Ess Heil drivers coming back ? available for us diy'ers - Techtalk at Parts-Express.com

jasont · #1 07-16-2008, 12:27 PM

Hi Guys
I'm Jason Terpstra from Tucson AZ at our last diy event http://www.lonesaguaro.com/speakers/...IY08-Gear.html
we had a local guy named Loren come down and bring his Mark & Daniel loudspeakers which he is the US distributor for. We liked them and found
that Mark & Daniel had brought back the Heil air motion driver with huge improvements.

Since the event I have started working for Loren and his distributorship
we have finally talked the owners of M&D (Mark & Daniel) to release the 2 smaller "Dreams"(Directly Responding Emitter by Air Motion Structure)drivers to the diy public.
see details of the drivers here http://www.markdanielofamerica.com/Technology/

I should have my first shipment of these drivers by mid-late August.
I am the only dealer for these drivers so contact me if you are interested.
I will post the details/specs of these drivers as soon as I get them from Mark & Daniel.

feel free to contact me
jterpstra@markdanielofamerica.com
jterpstra@cox.net

Thanks
Jason Terpstra

NoBS · #2 07-16-2008, 12:59 PM

Wow cool, blatant corporate spam. Can Jeff from PE shill his companies products on your website?

jasont · #3 07-16-2008, 01:05 PM

Actually this isnt spam at all.
I thought people would be interested and I know so many diy'ers that enjoy the ess Heil drivers and look for them on Ebay all of the time.
I'm not here to make money I'm here to share a killer technology that has been brought back.
If you will look at the first link that shows me and my own speakers at the diy event that Lou was kind enough to post on his site I think you would be able to tell this wasn't spam or bs .

I'm just trying to help out.
I've been hanging around this forum since 2006

Jason

jasont · #4 07-16-2008, 01:15 PM

Also If you will go to the DIY link I posted and click on the "click here for the people" you will notice that up top it says my wife and I hosted the event and if you go to the second picture down you will see my wife and I sitting there talking.
also the speaker designs 1,2,3,8,9,12 are all my designs.
Just thought I would share that.

Jason

NoBS · #5 07-16-2008, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasont

I'm not here to make money I'm here to share a killer technology that has been brought back.

Cool you're selling them at cost? ....That's mighty nice of you....

Quote:

I think you would be able to tell this wasn't spam

Quote:

I should have my first shipment of these drivers by mid-late August.
I am the only dealer for these drivers so contact me if you are interested.
I will post the details/specs of these drivers as soon as I get them from Mark & Daniel.

feel free to contact me
jterpstra@markdanielofamerica.com

Sort of smells like spam...

FWIW, your identical post on AVS was deleted since they thought it was spam

Angaria · #6 07-16-2008, 03:00 PM

At the same time, given the structure of this forum, I'm not sure where else he could have posted it. The original Heil drivers are rather rare and pricey ($400 for the last pair I had) so this *could* be interesting.

Jed K. · #7 07-16-2008, 03:16 PM

Looks like a Mundorf or Eton clone. Far from an ESS AMT1 head. Too bad they have that ugly logo on the front. I'd be interested if they are less than $100 and have a useable FR to 2k.

dlneubec · #8 07-16-2008, 03:49 PM

It looks nothing like the old ESS AMT1 (which is not a bad thing), but their site suggests it can cover frequencies from as low as 500hz to 35000 hz. If it does anything close to that, with good frequency response, power handling, sensitivity and distortion, it would open up all kinds of possibilities that we don't have now in a single driver and would certainly be worth more than your typical mid to high end midrange or tweeter. They don't show it in a dipole setup, so I wonder about that too. I'd certainly like to hear more!

jasont · #9 07-16-2008, 04:45 PM

ok no again its not spam guys lol
Yes they are the same folded design as a heil driver magnetically controlled in a different but better fashion.
I'm not sure if the drivers will come with the logo or not I will look into it for you.

The models I will be selling are the 2 you see when you first get to the home page they are the DM-4 and DM-5 drivers.
the DM-4 driver is capable of 800hz-23000hz
The DM-5 driver is capable of 1100-25000hz
look at their crossover fr
http://www.markdanielofamerica.com/Maximus_Mini/
http://www.markdanielofamerica.com/i...&id=9&Itemid=9

These drivers are great for keeping the crossover frequency out of the vocal range which is exactly why M&D designed them.
You must hear them to believe them.

I just talked to Josh at Madisound and am trying to get him a pair to play with so they see what I'm selling. He is also ok with my Thread in their forum so that one wont be getting deleted.

I'm waiting on a call back from Jeff with Parts Express so I can discuss them with him as well.

The drivers should be cheaper than the Heil drivers and arent nearly as picky or unreliable.
I have already run tests on the drivers to see how they react to different crossovers and they sound excellent with any crossover I have tried them with.

I am a series crossover nut and was very surprised to see how well these drivers worked with a series network @900hz

Jason

jasont · #10 07-16-2008, 04:50 PM

Dan
I forgot to mention they are bipolar drivers open at both ends.

LouC · #11 07-16-2008, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasont

Hi Guys
I'm Jason Terpstra from Tucson AZ at our last diy event http://www.lonesaguaro.com/speakers/...IY08-Gear.html
we had a local guy named Loren come down and bring his Mark & Daniel loudspeakers which he is the US distributor for. We liked them and found
that Mark & Daniel had brought back the Heil air motion driver with huge improvements.

