Some questions about first time speaker build...

[ucf52]

Hello, new member here!

I've decided to try my hand at DIY speaker building. Caution: I have absolutely ZERO experience with home audio/theater - I just bought my first receiver and am looking to get into a good 'beginners' project.

I am however familiar with some aspects of driver matching, etc. I currently run and active stereo in my vehicle (Fountek FR88, Dayton RS180, DIYMA R12) - so I understand a lot of the terminology and theory, but the application of vehicle and home, as I've been reading, can be quite different. Hoping to learn a lot!!


Anyways, I just received my TriTrix MTM TL kit. My research concluded this is just about the perfect project for me, so I went with it.

My questions/concerns:

I've watched the PE video for the TL cabinet construction, but I'm curious about some little things. It's seems obvious to me, but I wanted to be sure I'm going to go about this correctly.

While constructing the cabinet, I should mount the crossover and run the speaker wire before it is finished, right?

I've done some searching about stuffing, but couldn't come up with anything entirely definitive. Should I line any of the inner panels with polyfill or wait until construction is complete to add any stuffing?

I'm still not sure on how I'm going to finish them (thinking piano black, but that may be over my head ) - should I do anything with the port (any sort of preparation) or can a completely unfinished cabinet (with a vent) be finished properly?


I know had some more questions, but they seem to have escaped me. I'll post as I remember them.


I would appreciate any tips/tricks you guys may have.


Thanks! And I look forward to using TechTalk as a go-to resource!

[evilskillit]

Mounting the crossover in the rear back bottom of the TL where you could get to them later if need be is never a bad idea. You never know when you'll want to double check something, running the wire before hand would be handy, but you could fish it through easily enough.

As for the stuffing there is a thread around here that Curt, the designer replied to, that said basically split 1 bag of poly fill in half and stuff it lightly through the TL. Which should be able to be done pretty easily through the woofer hole after they're built I would imagine.

As for finishing, I don't know much about that. The TL back makes doing things like veneer a bit tricky if you don't do them before hand. Paint, I don't really know either, I know buffing inside the TL would be obnoxious to say the least, but you'll get better advice from people with Tritrix and finishing experience there.

[Brewski]

I've not built tritrix's but I fairly sure you'll want to mount the crossover, run you wiring and at least partially stuff the speakers prior to completing the cabinets. Curt will probably chime in but if you search for tritrix postings you'll be able to find his recommendations on how much polyfill you'll really want to use per speaker.

I think I read a couple of months ago where someone wasn't happy with the bass respounce and Curt was able to help the owner along the lines of the correct amount of polyfill to use per speakers and the owner was much happier after the tweak.

Depending on lunches amount of posting time lunch money may be able to give good advice on painting the tritrix.

Take it easy
Jay

[ucf52]

Mounting the crossover in the rear back bottom of the TL where you could get to them later if need be is never a bad idea. You never know when you'll want to double check something, running the wire before hand would be handy, but you could fish it through easily enough.

I've not built tritrix's but I fairly sure you'll want to mount the crossover, run you wiring and at least partially stuff the speakers prior to completing the cabinets.

Since I posted I gave it some more thought and am thinking about the location you mentioned, using Velcro to secure it there, and using quick disconnects for all in/out connections. That way, I can remove the crossover very simply without causing ruckus. Thoughts?

As for finishing, I don't know much about that. The TL back makes doing things like veneer a bit tricky if you don't do them before hand. Paint, I don't really know either, I know buffing inside the TL would be obnoxious to say the least, but you'll get better advice from people with Tritrix and finishing experience there.

Yeah, this is the part of the build I'm a bit nervous about. I have two links saved (from another forum) about the proper way to prime MDF and the proper way to paint - and it's a helluva process.

I was hoping to figure out if there is any preparation that needs to be done prior to completing cabinet construction.

As for the stuffing there is a thread around here that Curt, the designer replied to, that said basically split 1 bag of poly fill in half and stuff it lightly through the TL. Which should be able to be done pretty easily through the woofer hole after they're built I would imagine.

Curt will probably chime in but if you search for tritrix postings you'll be able to find his recommendations on how much polyfill you'll really want to use per speaker.

I think I read a couple of months ago where someone wasn't happy with the bass respounce and Curt was able to help the owner along the lines of the correct amount of polyfill to use per speakers and the owner was much happier after the tweak.

Depending on lunches amount of posting time lunch money may be able to give good advice on painting the tritrix.

Take it easy
Jay

Yeah, it seems most are happy with half-a-bag per. I just wasn't sure if lining the inside panels was another (better, no) method to help with the rear wave. I didn't see that any others had done it, but I guess it never hurts to ask.

I'll just stick with the conventional stuffing through the driver cutout.


Thanks for the help so far guys!

[evilskillit]

Fluffy filling is better than lining the walls because you need it not only to kill reflections but also to absorb the mid and high frequencies in the rear wave and change something about the sound coming out of the back of the driver, speed of sound? I don't recall exactly but wall lining alone usually isn't enough unless the TL was designed to take no stuffing into consideration.

