Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

[mdocod]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Domes with [email protected]@1M or better sensitivity should keep up with one of these on a traditional baffle without much trouble. More sensitivity would be better just for the sake of having some tinker room to square up the response and mellow out the load, but isn't crucial.

[Pete Schumacher]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Domes with [email protected]@1M or better sensitivity should keep up with one of these on a traditional baffle without much trouble. More sensitivity would be better just for the sake of having some tinker room to square up the response and mellow out the load, but isn't crucial.

If you were using it as a woofer in a two-way, you'd be correct. However, Jeff's using it as a mid with a 97dB woofer, so he'll need a 94dB or better tweeter to keep up with the 94dB mid.

Big thumbs up to Dave's suggestion of the AST2560 in a guide. Those AC AMTs are very nice sounding tweeters.

[dcibel]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

I just thought about making a efficient 2 way with the 6a as a midbass. Maybe with a small waveguide and the 18 Sound EAW 1 inch driver. I also am intrigued by the Dayton PM drivers and wondered if the 6a could be used similarly. I will bow out, just was thinking out loud.

The Beta 6A won't produce much in the way of bass by itself, so plan on using a subwoofer as well if you go that route. Fs of the PM180 is half that of the beta6. Simulate them both in a cabinet and you'll see what I mean about the PM180 an PM220, for a high efficiency driver they just don't need the big cabinet that the rest do, which makes them very appealing to me. Normal looking 2-way towers for the home are not out of the question at all.

[Jeff B.]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

If you were using it as a woofer in a two-way, you'd be correct. However, Jeff's using it as a mid with a 97dB woofer, so he'll need a 94dB or better tweeter to keep up with the 94dB mid.

Big thumbs up to Dave's suggestion of the AST2560 in a guide. Those AC AMTs are very nice sounding tweeters.

Actually, having worked with the Delta Pro 12A before it is capable of 98 dB sensitivity in the upper bass. The mid, on a larger baffle, will sustain 95dB quite well and their will be some bandpass gain to factor in. So, a mating tweeter needs to be a least 96db to match well. 95-96dB was where I ended up with the SEOS12 / DNA360 when I mated it to the 12A in the Tempest, and that speaker has a little lift in the mid and uppder bass, but that sounded nicely balanced with the constant directivity of the waveguide. I found when working with the SEOS projects that you need to set up your on-axis response a little differently with waveguides than you do with direct radiators like dome tweeters. I doubt there are any domes that will keep up well, especially at a low crossover point. I rated the Tempest at 98dB sensitivity based on the woofer sensitivity (and it was crossing over at 1.3 kHz too). I expect this speaker to be reasonably close to that of the Tempest, but we will see.

If I build it, a two tweeter option may be in order: one with a SEOS waveguide and compression driver and another, more high end version, maybe using the AST2560 AC AMT. This is all a bit down the road. I am still in the thinking-it-through stages and wanted to measure these mids to see how good of a candidate they were.

Jeff

[[email protected]]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

How about one of the Fountek?

[mdocod]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

I must have misunderstood the context of what I was commenting on. Chatter about the applications of this in a 2-way getting mixed up in there and I was immediately side-tracked.

[Jeff B.]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

I must have misunderstood the context of what I was commenting on. Chatter about the applications of this in a 2-way getting mixed up in there and I was immediately side-tracked.

If you're talking about using it as a midwoofer in a two-way, then yes, it is will have 6dB in sensitivity over most any other comparably sized driver. This could easily result in a true 90dB small monitor with some baffle step compensation already included. Of course, Hoffman's isn't called an iron law for nothing, and what you are giving up for this increased sensitivity is bass extension compared to those other woofers.

[mdocod]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Precisely ;)

(already built something like it, and happily took the tradeoff. In my application I'm getting ~93dB@1W1M average sensitivity from a TM with an 8")

[Jeff B.]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Precisely ;)

(already built something like it, and happily took the tradeoff. In my application I'm getting ~93dB@1W1M average sensitivity from a TM with an 8")

Sounds similar to my Alchemy design with the Beta 8A

[mdocod]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Similar goal I'm sure, though I wanted to use only direct radiators and simulate my own crossover using a different method. A quick-n-dirty build log can be found linked to in my sig. Didn't seem to generate any interest so I stopped updating it with progress. I have been working on finishing the cabs as of late. A very slow, tedious process.

[lorenmjones]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Jeff Bagby wrote:

"If I build it, a two tweeter option may be in order: one with a SEOS waveguide and compression driver and another, more high end version, maybe using the AST2560 AC AMT. This is all a bit down the road. I am still in the thinking-it-through stages and wanted to measure these mids to see how good of a candidate they were."

I know I'm a broken record but you could consider the Beyma TPL150H for your higher end version. http://profesional.beyma.com/pdf/TPL150HE.pdf and here are some distortion comparisons between the Beyma AMT and a compression driver http://www.beyma.de/fileadmin/seiten...TPL-150_en.pdf The price is a lot higher but it has the sensitivity, smooth response and low distortion this project requires. It offers the flexibility to cross lower than the AC. Your project will realize higher sensitivity than the one in my sig but that is because I aimed for low 20's extension in a full range design.

Fwiw another new GREAT looking 12" woofer with high sensitivity is the B&C 12FW76 http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...umber=294-5951 . Great looking response, high excursion for its efficiency, shorting rings in the motor and the price isn't too bad at all. It won't go as deep as the eminence though.

Btw I'm well aware you need no suggestions from newbs like me re: driver selection...

I'll be very interested in this build.

[bigfishe]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

How about the peavey buyout tweeter?

[bigfishe]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

97 db and priced right?

[tyger23]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Peavey Versarray Ribbon RD1.6 = Fountek NeoCd2.0M

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=299-465

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com/ribbon-tweeters/fountek-neocd2.0m-blk-5-ribbon-tweeter-rectangular-flange-black/

[Jeff B.]

Re: Dayton PM180 - New High-End Midrange Driver

Peavey Versarray Ribbon RD1.6 = Fountek NeoCd2.0M

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?partnumber=299-465

http://www.madisoundspeakerstore.com...-flange-black/

I played around with some Fountek Neo Ribbons a while back and wasn't very impressed with how they measured. I don't think I'll go that direction, I think there are other options I would rather entertain.
Jeff