Where have all the stereos gone??

[stephed]

It seems as time goes on, companies keep dropping their stereo products. I'am a fan of plain good quality stereo not all the surround sound stuff. I just found out that Anthem has dropped the TLP1 & B&K dropped the PT-5 pre-amps. Many of the receiver makers have limited their lines to no or just the cheap stereo receivers.
Denon & Yamaha are hanging in for now with the receivers, they each still market some nice stereo receivers.

The whole market seems to be driven by TV not Music.

Does anyone else find this trend some what distrubting?

Just some I was think about,

[mintos]

I think most modern multi channel receivers does stereo just fine, so you're not losing out on anything.

[MSaturn]

It's because marketers, not engineers, dictate company direction now.

Read literature and history from older companies; they're basically the brainchild of brilliant engineers with business sense - KLH, Altec, McIntosh, JBL, Dynaco, etc... You could but a consumer-level piece of gear in 1972 and you'd know Henry Kloss had something to do with it.

Now, no one even knows who's designing what until you're paying $10,000 for just a CD transport, and even then, it's unlikely.

[S7910]

It's because marketers, not engineers, dictate company direction now.

+1

This is the reason I am keeping two vintage stereo receivers (Hitachi SR-903, Sherwood S7910) in as close to like new condition as I can.

[fastbike1]

There really wasn't "consumer-level" gear in 1972. The equivalent was an "all-in-one console, usually small and able to fold up. The HiFi gear that was available was for enthusiasts. All at different price points, but still relatively expensive.

I seem to remember some folks bemoaning the replacement of mono by stereo back in the day as well. The "old days" are always viewed as "good" in spite of the actual circumstances.

You could but a consumer-level piece of gear in 1972 and you'd know Henry Kloss had something to do with it.

[johnnyrichards]

IIRC, according to Audioholics and Secrets of HT and HiFi the cheap Onkyo receiver I use measured over 150 watts into each of two channels at 8 ohms with less then 0.010% distortion. Plus it cost me all of $1.50 a watt when I bought it brand spanking new, plus it has pre-outs and crossovers that let me have the start of smart bass management plus it has those other five channels that lets me enjoy movies in surround sound - the way they were meant to be enjoyed. It also has a remote control that lets me tweak from my sitting position.

There is nothing wrong with modern multi-channel receivers that a good dose of "shake off the warm and fuzzies from the low-fi" era cannot fix. Other than the priceless feeling that nostalgia brings up there is really no reason to use stuff from the 70's, 80's and first 1/2 of the 90's.

[klocwerk]

IIRC, according to Audioholics and Secrets of HT and HiFi the cheap Onkyo receiver I use measured over 150 watts into each of two channels at 8 ohms with less then 0.010% distortion. Plus it cost me all of $1.50 a watt when I bought it brand spanking new, plus it has pre-outs and crossovers that let me have the start of smart bass management plus it has those other five channels that lets me enjoy movies in surround sound - the way they were meant to be enjoyed. It also has a remote control that lets me tweak from my sitting position.

There is nothing wrong with modern multi-channel receivers that a good dose of "shake off the warm and fuzzies from the low-fi" era cannot fix. Other than the priceless feeling that nostalgia brings up there is really no reason to use stuff from the 70's, 80's and first 1/2 of the 90's.

This.
Want a modern stereo? Get a nice receiver and turn off the other 3.1 channels. That's what I'm running in my living room right now, sounds great.

(Well, to be fair I just turned the .1 back on yesterday...)

[davebullet]

Marantz (aka Philips) still do 2 channel integrateds as well.

I have a 5 year old Marantz multi-channel that at the top end is hard to distinguish from my circa 1978 Pioneer SX-1280.

The difference is in the bass end, and at volume. The 1280 leaves the Marantz behind, whilst losing none of the top end finesse.

Right now my speakers wouldn't reveal any better amplification. I also love the Nostalgia plus the sheer beauty of a well made piece of kit:

[jmc]

There really wasn't "consumer-level" gear in 1972. The equivalent was an "all-in-one console, usually small and able to fold up. The HiFi gear that was available was for enthusiasts. All at different price points, but still relatively expensive.

I seem to remember some folks bemoaning the replacement of mono by stereo back in the day as well. The "old days" are always viewed as "good" in spite of the actual circumstances.

/yawn

[MSaturn]

Bah, those in support of modern electronics forget it all breaks in about 2 years. Also, the old stuff isn't "lo-fi."

[johnnyrichards]

Bah, those in support of modern electronics forget it all breaks in about 2 years. Also, the old stuff isn't "lo-fi."

Twelve year old Sony STR-DE825 in my bedroom going strong. Paid about $500 new for it, sounds good and has plenty of grunt. Sitting on top of that is the twelve year old Sony VD player I bought at the same time. Running great. All below a fifteen year old Sony TV and a fifteen year old Sony VCR.

I would be willing to bet most electronics from "back then" are sitting around broken as well, probably after two or three years of use. Junk is junk, regardless of what era it was produced in.

[dwigle]

Bah, those in support of modern electronics forget it all breaks in about 2 years. Also, the old stuff isn't "lo-fi."

