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Finalist speakers, Tower version. Advice needed concerning TL vs Ported

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  • Jim Holtz
    replied
    To clarify, the TL cabinet design is different from the monitor size cabinet I designed, Both will work perfect and some things will interchange but the overall dimensions, cabinet width and depth are different as well as the internal bracing. If you got the flat pack from Leland, he does know what he's doing.He just cut it to the TL spec rather than the monitor cabinet that I posted. The monitor is assembled the way I do it, the TL would be assembled the way Paul would do it. Nothing wrong with either one but you can't mix the two together.

    Jim

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  • Steve Lee
    replied
    Sorry for your troubles, man.

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  • Paperweight
    replied
    Call me the slow kid but I just now measured the dimentions of the cabinet kit I received. After I failed to get it together correctly and tore it apart in a rage, it sat off to the side until I tried to salvage some unglued parts from it for attempt number two.

    Inner front baffle and Back panel: 43 1/4" X 9 1/2" 3/4" thick, 2 per speaker >> 12 1/2" x 42 1/4" < sides sit on the back of the front panel (Very odd)
    Outer front baffle: 44 3/4" X 11" ** 1/2" thick **, 1 per speaker >> 12 1/2" x 43 3/4"
    Side Panels: 44 3/4" X 15" 3/4" thick, 2 per speaker >> 13 1/2 x 42 1/4" < He had these sitting on the top and bottom panels instead of covering them
    Top and Bottom panel: 9 1/2" X 15" 3/4" thick, 2 per speaker >> 12 1/2" x 15"
    PVC support panels: 9 1/2" X 7 1/2" 3/4" thick, 2 per speaker >> 7" x 11 1/16"
    Inner Solid panel for top of woofer section: 13 1/2" X 9 1/2" 3/4: thick, 1 per speaker >> 11 1/16" x 13 1/2"
    ML-TL main center panel: 24 7/8" X 9 1/2" 3/4" thick, 1 per speaker >> 11 1/16" x 24 7/8"
    Window Braces: 9 1/2" X 6 3/8" 3/4" thick, 4 per speaker >> 6 3/8' x 11 1/16"

    The dimentions on the left are correct, I believe. The dimentions on the right are what I received in a flatpack kit. The front and side panels are supposed to be assembled in the opposite way the Finalists/Travelers are assembled according to the pocket screw holes and biscuit cuts (that were off by 1/16" I might add). I'm just like wow, really? Were we looking at the same cabinet plans? It's all very weird and troubling.

    Lesson learned, never ever have someone build a cabinet kit without a cut list and dimentional drawing if they have never done it before. I didn't know turning a simple 3- way speaker plan into a floor standing speaker would go so off the rails.

    I'm glad I went and bought some plywood to try this myself. It can't possibly go any worse.
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-14-2021, 10:37 AM.

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  • Paperweight
    replied
    What kind of pad is used in between the top and bottom enclosures for the Bordeaux speakers?

    I'm really liking the idea of separating the top and bottom halves of this floor standing version of the Travelers. The woofer is already enclosed. It seems there would be just enough room to include a 1/4" panel in the bottom of the tweeter/mid half if you take a 1/4" off the bottom of the mid tunnel braces. Oddly enough, the inspiration came to me looking at the tunnel braces my cabinet guy cut 9 1/2" x 7". Hey I can still use these.

    Edit: Ha, he cut them 7" x 11 1/16"
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-11-2021, 09:43 PM.

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  • Paperweight
    replied
    Thank you, that is the final bit of info I needed.

    This might end up working out. Got a chance to try out the Jasper 280 Pro circle jig. It works really well.
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-11-2021, 12:27 AM.

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  • Jim Holtz
    replied
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    Originally posted by Paperweight View Post
    1. So it's ok if the front and rear PVC support braces are cut clean through? No more 1/2" recess with 1/4" left for the mid-tunnel to sit in/on? Just a simple 6 5/8" hole cut in the centers of each 9 1/2" X 7 1/2" PVC support brace?

    Any transition need to be shaped behind the driver?

    2. A simple 6" hole is all you need then in the back panel?

    I'm terribly sorry for all the pedantic trouble. Even I hate myself at this point. If I told someone to leave out the 7" recess, they probably wouldn't cut anything out at all without being told exactly. Think Amelia Bedelia and literal thinking.
    Just a simple 6 5/8" hole through the support braces which should exactly fit 6" PVC external dimensions available at most home stores like Home Depot etc. I always do a 3/4" roundover on the inside of the inner front baffle for a smooth transition. You can also do a 45 degree angle cut if you prefer. Just make it flare into the into the PVC from the front baffle. I usually just cut a rough hole in the back panel in the middle of the mid PVC tunnel and then use a flush trim bit to create a perfect hole in the back.

    Forget about all the recesses that applied to the Finalists, they are are not used or needed on the Travelers.

    I'll try to get a picture of the mid tube stuffing when I get time and post it.

    Jim
    Last edited by Jim Holtz; 04-07-2021, 10:28 PM.

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  • Paperweight
    commented on 's reply
    I was talking about the back panel. The arrow is pointing at the back of the front panel.

  • Paperweight
    replied
    1. So it's ok if the front and rear PVC support braces are cut clean through? No more 1/2" recess with 1/4" left for the mid-tunnel to sit in/on? Just a simple 6 5/8" hole cut in the centers of each 9 1/2" X 7 1/2" PVC support brace?

    Any transition need to be shaped behind the driver?

    2. A simple 6" hole is all you need then in the back panel?

    I'm terribly sorry for all the pedantic trouble. Even I hate myself at this point. If I told someone to leave out the 7" recess, they probably wouldn't cut anything out at all without being told exactly. Think Amelia Bedelia and literal thinking.
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-07-2021, 05:04 PM.

