$vboptions[bbtitle]   $vboptions[bbtitle]  
  Terms and Conditions     Project Showcase
  Resource Index   Speaker Terms Glossary
  Security/Privacy   Speaker Replacement Help
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 21 to 40 of 75
  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Hampton Roads Virginia
    Posts
    1,224

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Except for the crazy price of the parts.

    Quote Originally Posted by djg View Post
    I never looked at Loren's design 'til now. It would be hard to go wrong with that setup. It is a large floor standing speaker that would satisfy you.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    wisconsin
    Posts
    3,473

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    There are people on this board that will design a crossover for you if you can agree on the drivers. That crossover will be a computer simulation using some very good design software, but you will be the first to hear it after you build it. I didn't read Loren's design thread, but I doubt that Dennis Murphy did that for free. He is in the speaker business. Loren can correct me. Your other choice is a published design or kit.

    Realistically, a pair of Jeff Bagby's Fusion Seos speakers built on your cab is a good option, near your budget. If Jeff wanted to design a speaker to sound like a Klipsch, I'm sure he could. You think his vented horn designs won't sound good. They probably sound very good, as he is a talented designer with lots of experience. He designs professionally, and also occasionally publishes a free design.

    The Designer Daytons are fairly new. Johnny Richards did a design with a small Designer speaker that he thought was disappointing and not cost effective.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Hampton Roads Virginia
    Posts
    1,224

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Dennis is an extremely kind speaker nut and asked only for a donation to his orchestra as compensation for his efforts in crossover design for me. With that said I think that the unique nature of my project/drivers piqued his interest. He can speak for himself, but I'm not sure he is in the business of doing crossover design work for any random rehash of a basic two way bookshelf design.

    I do agree that the Fusion design by Jeff B would probably meet the goals of the OP, but it would also be possible to come up with a set of drivers and ask assistance from folks here on the board with a simulated crossover design or possibly even for a design based on measurements in the box if the OP lives near to someone with such ability.

    I would think the existing Vifa tweeters with something like the FaitalPro 6" midwoofer http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...4-1150&scqty=1 and a pair of the 10" Peerless SLS woofers per side http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...4-1110&scqty=1 would meet his desires fairly well and be within the price range. Alternatively the pair of 10's could be swapped for something like the 15" Dayton series two woofer http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...95-130&scqty=1. All that would be needed would be kind assistance from PETT members with some crossover design skills and a willingness to help. I think a fairly efficient, good sounding full range speaker capable of reaching loud levels and doing rock music justice would likely result.

    Quote Originally Posted by djg View Post
    There are people on this board that will design a crossover for you if you can agree on the drivers. That crossover will be a computer simulation using some very good design software, but you will be the first to hear it after you build it. I didn't read Loren's design thread, but I doubt that Dennis Murphy did that for free. He is in the speaker business. Loren can correct me. Your other choice is a published design or kit.

    Realistically, a pair of Jeff Bagby's Fusion Seos speakers built on your cab is a good option, near your budget. If Jeff wanted to design a speaker to sound like a Klipsch, I'm sure he could. You think his vented horn designs won't sound good. They probably sound very good, as he is a talented designer with lots of experience. He designs professionally, and also occasionally publishes a free design.

    The Designer Daytons are fairly new. Johnny Richards did a design with a small Designer speaker that he thought was disappointing and not cost effective.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,310

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    Cool, thanks! I have something to chew on. I'm not sure I want to spend $400 on woofers alone. Are the Designer Series Dayton's not good? I'm trying to read between the lines here... Obviously, people are suggesting drivers that are more expensive than I had planned.

    Also, the "Scan-Speak 15W/8434G-00 Discovery, 5.25" Midwoofer" is only 86db. That might be a bit low for what I had planned, no?

    As far as ported vs. sealed, I do understand that ported systems often have more punch. However, I typically prefer the sealed sound. Especially when driving very low at high power.

    Not generally a horn tweeter fan either. Klipsch speakers are my least favorite.

    I neglected to add, that I'd like the speakers to be "up to" about 48 inches tall for aesthetic reasons. Any smaller and they will look too small in the room for what I'm trying to achieve.
    Any speaker design will have compromises. The less money spent, the greater the compromises. Also, look for the weakest link in the design. For example, a woofer that handles 600 watts wouldn't do you much good if matched with a tweeter that is self destructing at 100 dB. If the tweeter you have is limited, then the speaker will be limited. If you really want to push the speakers so hard, then I would suggest increasing the budget to $1000. That will allow for more drivers to be used. Your speaker might also need to be closer to 8 cu-ft. Again, it's all about compromises.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    22

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    I'm really excited about building the towers. I'm still interested in dual 10's, dual mids and the Vifa tweet. And considering the Peerless stuff, although more expensive. It seems people here simply like those drivers over the Dayton's. Budget remains a concern, but I can do more if necessary.