As for painting the MDF its going to be as hard as you make it and depending on what sort of finish you want. If you just sand the thing smooth and put a couple of coats of high build primer (aka sanding sealer) then a few coats of roll on latex paint you'll be surprised how nice they look. But if you want piano gloss or something else, be prepared to put enough labor into the things to make em well worth a thousand dollars.

[ucf52]

Fluffy filling is better than lining the walls because you need it not only to kill reflections but also to absorb the mid and high frequencies in the rear wave and change something about the sound coming out of the back of the driver, speed of sound? I don't recall exactly but wall lining alone usually isn't enough unless the TL was designed to take no stuffing into consideration.

Excellent information, thanks for clarifying!

As for painting the MDF its going to be as hard as you make it and depending on what sort of finish you want. If you just sand the thing smooth and put a couple of coats of high build primer (aka sanding sealer) then a few coats of roll on latex paint you'll be surprised how nice they look. But if you want piano gloss or something else, be prepared to put enough labor into the things to make em well worth a thousand dollars.

If I choose to go the piano black route, I know I've got a high hill to climb. Prior to doing any research, I planned on laying down a coat of Bondo to help seal the edges and fill in any recessions (as MDF is not perfectly flat). I was hoping that + a few coats of a good primer was going to be enough... my search will reveal.

These are the two links I have bookmarked, just haven't taken the time to go through them yet.


http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi...mdf-boxes.html

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/const...finishing.html


BUT! Because this will be my first try at cabinets I may just go with a forgiving textured paint and make it easy on myself.

My, rather long-term, plan is to do a L/C/R combo of sealed TriTrix (assuming I like them) and sealed MT's TriTrix for the two surrounds, and of course a sub woofer. I purchased the package with knock-downs because it relieved me of having to put in the work right away. I'm a bit antsy to fire up the receiver (my first) and for 80 bucks the knock downs seemed to be well worth it.

[djg]

Dave Pellegrene has done a lot of experimenting with hiding seams on mdf under painted finishes. I am a big fan of Rustoleum stone texture rattlecan finishes. Cheap, easy and attractive. Hint, put a spray basecoat of a color similar to the stone texture color or you will waste a lot of paint.

[ucf52]

Dave Pellegrene has done a lot of experimenting with hiding seams on mdf under painted finishes.

Google searching now, thanks!!

I am a big fan of Rustoleum stone texture rattlecan finishes. Cheap, easy and attractive.

I've actually used this on MDF before with good results. Another I like, but haven't used, is hammered finish. Both are very forgiving, cheap, and easy.

Hint, put a spray basecoat of a color similar to the stone texture color or you will waste a lot of paint.

Good tip, thanks!

[john trials]

Stuffing tips from Curt:

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...98&postcount=9


PE should send out this information with their kits. It's probably the most asked Tritrix question.


*

[Dirk]

I've actually used this on MDF before with good results. Another I like, but haven't used, is hammered finish. Both are very forgiving, cheap, and easy.

Seal your endgrain with a high-build primer, then put a 2nd coat of primer across the whole box.

You can also seal the endgrain with 50/50 mixes of wood glue & water. That can take a couple coats, but the cost is right and dries fast enough.

[ucf52]

Stuffing tips from Curt:

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...98&postcount=9


PE should send out this information with their kits. It's probably the most asked Tritrix question.

*

Thanks John! I missed that in my search, some GREAT tips... bookmarked!

Seal your endgrain with a high-build primer, then put a 2nd coat of primer across the whole box.

You can also seal the endgrain with 50/50 mixes of wood glue & water. That can take a couple coats, but the cost is right and dries fast enough.

Appreciate the tips Dirk! I still have a lot of reading to do, but these little tips are great!


I can't wait to get these underway. I'm picking up my receiver Saturday and my clamps (I ordered more ) should be here early next week. Should have some progress towards the end of next week. I'm sure I'll have some questions as I get underway. Thank you guys for all of the input, it really helps!

[johnastockman]

[QUOTE=ucf52;1637389]Since I posted I gave it some more thought and am thinking about the location you mentioned, using Velcro to secure it there, and using quick disconnects for all in/out connections. That way, I can remove the crossover very simply without causing ruckus. Thoughts?

I've used the spade-type disconnects for years with never an intermittent or failed connection. Being somewhat OCD with things like this, I crimp AND solder. I use a stake-style crimper with a little nub on the inside of one of the crimper dies:



Much better than those generic ones with elliptical crimp dies.

I haven't used velcro for XO mounting, but as long as it doesn't vibrate, it'll be OK. Good luck and let us know how the project turns out...with pics if possible.

John A.

[ucf52]

I've used the spade-type disconnects for years with never an intermittent or failed connection. Being somewhat OCD with things like this, I crimp AND solder. I use a stake-style crimper with a little nub on the inside of one of the crimper dies:

Much better than those generic ones with elliptical crimp dies.

Good to hear, I think I'm going to stick with this idea! I've got the same style crimper as well. I'm pretty OCD as well when it comes to the little minor details. Always crimp and solder, and I'll probably throw some expandable sleeving into the mix

I haven't used velcro for XO mounting, but as long as it doesn't vibrate, it'll be OK. Good luck and let us know how the project turns out...with pics if possible.

