Official Iron Speaker Thread

[rpb]

I am at $195.54 per two speakers.

How does the bass response of the ROOM measure? Particularly the 40 hz to 80 hz range. Are there any notable peaks or dips that would help, or hinder a small sealed speaker?

[r-carpenter]

How does the bass response of the ROOM measure? Particularly the 40 hz to 80 hz range. Are there any notable peaks or dips that would help, or hinder a small sealed speaker?

I can give you the size of the room (which is 1200ft^2)
Haven't had much of issues myself.

[rpb]

I can give you the size of the room (which is 1200ft^2)
Haven't had much of issues myself.

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

[mzisserson]

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

I would go with room dimensions. There is no way to "Design" for this room and any ails your speaker will suffer, so will the rest. Roman has about 1/2 of it filled and there are many items amongst the shop so it is almost like a giant diffusion chamber. Knowing how my designs sound there vs. at home vs in other rooms I would say design like you would any other speaker for normal lifestyle use and you will be fine. Actually, speakers sound suprizsingly good in there!

[r-carpenter]

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

Don't really have anything to add aside from what Mike said.
I normally design with 4db of baffle step for smaller stand mounted systems.
Previously we had a multitude of speakers judged and I can't say that 1 or 2db of BSC made a huge difference in the scores. Just design the speaker that you yourself would be happy with and see how it fairs against other designs.
If you have a very particular requirement on the speaker positioning in relation to the boundaries, other people will ask for the same flexibility and we'll be moving speakers all day long. So, I'd rather not go there. Design for the above mentioned position. 3ft away from the back wall and 6 to 8 ft away from side walls.

[rpb]

Don't really have anything to add aside from what Mike said.
I normally design with 4db of baffle step for smaller stand mounted systems.
Previously we had a multitude of speakers judged and I can't say that 1 or 2db of BSC made a huge difference in the scores. Just design the speaker that you yourself would be happy with and see how it fairs against other designs.
If you have a very particular requirement on the speaker positioning in relation to the boundaries, other people will ask for the same flexibility and we'll be moving speakers all day long. So, I'd rather not go there. Design for the above mentioned position. 3ft away from the back wall and 6 to 8 ft away from side walls.

I don't have any positioning requirements, I'm just trying to get as much information as I can before making some design decisions.

[mzisserson]

I don't have any positioning requirements, I'm just trying to get as much information as I can before making some design decisions.

They are great questions and I am surprised no one dug into the room earlier.

[mzisserson]

Bump

[ryanbouma]

[SIZE="5"]

Tallying will be done by throwing out the highest and lowest score for each, then an averaging the total of the remaining sheets.

Can you explain this? The highest and lowest scoring designs will be thrown out? Or the highest and lowest category for each design will be thrown out. So if my speaker looks like a swimsuit model, and it scores a 10 for looks, that will be thrown out, and if it makes 0 bass, that will be thrown out. Then all that's left is averaged to give me a 9.9 (hehe). I think that makes sense. Let me know.

Thanks.

[mzisserson]

Can you explain this? The highest and lowest scoring designs will be thrown out? Or the highest and lowest category for each design will be thrown out. So if my speaker looks like a swimsuit model, and it scores a 10 for looks, that will be thrown out, and if it makes 0 bass, that will be thrown out. Then all that's left is averaged to give me a 9.9 (hehe). I think that makes sense. Let me know.

Thanks.

AH! sorry for the delayed reply. Must have missed it.

Anyway, I was thinking the highest and lowest overall score from the judging sheets. So if there are 15 sheets, 13 make it.

[r-carpenter]

AH! sorry for the delayed reply. Must have missed it.

Anyway, I was thinking the highest and lowest overall score from the judging sheets. So if there are 15 sheets, 13 make it.

I wouldn't do it Mike. See no point in it.
We need to account for our own designs and inability do judge if we are to compete tho.
Roman.

[mzisserson]

I wouldn't do it Mike. See no point in it.
We need to account for our own designs and inability do judge if we are to compete tho.
Roman.

You are correct. I didn't think of that.

[rpb]

For the appearance score, is the overal "look", or style of the speaker what is scored, or is the quality of the woodwork, and finish included?

[r-carpenter]

I am guessing, it's everything. If it's a flimsy MDF box with no bracing and grey wall paint smeared on 3 sides, it probably wouldn't score high.
Nicely designed and veneered (or solid) speakers will get the points.
Pre-build PE cabinets will get low or average points because of a lack of design input in terms of aesthetics.

[rpb]

I am guessing, it's everything. If it's a flimsy MDF box with no bracing and grey wall paint smeared on 3 sides, it probably wouldn't score high.

How did you know what my boxes look like?

What percentage of the scoring is this category?

[mzisserson]

How did you know what my boxes look like?

What percentage of the scoring is this category?

We are working this out, but there will be no weighting. All aspect will count equally on a scale of 1-7. However there will be far more ratings around sonics than looks, which will likely add weight by default.

[rpb]

We are working this out, but there will be no weighting. All aspect will count equally on a scale of 1-7. However there will be far more ratings around sonics than looks, which will likely add weight by default.

Well, I hope the looks category would account for under 5% of the total scoring. I'd like to have a better idea of the percentage this weekend if possible.

[mzisserson]

Well, I hope the looks category would account for under 5% of the total scoring. I'd like to have a better idea of the percentage this weekend if possible.

Sorry, not happening this weekend. As stated earlier the evaluation forms will be similar to Linkwitz's subjective evaluation tool form we have used successfully in the past with a few items added. It will also be simplified to be able for a volenteer to tally quickly.

It is a DESIN competition, and while sound will be the primary objective, asthetics does play a part. If it sounds good and you know your wife will allow it in the living room, or if it sounds good and is artistically beautiful AND will fit in a livingroom acceptably than the designer deserves the boost. I can tell you I am not a master woodworker and guys like Roman will likely kill me in the looks/craftsmanship department, I just better bring my "a" game sonically and design wise! It is part of the fun: playing to strengths of your own.

[rpb]

Sorry, not happening this weekend. As stated earlier the evaluation forms will be similar to Linkwitz's subjective evaluation tool form we have used successfully in the past with a few items added. It will also be simplified to be able for a volenteer to tally quickly.

It is a DESIN competition, and while sound will be the primary objective, asthetics does play a part. If it sounds good and you know your wife will allow it in the living room, or if it sounds good and is artistically beautiful AND will fit in a livingroom acceptably than the designer deserves the boost. I can tell you I am not a master woodworker and guys like Roman will likely kill me in the looks/craftsmanship department, I just better bring my "a" game sonically and design wise! It is part of the fun: playing to strengths of your own.

No, I'd say you are taking all the fun out of the competition by forcing entries to be meticulously finished in order to score well. Since when is 15 coats of paint rubbed out to a mirror finish part of a design? Or for that matter, a grill that would surely increase the WAF. If this is more than 5% of the score, I'd like to know now, before my 45 day deadline which is early next week.

[mzisserson]

No, I'd say you are taking all the fun out of the competition by forcing entries to be meticulously finished in order to score well. Since when is 15 coats of paint rubbed out to a mirror finish part of a design? Or for that matter, a grill that would surely increase the WAF. If this is more than 5% of the score, I'd like to know now, before my 45 day deadline which is early next week.

I gave you the answers you wanted, I do not have any further information at this time other than yes, aesthetics count being part of a design from form to fit and finish. It will be weighted somewhat less than the sound portion.

If it makes you feel any better, I am trying a paint job for the very first time! Challenging my own personal skill-set. I am not worried about making them look good, it is just the kick in the a$$ I need to try something new and interesting.