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  • Jim Holtz
    replied
    Originally posted by sam View Post

    The Travelers are similar to the Finalists in mounting the 6" PVC. Perhaps this is what the recess refers to. The area that accepts the 6" PVC pipe.
    Just ignore the external mid tube recess which was for the mid tube plug that is not used on the Travelers.

    Here are the key notes from the documentation;

    1. The 6 5/8” OD PVC pipe is cut to 13 ½” in length to allow it to butt against the inner front and rear
    baffles and be glued in place. The inner front and rear PVC support panels position them and provide a solid front/rear connection when they and the PVC are all glued together.
    2. Ignore the 7” ( ½”) recess cutout. It was originally intended for an option on the Finalist cabinet to
    plug the mid but no closed back mid crossover was designed for the Travelers so don’t cut the Travelers Speakers Cabinet Drawing-updated.pdf recess.
    3. Holes in window brace are flexible – please just leave 2inches on the front/back/sides for rigidity
    4. Port size is 2.5inches in diameter and 7 3/4in in length

    Also Curt posted a TL cabinet for those that were interested for the Finalist long ago that should help in the layout. I've never built a TL cabinet so I don't know if Curt's or Pauls are different. Check with Paul for that.

    HTH

    Jim
    Attached Files

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  • sam
    replied
    [QUOTE=
    ***Still not sure where this recess in the back panel is to tell someone to leave it out. Is it on the inside or out? Depth and a recess are so hard to guage in a non-exploded drawing where everything is assembled already. There's 3 or 4 edges to try to squint at and make sense of on that back panel.

    Is this recess for the mid plug (not going to use it, just need to know where it is so I understand this clearly when it gets messed up again) cut from the outside of the back panel? Depth of 1/2" x 1/2" wide leaving a 1/4" thick lip? Almost need a machinist drawing of the piece to figure this out..[/QUOTE]

    The Travelers are similar to the Finalists in mounting the 6" PVC. Perhaps this is what the recess refers to. The area that accepts the 6" PVC pipe.

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  • Paperweight
    replied
    One other thing I noticed while perusing over the Finalists and Travelers cabinet drawings. The Finalists specifies a 13" PVC pipe while the Travelers states a 13 1/2" pipe. Both have the same internal width of 13 1/2" front to back. I understand the 13" pipe length used in the Finalists if both the front and back braces have a 1/4" lip the PVC pipe sits on. Is this not the same in the Travelers? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

    ***Still not sure where this recess in the back panel is to tell someone to leave it out. Is it on the inside or out? Depth, width and a recess are so hard to guage in a non-exploded drawing where everything is assembled already. There's 3 or 4 edges to try to squint at and make sense of on that back panel.

    Is this recess for the mid plug (not going to use it, just need to know where it is so I understand this clearly when it gets messed up again) cut from the outside of the back panel? Depth of 1/2" x 1/2" wide leaving a 1/4" thick lip? Almost need a machinist drawing of the piece to figure this out.

    I think my cabinet guy might have cut that part out when I really didn't need it. Go figure.

    Looked at what he cut. Appears to be a 7" hole with 1/2" deep recess, 1" wide. So I assume without that, it is just a plain 6" hole?
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-07-2021, 01:07 PM.

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  • Jim Holtz
    replied
    Originally posted by Paperweight View Post
    Also a question for Jim Holtz if he is around. Meniscus sent a printed instruction sheet that is copy pasted from the Finalist speakers. It includes the bit about plugging the mid tunnel and the recess on the back panel for that. I believe I have seen you say somewhere that was not an option for the Travelers design. How should the PVC tunnel be mounted between and inside the support braces (caulking or weather stripping for air seal?) and what is the proper material and way of stuffing the mid tunnel to stop standing waves? Thanks!
    Sorry, I've been in Arizona for the last couple months and just returned home.

    So to answer your question, the mid tunnel is attached the same as the Finalist and is glued in place with the support. The difference is, the Travelers do not have the option of a closed back mid so the recess is not necessary. The stuffing instructions should have been included in the kit. If not, email me and I'll get yu the info.
    HTH

    Jim

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  • Paperweight
    commented on 's reply
    I didn't know it was supposed to be in the front half only. Thanks for that tip. I assume an even spread across the front. Anything special for treatment behind the woofer?
    Last edited by Paperweight; 04-06-2021, 10:36 PM.

  • Paperweight
    replied
    I'm not a woodworker so I need some clarity on a couple of points to help explain what is needed when I find someone to cut this out correctly for the second time.

    Under the key notes on the instruction sheet

    1. There is a 1/2 inch recess in the mid-tunnel brace to counter-sink the 6 inch PVC pipe.

    Which brace is that? The one in the front or the back of the cabinet? Apparently that was confusing or completely ignored by my cabinet guy. He just cut 6 5/8" holes through both braces clean through along with cutting the braces 9 1/2" x 7" instead of the required 9 1/2" X 7 1/2". I'm still shaking my head on that.

    2. There is a 1/2" recess in the mid-tunnel cutout in the rear baffle (in case you want to plug the mid-tunnel)

    Is this on the inside or outside of the back panel? Might seem like a dumb question but after the relatively simple braces were cut wrong, it is worth asking to save on further mistakes. I most likely won't plug the tunnel though.

    Any clarity on both questions would be appreciated. A photo of properly cut braces and a properly routed back panel would be worth it's weight in gold.

    Thanks

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  • Paul K.
    commented on 's reply
    For the ML-TL compartment, the dimensions shown on your drawing match those on my drawing I included early in this thread. Don't forget that the front half of the folded line is filled with polyester fiber top to bottom at a density of 0.75 lb/ft3.Paul
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