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So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

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  • So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

    So, my brother brought over over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers from the club for me to take a look at them.

    Three of speakers had original crossovers, all of which were damaged and burnt, likely due to excessive power being applied to them (the PSX-153 is rated at 600 watts PEAK)

    One of the speakers was fitted with a generic, and likely very unsuitable, crossover. The original crossover likely suffered the fate of the three mentioned above.

    We took the speakers apart, and we were able to salvage three woofers, three midrange drivers and three tweeters from the four speakers. The remaining drivers were blown.

    New crossovers can apparently be purchased online for the PSX-153. Apparently the original crossover had a “flaw” and the new ones have a “daughterboard”, which is basically a mini crossover that connects between the main board and the midrange. The new crossovers can be purchased online from www.speakerrepair.com for about $150 each. Three of the speakers can be returned to service almost immediately if three of these crossovers are purchased and used to replace the damaged ones.

    It may likely be possible however to manually build replacement crossovers using components from Madisound or Parts Express. Of course the schematic for the original crossover will have to be sourced (or worked out from the burnt ones).

    Of the blown speakers, replacement midrange (MR-65A) and replacement diaphragm for the tweeter (CD44C) can be sourced from www.speakerrepair.com for about $70 and $60 respectively. Of course a new crossover will be needed too, bringing the total to $280. Considering that the woofer also needs to be replaced, it may be best to simply buy a new speaker (or two, considering one of the other PSX-153 speakers left at the club is basically an empty shell). Alternatively, I'm thinking that the two empty shells can be used to build two new speakers using parts from Parts Express. I'm interested in doing this, particularly if can be done and produce similar performance to the originals at a fairly cheap cost. That said, does any one have any plans or suggestions for a decent two-way or three-way that I can fit into the shell of a PSX-153?
    Last edited by Brian Steele; 10-03-2011, 04:37 PM.
    Brian Steele
    www.diysubwoofers.org

  • #2
    Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

    Some pictures...


    Picture 1 - One of the empty shells. Those iddy-biddy holes at the bottom seem to tune the box somewhere between 42~45 Hz. No, the opening for the midrange/tweeter unit at the top isn't square.



    Picture 2 - One of the 15" drivers, model number FR-15B



    Picture 3 - One of the midrange / tweeter units (front)



    Picture 4 - One of the midrange / tweeter units (rear)



    Picture 5 - One of the burnt-out crossovers. I was wrong - there is inline protection, which apparently didn't help here. The crossover has also been worked on previously - that cap hanging off the side is definitely not stock, and all the output leads have been cut and rejoined for some reason.
    Brian Steele
    www.diysubwoofers.org

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    • #3
      Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

      Since you are dealing with 4 speakers total and you are rebuilding only 1 completely and only the crossover of the other 3 I personally would use all original parts as mentioned even though they are a bit pricey.

      Fitting anything else into that mid-horn could be a nightmare.
      Can "one" do better starting from scratch? Yes, but not at that price imho.
      Two very good sociological markers.
      The state of our public wash rooms.
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      • #4
        Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

        Originally posted by Music is life View Post
        Since you are dealing with 4 speakers total and you are rebuilding only 1 completely and only the crossover of the other 3 I personally would use all original parts as mentioned even though they are a bit pricey.

        Fitting anything else into that mid-horn could be a nightmare.
        Can "one" do better starting from scratch? Yes, but not at that price imho.
        Actually it's six in total. My brother brought four faulty ones over. Back at the club he left a working one and one that was just a shell (apparently someone had taken it apart and they havent found the components yet).

        I plan to restore three of them to service by fixing or replacing the crossovers (which means four working in total), and use the shells from the other two to make something a bit different.

        I managed to fix one of the crossovers today. The impedance response of the speaker with the crossover in place is interesting to say the least. I'll cover it in another post.
        Brian Steele
        www.diysubwoofers.org

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        • #5
          Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...



          Above is the impedance response of one of the PSX-153 speakers with the crossover fixed (I borrowed parts from each crossover to get one working).

          I was a bit concerned about the dip to 3 ohms between 100 Hz and 300 Hz (the PSX-153 is rated at 8 Ohms) and thought I might have got the fix wrong, but the working one measures the same. Is this "normal" for pro audio speakers?
          Last edited by Brian Steele; 10-02-2011, 12:40 PM.
          Brian Steele
          www.diysubwoofers.org

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          • #6
            Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

            Originally posted by Brian Steele View Post
            http://grooble/diysubwoofers/misc/images/psx-153/20111001-psx-153-6.jpg
            The web address you entered could not be found

            I was a bit concerned about the dip to 3 ohms between 100 Hz and 300 Hz (the PSX-153 is rated at 8 Ohms) and thought I might have got the fix wrong, but the working one measures the same. Is this "normal" for pro audio speakers?
            No. It means it's a 4 ohm load or a defective crossover. Everything about those cabs just screams 'cheap'.
            www.billfitzmaurice.com
            www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

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            • #7
              Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

              Originally posted by billfitzmaurice View Post
              The web address you entered could not be found

              No. It means it's a 4 ohm load or a defective crossover. Everything about those cabs just screams 'cheap'.
              Well, they're not the most expensive full range pro audio cabinets out there, but they don't look that cheaply built either. The main problem seems to be the crossover - seems strange for a 600W peak cabinet to find 10W in-line attenuation resistors in the midrange circuit. I believe CV did provide an upgraded version of the x-over, but the primary component of the upgrade seems to be two lamps in series with the midrange output from the x-over.

