Craigslist Score!! oh crap...

[ssyfert]

So I got an early 90's technics 5 disc cd player with the MASH logo on the front (I've heard that means good things) and only paid 15 bucks. Brought it home everything works great, remote works. Good, so I just went to hook it up in our shop where it will reside, turn it on, load a cd, and it just spins and spins and spins... it won't play burned cd's. All 50+ of them I play out there are burned, I don't want to bring "real" cd's out with all that sawdust and stuff.

So, is there any way to make a burned cd and code it in a format that will be recognized by early cd players?? I'm willing to reburn all of them if I have to.

Thanks,

Steve

[mdocod]

Hi Steve,

It's possible that some early generation CD reading devices simply will not read consumer burned discs regardless of what settings you use. That said, the most important "setting" you can choose is to make sure that you have your burning software set to create an "Audio CD (CD-A format)" [not a Data or Mp3 CD]...

Best of luck

Eric

[ReissM]

The reflectivity of a CD-R (burned disc) is much lower than a commercially pressed CD. Some older players can't function with such a small signal reflected back from the disc.

MDOCOD is also correct... some modern players can play multiple audio formats (MP3, WAV, PCM, etc..) that they encounter on a CD. Your CD player will definitely puke if it sees these types of discs.

When you burn discs, make sure you choose "AUDIO CD" format not an "MP3 DISC" . And don't choose the option to "burn text" such as track names and disc name. You want the most compatible format with the least bells and whistles... ISO 9660, Jolliet, MODE 2, blah blah blah.

Also, call me crazy, but after experimenting with over 1000 CD-R's I've found that the burn speed can sometimes affect the playability. Don't burn at 52x. Slow it down to 4x or 8x and see if this will allow your older player to magically recognize the CD-R's. I won't bore you with Red-Book standards, or attempt to calculate how many zillion of times per second the laser pulses/burns on and off while the disc is spinning. Take my advice, the slower you burn the disc, the more reliable it will be.

Another issue can sometimes be the brand of blank CD-R's. I've had so many problems with cheapie brand CD-R's that I now exclusively use TDK, SONY, FUJI or some of my secret stash of those Gold Kodak CD-R's. I even had issues with the popular Maxell and Memorex CD-R's.

So try this:
1. Slow burn speed.
2. Sony CD-R blank
3. Be sure to choose "Audio" CD when burning.
4. No extra bells and whistles (like adding track names) to insure the most compatible disc.

If this still doesn't work for you... well, the player must just be too old to pickup the weak signal from CD-R's.

P.S. - CD-RW's use a completely different technology so that they can be re-burned over and over. This just so happens to increase the reflectivity too. They are cheap enough now-a-days, so try one of those if the above suggestions fail.

Good luck.

[generic]

I've also had luck in the past burning at the lowest speed possible.

[John_Frum]

You might have to go in and change the gain and focus on the drive. I bet there is a how to out there.

[aarond]

I've also had luck in the past burning at the lowest speed possible.

That is the first thing I thought of. I couldn't tell you what the difference is but I do remember it was a key to success when CDR's first came out and the current CD players had not been designed to work with them.

[Mark65]

Another potential issue is the drive that is doing the burning. My old Technics will play burned discs from just about any source burned at any speed, except for the drive that was in my computer for a few years. No matter how I massaged the settings on that drive, no go. They would play anywhere else that I tried them, but not my Technics, and as I said it will play any other burned disc that i have tried.

On most of those "unplayable" burned discs, skipping to track 2 would actually work, leading me to believe that that particular burner was burning the first "groove" too close to the center, and the older laser was simply not recognizing it as a playable track. I'd say that John_Frum's advice is worth trying, if you can.


Mark

[John_Frum]

Another potential issue is the drive that is doing the burning.

Good point. I have never had problems with disc burned with Plextor or Lite-On drives.

[ReissM]

... On most of those "unplayable" burned discs, skipping to track 2 would actually work, leading me to believe that that particular burner was burning the first "groove" too close to the center, and the older laser was simply not recognizing it as a playable track.

Mark

Very Interesting. Hmmm, perhaps it's an issue with the CLV (constant linear velocity) motor servo system.

As most of you are already aware, the CD spins much faster at the beginning of the CD. The Index track, and then Track 1 are at the center of the disc... the exact opposite of a vinyl record.

As the CD plays through the tracks, the lens moves further out towards the outer edge. This means that in order to keep a CLV of data passing by the laser, the speed of the disc must slow down. Typically we're talking about 500 rpm VS 200 rpm.

