C-Note excursion

[djg]

You have good ears. Please consider a 2.1 PC system, you'll thank me. YT has video though, which I enjoy. Especially live music.

Remember this one?

https://music.amazon.com/search/comp...Cfalse&sc=none

[JoeC]

Try this jazz on your system, see what you think.

Although I get no distortion it sounds harsh with the highs and lows...
Personally I really prefer this type of Jazz....
https://music.amazon.com/albums/B003AXJ2G2

In case you do not have an Amazon account....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9xtkAZSK50

Edit: If you compare the Amazon audio quality to the You Tube audio quality.... You'll know that You Tube sux for audio.

[djg]

DSOM would sound much better with a 2.1 system.

Try this jazz on your system, see what you think.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ji5Y65xz7wA

[JoeC]

1. Whoops, I thought you didn't like how the 25watt amp sounded and prefered the Technic...my bad.
2. It's only ~$3 and will work to protect any speakers from over-excursion below 40hz, but the capacitor value/uF does depend on the reciever input impedance (which is usually listed in the full manual)
3. Isn't that how they're always used? I'm not sure how that hurts or affects anything, maybe I'm misunderstanding something here?

More efficient speakers won't necessarily result in more or less excursion from deep bass, it's more about motor strength VS weight VS suspension I think....and on top of that it'll also depend a lot on the usually unlisted XMEC spec that warns when/where the driver will crash and start to damage from over-excursion.
Mostly just warning that focusing on a higher-efficiency speaker will probably not help directly, it may still break at the same too-low output volume even though it otherwise has more to give when protected from deep bass.
More efficient will obviously still help if you're looking for something louder, but I think you'll likely only find stuff that's 2-4db more efficient at best (unless they're either lying or skipping some BSC which will give them louder mids/highs but weak low-mids and bass). That's a noticeable amount, but not a huge increase if these were way too quiet.

Let us know if the new pair sound similar to the old ones (before the break) or if they're noticeably louder or deeper or anything. You might also want to let them break-in for a few days before judging the bass too harshly.

Thank you for your generous help.
One thing I know I'm not going to do is to crank these up. The old pair did have some distortion but only on the heartbeat of the intro to Pink Floyd's Dark Side of the Moon. At that time I thought it was just some kinda fluke or weird thing with a recording because all of my other music sounded o.k. And the rest of the album sounded o.k. with bass too. I can not recall when I listened to this recording. The distortion only got worse with time to a point where everything started to distort. So... of course the first thing I did with the new woofers was to play some Pink Floyd. the new speakers sound good on the intro with no distortion.

I physically inspected the spiders with a strong led flash light and a large magnifying glass, looks o.k. and when I gently push evenly on the cone it sounds o.k. but when I push on just one side it does scratch. The spider moves with the cone evenly too. When I put my ohm meter on the speaker to check the voice coil, it measures 7 ohms.
This is the reason as to why I'm so perplexed as to the failure. I believe it could be more possible that I stretched the spiders and surrounds, but everybody states that ....that does not happen

Edit: yes... caps are cheap but my last purchase of two .22 mfd caps cost me nearly $10. with tax and ship costs. There are no local places left to buy caps in my area

[JoeC]

I have a spec sheet of this receiver that I found on line but no date as of yet

[LOUT]

#1. I previously stated I do not like the way that the Technics receiver sounds
#2. I'm not going to spend any more $$$ on these speakers
#3. I already stated I use the AUX from my DAC to the receiver
If I over excurt these speakers, I'll get new speakers that are more efficient off a shelf.
If this receiver's a/c input is rated @ 300w. It might be that the mfgr rated this receiver as 27w x 4 outputs. That would make this really a 108(ish?) watt receiver? Running just two speakers on A channel might mean that it is really outputting 54wpc. That would explain as to why they sound good. As stated by myself and others, a 25wpc receiver does not provide enough power for these speakers to sound decent.
Although I could totally be out in left field on this idea....I am just an audio noob.

1. Whoops, I thought you didn't like how the 25watt amp sounded and prefered the Technic...my bad.
2. It's only ~$3 and will work to protect any speakers from over-excursion below 40hz, but the capacitor value/uF does depend on the reciever input impedance (which is usually listed in the full manual)
3. Isn't that how they're always used? I'm not sure how that hurts or affects anything, maybe I'm misunderstanding something here?

More efficient speakers won't necessarily result in more or less excursion from deep bass, it's more about motor strength VS weight VS suspension I think....and on top of that it'll also depend a lot on the usually unlisted XMEC spec that warns when/where the driver will crash and start to damage from over-excursion.
Mostly just warning that focusing on a higher-efficiency speaker will probably not help directly, it may still break at the same too-low output volume even though it otherwise has more to give when protected from deep bass.
More efficient will obviously still help if you're looking for something louder, but I think you'll likely only find stuff that's 2-4db more efficient at best (unless they're either lying or skipping some BSC which will give them louder mids/highs but weak low-mids and bass). That's a noticeable amount, but not a huge increase if these were way too quiet.

