful for industrial vehicles.

The Prius is a decent vehicle - if you keep a light foot on the throttle, you can do an impressive 70MPG on the highway, useful for anyone with a 40-mile commute. However, you are correct - the Prius is not green to build, and you need to be doing a hell of a lot of driving to come out ahead over a Toyota Yaris, which can do 50MPG on the highway if equipped with a stick. For this same reason, I'm looking to buy an old Subaru Outback wagon - sure, it only does 26mpg highway, but I figure I'll be driving around 4000 miles a year and driving an old Subaru means that nobody had to build a new one.

In short: There's nothing wrong with the whole "green" movement beyond that most of the people following it are blithering idiots.

[JRT]

The "greeness" of quality audio equipment can be very high. A good pair of speakers can easily last a decade, and I used to use a receiver older than I am.

Ironically, the least green of stereo equipment is all the shiny new RoHS-compatible stuff. Sure, your $400 Onkyo HT receiver is probably greener than my old Rotel, but the lack of upgrades combined with the constant changes in video output formats leaves relatively new equipment obsolete. (Ironically, Onkyo actually produced a receiver capable of upgrades, but abandoned it when they realized sales would plummet and all their dealers would go bankrupt.)

With lead free solder more rapidly growing longer tin whiskers on the tightly spaced conductors on these little IC packages, more of the equipment will malfunction sooner, and many will simply kick the failing equipment to the curb.

http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/





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[Ryan_M]

My hobbies aren't very power efficiency friendly but at least all the power to my house is 100% green.

[rvsixer]

I'll worry about sustainable speaker building materials after I can finally convince my family to shut off their TV's, computers, and lights when they are not using them.

So far I feel like I'm playing one of those "hit the gopher" games with all of our power switches every day!

Set the computers to shut off after a half hour of none use, install timed switches and or motion sensors for the worst offender lights and appliances. That's how I took care of most of the issue here .

Rob

[envisionelec]

With lead free solder more rapidly growing longer tin whiskers on the tightly spaced conductors on these little IC packages, more of the equipment will malfunction sooner, and many will simply kick the failing equipment to the curb.

http://nepp.nasa.gov/WHISKER/
.

Not quite. For the most part, they've fixed this issue.

For consumer products, the reason most of these electronics are failing are the result of using very low quality parts that meet spec on paper, but are just counterfeits. And before you blame the cutthroat designers, you should realize that they generally design a good product. It's when the Chinese assemblers get the boards and change parts for very low quality components that failures start happening frequently for the end-user. Strict quality controls in the factory are needed and many companies don't realize this until it's too late and the company goes bankrupt.

On a side note but more on-topic; my boards were all GREEN until I got a new board house. Now, some are GOLD, YELLOW, BLACK. ....oh you don't mean the actual board color?

[brianp]

I've always wanted a big Krell amp that runs in pure class A, heats the house all winter, and makes the power meter spin like a top.

[Face]

I've always wanted a big Krell amp that runs in pure class A, heats the house all winter, and makes the power meter spin like a top.

Class A amps are fun until summer hits.



Here's how I've been green in regards with audio, this is from my music server.

[Ryan_M]

All of my computers (3) run 100% maximum load when not in use. I do protein folding for Rosetta@home which helps out with leukemia and altzheimer's research to name a few. I figure that's worth more than a few wasted watts... or a few hundred I suppose. At least my basement is nice 'n' toasty, and besides electric heating is almost 100% efficient anyway and it's all green power to boot.

[rvsixer]

All of my computers (3) run 100% maximum load when not in use. I do protein folding for Rosetta@home which helps out with leukemia and altzheimer's research to name a few. I figure that's worth more than a few wasted watts... or a few hundred I suppose. At least my basement is nice 'n' toasty, and besides electric heating is almost 100% efficient anyway and it's all green power to boot.

A most worthy cause of extra watts I say! Curious on your previous comment that 100% of your electricity is green, as well this new comment that electric heating is almost 100% efficient.

Please explain. Currently electricity takes some form of non-green activity to produce whether its on or off site, and its my understanding that electric heating (unless consumed onsite with no transmission involved) is generally quite inefficient compared to other methods (burning natural gas, etc).