              Maybe I should just scrap the x-overs. and rebuild ones from scratch with better components...
              Brian Steele
              www.diysubwoofers.org

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              • #8
                Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                Originally posted by Brian Steele View Post

                Maybe I should just scrap the x-overs. and rebuild ones from scratch with better components...
                I would. While you're at it the tuning is really messed up. There should be nowhere near as much variation in the impedance peaks above and below Fb. Even a 2:1 ratio would be excessive, let alone 4:1.
                www.billfitzmaurice.com
                www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

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                • #9
                  Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                  Originally posted by billfitzmaurice View Post
                  I would.
                  One thing I'm looking at is inserting more protection into the x-over to protect it from the idiot DJs at the club. The x-over currently has two
                  "lamps" in series with the tweeter, and no protection in place for the midrange. As the speakers survived and the x-over died, I suspect something a bit more is needed. With a little bit of modification work, I can fit one of those "speaker circuit breaker" things between the +ve terminal and the rest of the x-over, or, with a bit more work, I can fit one in that protects only the midrange and tweeter sections. How does one go about choosing a correctly-sized one though?


                  Originally posted by billfitzmaurice View Post
                  While you're at it the tuning is really messed up. There should be nowhere near as much variation in the impedance peaks above and below Fb. Even a 2:1 ratio would be excessive, let alone 4:1.
                  While the speaker might be tuned for a bit of a bump in the bass area (they do sound pretty good with hard rock like AC/DC's "Back in Black"), Fb might actually be shifted upwards a bit - I noticed that the bludy pole mounts for the speakers are broken off, so there's another hole at the bottom acting as a vent too. Once I fix that, I'll remeasure to see if that makes much difference.
                  Brian Steele
                  www.diysubwoofers.org

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                  • #10
                    Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                    Originally posted by Brian Steele View Post
                    While the speaker might be tuned for a bit of a bump in the bass area (they do sound pretty good with hard rock like AC/DC's "Back in Black"), Fb might actually be shifted upwards a bit - I noticed that the bludy pole mounts for the speakers are broken off, so there's another hole at the bottom acting as a vent too. Once I fix that, I'll remeasure to see if that makes much difference.
                    It just occurred to me that there might be another reason why the upper impedance peak is not as high as expected - the cabinet may be not be properly braced. There's a front to back brace, but not a side to side brace, and even when driven with just 25W, the sides were vibrating a bit too much for my liking. I'll repeat the impedance test tomorrow while bracing the sides to see if that has any impact.
                    Brian Steele
                    www.diysubwoofers.org

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                    • #11
                      Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                      Originally posted by billfitzmaurice View Post
                      Everything about those cabs just screams 'cheap'.
                      They seem fairly decent to me, what about them seems so cheap to you?

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                      • #12
                        Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                        Originally posted by Brian Steele View Post
                        I can fit one of those "speaker circuit breaker" things between the +ve terminal and the rest of the x-over, or, with a bit more work, I can fit one in that protects only the midrange and tweeter sections. How does one go about choosing a correctly-sized one though?
                        IME they don't work well enough to bother with. They either kick in too early or too late. Active limiting is the only way to idiot proof gear, and only when the limiters and amps are kept under lock and key.

                        They seem fairly decent to me, what about them seems so cheap to you?
                        All the crossover components are way undersized, while the port size and impedance charts reveal a poorly engineered design. And not a brace is in sight.
                        www.billfitzmaurice.com
                        www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

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                        • #13
                          Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                          FWIW: CV has not been known for making upper tier products.
                          They serve a market niche ( I suppose ).
                          As Bill noted: The performance curve for a circuit breaker is not compatible with the manner in which a tweeter is likely to be (ab)used.
                          The inductors look like they would saturate under higher wattage.
                          And they use NP 'lytics - as cheap as it's gets.

                          I would not be entirely surprised by low impedance points, because of the way "nominal" rating are often derived. ( Could be a design flaw )
                          "Not a Speaker Designer - Not even on the Internet"
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                          • #14
                            Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                            Originally posted by Sydney View Post
                            I would not be entirely surprised by low impedance points, because of the way "nominal" rating are often derived. ( Could be a design flaw )
                            Assuming that they use 8 ohm drivers that have a minimum DCR of 5 ohms the only way that 3 ohm region can be explained is by a flawed crossover design.
                            www.billfitzmaurice.com
                            www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

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                            • #15
                              Re: So, my brother brought over 4 blown Cerwin-Vega Pro Stax PSX-153 speakers...

                              Originally posted by Brian Steele View Post
                              It just occurred to me that there might be another reason why the upper impedance peak is not as high as expected - the cabinet may be not be properly braced. There's a front to back brace, but not a side to side brace, and even when driven with just 25W, the sides were vibrating a bit too much for my liking. I'll repeat the impedance test tomorrow while bracing the sides to see if that has any impact.
                              I just did a quick test - the impedance does change a bit when I add additional bracing to the box (I basically turned it on its side and sat on it, LOL), but the upper impedance peak actually went DOWN, which was a bit unexpected.

                              The bass driver appears to be a low Fs, low Qes, High Vas driver. Qe checks in around 0.30 and Fs at 31 Hz. Haven't measured Vas yet (I need to find a suitable container to act as a test box).
                              Brian Steele
                              www.diysubwoofers.org

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