    A couple of suggestions above included so called "professional" drivers. These tend to be more efficient, and I've never used any pro drivers. Do they work well for Hi-Fi? Seems like they don't go as low...

  6. #26

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    I'm really excited about building the towers. I'm still interested in dual 10's, dual mids and the Vifa tweet. And considering the Peerless stuff, although more expensive. It seems people here simply like those drivers over the Dayton's. Budget remains a concern, but I can do more if necessary.

    A couple of suggestions above included so called "professional" drivers. These tend to be more efficient, and I've never used any pro drivers. Do they work well for Hi-Fi? Seems like they don't go as low...
    They typically don't dig as deep, although there are some exceptions to the rule. The eminence 'LF' models are an exception. A pro driver can work well in a hi-fi setup; they're just optimized to play loud and handle rougher environment than the models designated for 'home' use.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Hampton Roads Virginia
    Posts
    1,224

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Just as Taran said, often pro style woofers won't play as deep because they trade efficiency and enclosure size against LF extension. The eminence Lab12 in the intrepids, the eminence in the fusion among many other pro drivers will give good and fairly deep LF response. My speakers use all pro type drivers and have solid response to the mid 20's and to my ear sound pretty nice. The point is that pro style drivers can easily be used in hifi designs.

    I recommended that FaitalPro mid because it looks to have useable FR, has enough efficiency to match your dual 10" plan and will play louder than you ever need with only one mid per cabinet. It is also a good bargain at 40 bucks or so. Narrow down your choices a bit and propose some stuff here. People can make sure what you pick will work together.

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    A couple of suggestions above included so called "professional" drivers. These tend to be more efficient, and I've never used any pro drivers. Do they work well for Hi-Fi? Seems like they don't go as low...

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Laporte, IN
    Posts
    3,262

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Just an FYI on the lab12c used in the intrepids. They dig incredibly deep. They are loaded into 3cubes with an fb of 25hz and f10 of 19. Some of the comments from this last Indiyana gathering were "best bass of the day" to Jeff B " most controlled and articulate". Sobeven though some will classify it as a prosound driver, it is actually a very versatile woofer.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    22

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    OK, I'm willing to pay for the Peerless 10 inch woofers (Peerless 830668 10" Paper Cone SLS Subwoofer), even though they are less sensitive than I'd like.
    And, there have only been a couple of midrange suggestions. Any other suggestions?

    Midrange options so far:
    Scanspeak 15M/4624G Discovery 93db?
    or Scan-Speak 15W/8434G-00 Discovery, 5.25" Midwoofer" is 86db
    HiVi F6 6" Bass/Midrange 88db, http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=297-440
    "fatal-pro" haha, 6" midwoofer http://www.parts-express.com/pe/psho...4-1150&scqty=1
    Peerless SDS-160F25PR01-08 6-1/2" Paper Cone Woofer Speaker



    Thanks.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    1,171

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    That's the same woofer used in the Tarkus, which is an excellent design that will do pretty much exactly what you're looking for. I know it will certainly get loud enough to give you the "concert in your living room" experience, and they are voiced specifically for rock, electric guitar sounds perfect on them. The tweeters you have, aside from the sensitivity, are pretty close to what's in the original Tarkus design. It may be worth it to look into doing that design, with a crossover rework for the tweeters you have. I've used the smaller XT tweeters and they are really nice. I know the Tarkus is a ported design and you were looking for something sealed, but other than that I don't see why these aren't a perfect fit for you. Even building them as designed with having to buy tweeters, the total cost of parts is within your budget. I say go for it, and if you feel they are lacking in bass, it is most likely a room issue.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Colorado Springs, CO
    Posts
    485

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Pro-sound woofers tend towards high motor strength and less moving mass for a given Sd. The result is higher output for an equal electrical input in a narrower resonant band. (the resonant behavior does not extend as deep).

    Hifi woofers tend to have less motor strength and more moving mass for a given Sd, the result is lower output for an equal electrical input in a wider resonant band (the resonant behavior extends to a lower frequency).

    The pro-sound drivers shifts from resonant to damped behavior at a higher frequency than the comparable hifi driver. The result is that to the untrained eye, they "appear" in simulation not to be able to play as deep; However, provided the drivers being compared are being compared on equal playing field as far as acoustic impedance loading, then all drivers produce the same low frequency SPL when they displace the same amount of air.

    Pro-sound drivers require more EQ when used in alignments that provide very little acoustic impedance modification (simple sealed boxes, for example). The best way to take advantage of the pro-sound woofer's high efficiency would be to extend that efficiency to a lower register with an increase in box sophistication (introduce another resonant system to modify the acoustic loading). Then take advantage of the increased efficiency and make it part of a step loss correction in transition to midrange driver.