John A.

Will do! I'll document my progress very well and take PLENTY of pics.

Thanks John!

[ToddO]

If you are going to attampt the "piano black" finish, your prep work HAS to be perfect. The gloss black not only shows every imperfection but amplifies it. I just finished mine. They look nice but far from perfect. I did the piano black on the sides and the Rustoleum Hammered black finish on the front, top and back. I'm satisfied for my first build. You'll love the sound these inexpensive drivers reproduce. The clarity is amazing for what they are. Enjoy!

[arlis_1957@yahoo.com]

if you do a search for 'lunchmoney' you'll see his tritrix tl in his avitar. they look pretty sharp. i think he has had them for about a year and loves them. i think he has the center too. he surly can give you some good advice on these. i have the mt as surrounds and like them fine.
i have used the hammer paint and like it but any high gloss will really show the fingerprints and such. when i used it i put a semi gloss clear over it.

[ucf52]

If you are going to attampt the "piano black" finish, your prep work HAS to be perfect. The gloss black not only shows every imperfection but amplifies it. I just finished mine. They look nice but far from perfect. I did the piano black on the sides and the Rustoleum Hammered black finish on the front, top and back. I'm satisfied for my first build. You'll love the sound these inexpensive drivers reproduce. The clarity is amazing for what they are. Enjoy!

Thanks for the assurance, and I've decided to keep is simple for my first go at this - so no piano black. My eyes were bigger than my stomach. I'll probably go textured or hammered - something forgiving.

I'm really looking forward to getting these guys up and running. Not only will this be my first DIY speaker set, but really my first half-way decent set period. The anticipation is killing me! I'm going to get the crossovers built next week and hopefully start construction at the end of next week or maybe the weekend.

if you do a search for 'lunchmoney' you'll see his tritrix tl in his avitar. they look pretty sharp. i think he has had them for about a year and loves them. i think he has the center too. he surly can give you some good advice on these. i have the mt as surrounds and like them fine.

Yeah, I've seen his thread, definitely a good source for any questions.

I also recognize his user name from another forum I'm on - DIYMA

i have used the hammer paint and like it but any high gloss will really show the fingerprints and such. when i used it i put a semi gloss clear over it.

Good idea, thanks!

[johnastockman]

Good to hear, I think I'm going to stick with this idea! I've got the same style crimper as well. I'm pretty OCD as well when it comes to the little minor details. Always crimp and solder, and I'll probably throw some expandable sleeving into the mix



Will do! I'll document my progress very well and take PLENTY of pics.

Thanks John!

Having the photos really helps out new folks down the line, with some wondering how the cabinet goes together, bracing & brace location, etc. Of course, with the kit, it CAN be self-explanatory, but ?'s do pop up about that, also, even though I hear the tutorial video is good. Funny you mention the sleeving on the connectors...I use shrink tube on all mine, even using black and red to indentify + and -. Done a few wiring mistakes over the years since the first DIY speaker I built in 1977, so it helps eliminate those. I didn't mention it because I didn't want anyone to think I'm that OCD!



And personally, I like to admire everyone's skills and craftsmanship...even though it's down-played a little due to humbleness on the part of the builder. I always seem to learn something new.

John A.

[ucf52]

Having the photos really helps out new folks down the line, with some wondering how the cabinet goes together, bracing & brace location, etc. Of course, with the kit, it CAN be self-explanatory, but ?'s do pop up about that, also, even though I hear the tutorial video is good. Funny you mention the sleeving on the connectors...I use shrink tube on all mine, even using black and red to indentify + and -. Done a few wiring mistakes over the years since the first DIY speaker I built in 1977, so it helps eliminate those. I didn't mention it because I didn't want anyone to think I'm that OCD!

..and I'm sure I'll have plenty of questions.

And personally, I like to admire everyone's skills and craftsmanship...even though it's down-played a little due to humbleness on the part of the builder. I always seem to learn something new.

John A.

Same here. I always seem to pick up a good little tip here and there when checking out someone else build.

going to make a run to the hardware store today, hopefully going to start the crossovers.

[ucf52]

I started construction this evening, link to build thread;

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...55#post1638355


One concern I do have... the ground wire is pretty much touching the 2.5mH coil (doh!)... now obviously there is insulation in between them, but is this going to be an issue?

[kornphlake]

I've used the spade-type disconnects for years with never an intermittent or failed connection. Being somewhat OCD with things like this, I crimp AND solder. I use a stake-style crimper with a little nub on the inside of one of the crimper dies:

It's probably not a big deal for speaker building, but for high vibration (mainly automotive applications) soldering is not recommended on crimped terminations. Next time you've got a hot iron handy crimp two connectors then solder one of them. Once the joint has cooled flex each wire near the terminal and you'll notice how the wire that has been soldered isn't very flexible within about 1/4 inch from the terminal whereas the crimped only wire is flexible all the way up to the terminal. Solder bonds the strands in the wire together and makes them excessively rigid, the strands are actually more likely to break near the terminal when soldered because they can not flex or move like a crimp only joint. Tinning the wires before crimping causes the same problem, soldering before or after crimping takes away the only advantage crimped joints have.