We all listened to the Mark & Daniel's. Very impressive for such a tiny box. The company is HQ'd here in Tucson. But I suspect most of their sales are overseas. Many of us commented that the DIY community would probably love to play with these. The owners were pretty cool guys.

I doubt there's a huge market, but Jason took the point on working the DIY end of it. He's the only guy I know who builds more boxes than I do.

jasont · #12 07-16-2008, 04:54 PM

Nobs
No I'm not selling them at cost.
and if they deleted the post thats their loss.
like I said I will get you guys all of the exact details as soon as the manufacture releases them to me.

Here is Mark&Daniels Manufacture site
http://www.mark-daniel.com/

Jed K. · #13 07-16-2008, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasont

Dan
I forgot to mention they are bipolar drivers open at both ends.

So is Eton ER4 but it really isn't useable that way.

Maybe these drivers are different but I doubt it given the tiny magnet structure compared to the Heil AMT1s.

nick29498141 · #14 07-16-2008, 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoBS

Cool you're selling them at cost? ....That's mighty nice of you....

Sort of smells like spam...

FWIW, your identical post on AVS was deleted since they thought it was spam

Hey Capitan "9 Posts" :

It's not "spam" it's a "heads-up" for an upcoming product.. If PE disapproves of it (which they still may) the thread would've been gone.

jasont · #15 07-16-2008, 05:04 PM

Here is a paste from their website for those of you that dont like clicking on links.

The DM-4 Dreams driver was developed to be a universal wideband sound module to meet general applications with best Cost/Performance value and outstanding sound reproduction compared to most any ribbon speaker; DM-4 can also be modified into a high-efficiency driver for PA or pro audio applications.

The DM-4 has a very large diaphragm (30X more than a typical 1” dome tweeter), composed of 32 units of lightweight micro-elements, and a total of 14 units of NdFeB strong magnets; typical DC impedance of the DM-4 is around 4 to 6.5 ohms depending on different versions with high power handling, resistive throughout audio band, without resonance, and without inductive or capacitive coloration characteristics.

DM-4 is responsible from 750Hz up to 25 KHz with low FMD pollution, high output, and satisfactory dispersion characteristics over the complete operating band; the recommended crossover frequency may be chosen in between 750Hz to 1.5 KHz, depending on individual system design. A general purpose DM-4 has the efficiency around to 88dB/2.83V/1m in average. The module is sized (H) 122mm x (W) 88mm x (D) 27mm, and the iron frame is rigid and heavy in construction with each module weighing up to 760g (1.7 lb).

dlneubec · #16 07-16-2008, 06:49 PM

I'm very interested, so I hope this thread stands! These could present some great opportunities.

Wolf · #17 07-17-2008, 02:22 AM

I think those might be interesting as well!
Wolf

Some Guy · #18 07-17-2008, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jasont

Hi Guys
I'm Jason Terpstra from Tucson AZ at our last diy event http://www.lonesaguaro.com/speakers/...IY08-Gear.html
we had a local guy named Loren come down and bring his Mark & Daniel loudspeakers which he is the US distributor for. We liked them and found
that Mark & Daniel had brought back the Heil air motion driver with huge improvements.

Oddly enough, there is someone else working on new and improved versions of Dr. Oskar Heil's AMT drivers using rare earth magnets. That would be...me.

Between tornadoes, surgeries, thefts and various other things which have diverted attention, I've been examining Dr. Heil's (expired) patents, examining various real-world examples of ESS Heil drivers and just generally working on the technology. My short term plans are just to get it right with both small (think "ESS Performance Series") and large (think "Grand Heil" from the ESS AMT series) versions of these drivers using rare earth (high strength) magnets.

In any case, congrats on the new venture. A world with Heil AMT's is a world where better sound is possible.

Now, all of that said...

I kind of question the idea that Mark&Daniel is getting anything like a real world usable (power limited) response on these driver to 500-750 Hz. I also wonder about the sensitivity at less than 90db/w/m. Old ESS AMT's were considerably more sensitive/efficient yet even then did not make it (usuably) below a Khz or so, even in the large "Grand Heil" drivers. 500 Hz seems like a sure recipe for blown traces on the folded diaphragms. Curious to see.

If you guys have the tech and the price right, I may just need to fold shop before I ever open. How do I get a pair for testing?

ajinfla · #19 07-17-2008, 07:59 AM

It'll cost you a pretty penny, but...99db/w and 80w above 1k...yummy..

http://www.usspeaker.com/beyma%20tpl150-1.htm

http://profesional.beyma.com/ingles/pdf/TPL150.pdf

Directivity reasonable up to 10k. I would love to see some off axis for the M&D driver(s).

cheers,

AJ

neildavis · #20 07-17-2008, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Some Guy

Oddly enough, there is someone else working on new and improved versions of Dr. Oskar Heil's AMT drivers using rare earth magnets. That would be...me.

Do you have that Audio Amateur article published back in 1977 on the DIY Heil? Lots of ideas for magnet structures. The 22" version is pretty cool, too. Done back when rare earth magnets were expensive and alnico slugs could be recovered from magnetrons used in jamming equipment.