To obtain the quality of my "lo-fi" 1973 Accuphase equipment, today you'd pay $10K.

Newer isn't always better.

[davebullet]

Twelve year old Sony STR-DE825 in my bedroom going strong. Paid about $500 new for it, sounds good and has plenty of grunt. Sitting on top of that is the twelve year old Sony VD player I bought at the same time. Running great. All below a fifteen year old Sony TV and a fifteen year old Sony VCR.

I would be willing to bet most electronics from "back then" are sitting around broken as well, probably after two or three years of use. Junk is junk, regardless of what era it was produced in.

Sony tends to produce stuff that lasts. That's been my experience too.

As you note - it all comes down to maintenance and serviceability. I wouldn't let myself anywhere near the innards of my stereo equipment, but know a qualified electrician who has re-capped the sub-boards in the above Pioneer. I also cover off once a year to vacuum dust and check for any leaky caps (esp. main filter caps - still the originals), cracking wire insulation etc...

Any cheap piece of kit will have compromises - regardless of manufacturer.

The benefit with the old Pioneer is it is almost all discrete components. That means easier troubleshooting and cheaper replacement. My last job cost me more in labour than parts. The other risk is moving it. 66lbs has to be moved carefully!

[djg]

All the Yamaha stuff I bought in the last twenty years still works, including my '93 TDM850 (motorcycle).

I have a stereo in the main BR, HK 3380 and Madisound RBRs.

[johnastockman]

It seems as time goes on, companies keep dropping their stereo products. I'am a fan of plain good quality stereo not all the surround sound stuff. I just found out that Anthem has dropped the TLP1 & B&K dropped the PT-5 pre-amps. Many of the receiver makers have limited their lines to no or just the cheap stereo receivers.
Denon & Yamaha are hanging in for now with the receivers, they each still market some nice stereo receivers.

The whole market seems to be driven by TV not Music.

Does anyone else find this trend some what distrubting?

Just some I was think about,

Well, not disturbing, but it is harder to find 2-channel gear. Not many local/mom 'n pop type audio stores left. Big box retailers won't have much to offer except some low-priced Pioneer, Kenwood, Sherwood, etc. stereo receivers. The Yamaha 2-channel receivers that are currently being offered are pretty good for the $$, but I'd have to travel over 100 miles into Seattle to see & hear any 2-channel-only equipment. And most will be some of the high-end stuff starting in the 4-figures, going beyond 5-figures. I've been around retail audio for over 34 years and 20 years as an employee. I've seen certain looks/visuals, trends, fads, popularity-driven sales (in spite of the poor performance) and a planet-load of hyperbole pass by. I know my Yamaha 5.1 receiver does well in the 2-channel mode...well, 2.1 with the bass management and my sub/plate amp. That's one thing I like about the HT amps or receivers: bass management with a low-level signal for the sub amp while in 'stereo' mode. Companies like Cambridge offer some real nice 2-channel integrated amps...NAD is another. But the vast majority of consumers want HT, so that's what ends up on the shelf.

John A.

[Face]

Today you can still find good integrateds, for example Cambridge has a nice line of gear for not that much money.

While we're on the topic, none of my Kenwood, Yamaha, or Magnavox CDP's from the 90's work anymore. I also recently had a 5 year old Marantz player die on me.

[Pete Schumacher ®]

A stereo "receiver" seems antiquated anymore. FM quality sucks for one thing, so why bother with the radio portion at all, especially if it's on your critical listening system? Other than that, it's only a source switching station with amplifiers.

Sources these days are also antiquated to me. I've given up on using CD players altogether. Anymore, a CD is dropped into the PC DVD tray, and ripped losslessly to the HD library. Playback to the stereo amplifier is via the headphone/main output. A quality sound card will provide the low distortion source you need to drive the amps, as well as handle additional input sources, if you really need any, since most PC DVD drives will handle any and all media playback duties.

[Ryan_M]

I've given up on using CD players altogether. Anymore, a CD is dropped into the PC DVD tray, and ripped losslessly to the HD library.

I do the same, and with my blurays as well. Team that up with XBMC (or equiv.) and a logitech harmony and all my media is at my finger tips without having to get out of my seat. I can also access it from other computers in the house so all my media is in the garage, in the bedroom, in the family room, etc... Only other source I have is the HD cable box.

I do really like the the look of the old stuff though like the unit a few post up.

[kornphlake]

All the Yamaha stuff I bought in the last twenty years still works, including my '93 TDM850 (motorcycle).

I have a stereo in the main BR, HK 3380 and Madisound RBRs.

I just had to request an RMA for my HK 3385, purchased in January of this year... I somewhat expect to return it once more before the warranty expires in another year and a half.

[markk]

I do think receivers are a dying breed. And it's related to the downward spiral of FM along with digital media.

Still, there are lots of integrated amps out there, and that's the way to go since, well, who listens to FM?

I agree with Pete and Ryan.

Most consumers have migrated to multichannel and that makes sense for most consumer types. Actually, it makes sense for those of use migrating to active systems too...