    ---------------------

    If you're going to use a low sensitivity sub in a sealed box as your woofer, then bi-amping is more important, otherwise you will be forced to pad the mid-range and tweeter down a LOT. The amount of padding required could be a fire hazard if not done properly.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    22

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Decision made: (mostly)

    2ea Peerless 830668 10"
    2ea Peerless SDS-160F25PR01-08 6-1/2"
    1ea Vifa XT25TG30-4

    In a 48", sealed tower configuration. If I build it correctly (with just enough room between drivers, I generally like 'em close) , I'll be able to try various drivers if I don't like the ones chosen.

    Before I press the "place order" button, any other suggestions?

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,310

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    Decision made: (mostly)

    2ea Peerless 830668 10"
    2ea Peerless SDS-160F25PR01-08 6-1/2"
    1ea Vifa XT25TG30-4

    In a 48", sealed tower configuration. If I build it correctly (with just enough room between drivers, I generally like 'em close) , I'll be able to try various drivers if I don't like the ones chosen.

    Before I press the "place order" button, any other suggestions?
    With your existing tweeter limited to a 2.5k x-over or higher (per Pete), I'd look for a smaller mid that can cross at 3k.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Laporte, IN
    Posts
    3,262

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by rpb View Post
    With your existing tweeter limited to a 2.5k x-over or higher (per Pete), I'd look for a smaller mid that can cross at 3k.
    +1 the peerless 6.5 looks to cross by 2k, so unless you don't mind using a different tweet. There are other 6.5s available, but dropping to the 5.25 is also an option.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Jupiter, FL
    Posts
    22

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by rpb View Post
    With your existing tweeter limited to a 2.5k x-over or higher (per Pete), I'd look for a smaller mid that can cross at 3k.
    Then, how about the HiVi F6?

  16. #36

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    Then, how about the HiVi F6?
    Why not a F5? It's got the flange size of a typical 6.5 inch driver anyway, and it easily crosses at 3k

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    2,310

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    Then, how about the HiVi F6?
    I've not researched that one, or heard it. A lot of cheap drivers have a rather high 3rd order distortion. There are exceptions of course, and with luck you can find one that is good from 400 to 3k. If you were not planning to play so loud, this wouldn't matter nearly as much. Maybe you should check out Zaphs website, and see if he has tested anything in your price range that is low in distortion. I'd focus the search for 5" or 5.25" drivers.

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Northern Michigan
    Posts
    114

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    If you change your peerless mid to the same one used in the tarkus, which is about the same price, and would be willing to change to the tarkus tweeter (or even if you weren't), you've got a "double tarkus" sort of, which sounds interesting to me!

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    AZ
    Posts
    836

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    The SDS-160 has a distortion profile that warrants a low crossover

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	sds-160 distortion.jpg 
Views:	51 
Size:	80.8 KB 
ID:	39289

    Quote Originally Posted by cujet View Post
    Decision made: (mostly)

    2ea Peerless 830668 10"
    2ea Peerless SDS-160F25PR01-08 6-1/2"
    1ea Vifa XT25TG30-4

    In a 48", sealed tower configuration. If I build it correctly (with just enough room between drivers, I generally like 'em close) , I'll be able to try various drivers if I don't like the ones chosen.

    Before I press the "place order" button, any other suggestions?

  20. #40

    Default Re: I'd like some help with a large floorstanding speaker design

    No doubt enough people have enjoyed the Tarkus line of speakers to warrant a positive recommendation on the SDS line of midwoofers for what you have in mind (though I would also go with the smaller 5" sizes for that tweeter in an MTM configuration), but I would seriously consider stretching your budget just a tiny little bit more in order to step up to a higher quality of driver. And if you're going to go with the philosophy of buying something else if you don't like your original purchases then you just end up spending even more money in the long run anyways.

    The ScanSpeak 5.25" Discovery is a better alternative except that the SB15MFC30-8 is a cleaner driver with lower 3rd and 5th harmonic distortion and 4 of them will be $28 cheaper.

    http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com...y-cone-woofer/

    So,
    4 x Peerless = $300
    + 4 x SB15 = $232

    $100 - $150 on the xo will put you $30 - $80 over your $600 budget. A year or 2 down the road while you are sitting enjoying a superior set of speakers (with a big grin on your face), you'll probably realize $100 one way or the other didn't make any difference to you in the long run but the difference in sound does.

    At least that's the way I look at it. Me, I went with 2 x the ScanSpeak 5.25" Revelators at $250 each at the time and I still don't regret a penny of it.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  




Your #1 Source for Audio, Video & Speaker Building Components


Clearance Center
Deal of the Day
New Products




View Our latest
Sales Flyer

Prices Effective
Through 10/31/14


Order our FREE 336 Page Full Color Catalog


Speaker Component Categories

Home Audio Speakers

Professional Audio & Guitar Speakers

Car Audio Speakers

Speaker Buyouts

Measurement & Design Tools

Subwoofer Plate Amplifiers

Full-Range Plate Amplifiers

Crossover Components

Cabinet Hardware & Speaker
Grill Cloth

Speaker Cabinets

Subwoofer System Kits

Speaker Kits

Speaker Repair Parts

Speaker Wire