The fact that you could skip to track #2 and it would actually start to play indicates that the focus system and speed are being determined correctly. So why aren't they for track #1? Well, like I said at the beginning... maybe the servo motor is having issues up near 500 rpm but works ok when it gets down to 450 rpm and below???

[---k---]

I once owned a Toshiba 5-disc changer that wouldn't play burned CD's. The manual proudly stated something like, "To ensure the highest level of playback quality, this player does not play CD-R or CD+R".

I can't say for certain that this is your problem, but it is a possibility.

[fatmarley]

If the laser runs up and down on metal rails, a possible fix would be to re-grease the runners.
I've fixed CD players, DVD players and even CD a cd rom drive with a bit of white grease on the end of a cotton bud or matchstick.

You can see what the rails look like in this picture:

[awwnuts]

I have a similar Technics MASH changer that plays any burned CD I've ever put in it. So, it looks like you have a bad spindle motor or the optics are out of adjustment.

You need "special" equipment (oscilloscope and a service manual) to adjust the "eye" waveform to ensure that you're getting correct amplitude from the optics.

I'd just buy another one...but take a test CD with you.

[ssyfert]

Well I had my hopes up till that last post.

I do burn audio CDs, not data or mp3. However everything that's been said applies. The test CD came from a cheap 100 pack, was burnt at 52x, I did not skip to track 2 (that trick has worked for me many times in the past), and probably the biggest is that it was mentioned about certain computers being suspect, I thought back and there have been several times I've made discs from my current pc that don't play on even modern (2 years old) players. So I've got some experimenting to do, thanks everyone, you guys are great.

[AJ]

I've got a 5 disc Technics MASH player at home. I'll try playing some CD-R's with it later today. Please post the model number if you get a chance.

[ssyfert]

Sl-pc33

[AJ]

I have an SL-PD807 with the "4 DAC MASH", whatever that means...

It played my CD-R's fine. I burn using WMP from WMA Lossless files.

[johnastockman]

My Technics SL-PG100 MASH CD player is the single-disc model, circa 1992-1993. But I am going to start using the methods that ReissM mentioned. I got a stack of 25 Maxell Audio CD-R's and half of them turned out unplayable with blank/dead spots, skipping, etc. Now that I have some Sony Audio CD-R's, I haven't had any problems with them in the Technics or the Emotiva ERC-1. Thanks for the great tips about the burning speed!


John A.

[brianpowers27]

1. Have you verified that the CD player actually works with a known good non-burned cdr?
2. You could consider cleaning the cd player's eye with a q-tip and rubbing alcohol. It has resolved issues for me with many cd players that manifested the endless spinning you are referring to.

[ssyfert]

1. Have you verified that the CD player actually works with a known good non-burned cdr?
2. You could consider cleaning the cd player's eye with a q-tip and rubbing alcohol. It has resolved issues for me with many cd players that manifested the endless spinning you are referring to.

After I picked it up I brought it my apartment and hooked it up, plays factory non-burned cd's or whatever you call it, the real thing, no problem. It was when I brought it to our shop is when I noticed the difference with burned cd's.

I did a test last night, I burned a cd at a lower speed with a different disc than was originally tried. It still spun and 'thought' for a while, so I skipped to track 2 and a little pause then it started playing. However, the quality was pretty poor, not the case with the real cd, it sounded great.
Today I picked up a 10 pack of memorex blanks that say they are specifically for music. I'll give one of those a try tonight. I anticipate maybe trying to find some of the better brands that were mentioned above, probably on amazon.

Is there a free burning software anyone would recommend that will allow me to slow it to 4x? Mine only does 52x, and when I picked the slow speed in MWP (it doesn't give the *x speed) it still took like 3 minutes, seemed too quick to me.

Also in the next couple of days I open it up and clean the eye, doesn't sound like it would hurt to try, especially since it's helped you before. Thanks, I'll keep trying.

[ReissM]

Today I picked up a 10 pack of memorex blanks that say they are specifically for music.

There is no technical difference between "Music" CD-R's and plain CD-R's. They simply cost more because they factor in lost royalties to the music industry. All specifications are identical... don't bother with Music CD-R's, just use reputable blank discs. I get the Sony's from Best Buy.

Also in the next couple of days I open it up and clean the eye, doesn't sound like it would hurt to try, especially since it's helped you before. Thanks, I'll keep trying.

There is a servo motor that controls the focus, so be very gentle. If you pay attention you might be able to detect the lens moving inward as you push with the Q-tip.