Let us know if the new pair sound similar to the old ones (before the break) or if they're noticeably louder or deeper or anything. You might also want to let them break-in for a few days before judging the bass too harshly.

[JoeC]

#1. I previously stated I do not like the way that the Technics receiver sounds
#2. I'm not going to spend any more $$$ on these speakers
#3. I already stated I use the AUX from my DAC to the receiver
If I over excurt these speakers, I'll get new speakers that are more efficient off a shelf.
If this receiver's a/c input is rated @ 300w. It might be that the mfgr rated this receiver as 27w x 4 outputs. That would make this really a 108(ish?) watt receiver? Running just two speakers on A channel might mean that it is really outputting 54wpc. That would explain as to why they sound good. As stated by myself and others, a 25wpc receiver does not provide enough power for these speakers to sound decent.
Although I could totally be out in left field on this idea....I am just an audio noob.

[LOUT]

If you like the Cnotes with that Technics SA EX140 receiver, you might want to buy a pair of 0.22uF capacitors to add one inline with each Left/Right channel of the input you're using (you can splice right into the wire running from your DAC to the reciever if you want). Something like a pair of these:
https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton...acitor-027-454

That should keep excursion from really deep bass (under 40hz) much lower while leaving most of the speaker's bass alone...it mostly protects it from bass that you won't really hear it playing.
That's assuming you're using the CD/Tape/VCR input on the reciever, but if you're using the Phono input that would probably prefer a 0.15 or 0.1uF capacitor for similar protection because of its 47k-ohm impedance (the CD/Tape/VRC input resistance is spec'ed at 22k-ohm).

[JoeC]

Not all amps are made, or measured the same, but???

Something about that MCS Receiver... It's rated input is 300 watts. The Scott 325r receiver is rated at 120 watts. I have a Technics SA-EX140 which is a 100wpc receiver and it's input rating is 155 watt. The Harman Kardon AVR 520 receiver in my living room, which is 85wpc has an input power of 260w.

Mrs. C uses the Scott receiver in her sewing room and that is connected to some cheesy Bose speakers, but it sounds o.k. with those speakers.

I recently got that Technics receiver at a garage sale for $5., it was doa when I got it but it only needed a new 5a fuse from the power input and a decent cleaning. Not sure what I'm going to do with it... it is a cheaper model so if I can get $25. out of it I'm ahead

That MCS receiver has a hellava lot of input wattage.

[981CS]

I only have a 2 channel receiver and I''m not going to buy an expensive sub to do that. My DAC (Topping D30) runs from my pc to the aux input on the receiver. I have 15" woofers in my living room, I already stated I do not have the luxury of space in this little office to place a powered subwoofer.
I'll carry on as before and just be aware of the limitations with the volume. If I do blow these speakers...that'll be it. I'm not going to put one more penny into this diy, I have already spent way too much for a "C-Note" I'll get something else off the shelf at a box store, I'm giving up on $$diy$$!

The more I listened to and messed around with the CNotes the more I found them to be somewhat of a conundrum in the since that they are relatively inexpensive and do sound decent (especially given their price), but they aren't for budget or low powered receivers and pairing them with a much nicer receiver seems like a bit of an odd thing to do as well.

They aren't tall, but more of a deep and squatty shape and make for difficult placement on a desktop. I much prefer my overnight sensations both for nearfield and due to the smaller size and the ability to sound good with only 25WPC.

Fun build though, but now I have no clue what to do with them as I have zero practical use for them.

[Kornbread]

"About my system: running audio from my pc via usb to a Topping D30 DAC and connected a Modular Component Systems 3225 receiver rated at 27w per channel."

"I have a 25w vintage Scott receiver. When I first tried that receiver could not push the C-Notes either, and that was when the speakers were brand new. Took about 5 seconds to hear that a 25w receiver wasn't going to work."

Not all amps are made, or measured the same, but???

[djg]

Not at all.

[JoeC]

Can get expensive.

That kinda defeats the purpose of diy don't it?

[djg]

That's too bad. It's a great hobby, not for everyone I guess.

Can get expensive.

[JoeC]

Well, I guess carry on as before and see what happens. If you blow more woofers you'll know something's wrong. I'd still recommend a subwoofer, these are 5" 2 ways. If you had a sub, you wouldn't need the loudness on.

My PC system is a Dayton 8" 250 watt DSP sub, A Schiit USB DAC, and two Outlaw monoblocks. Several 2 way satellite pairs of various woofer sizes. I have never blown any speakers. In my setup, the DSP sub is after the DAC and before the amps. If you did this, there wouldn't be any low freqs sent to your receiver for the loudness control to boost. The sub is built to produce bass, you can turn it up as you wish.

I only have a 2 channel receiver and I''m not going to buy an expensive sub to do that. My DAC (Topping D30) runs from my pc to the aux input on the receiver. I have 15" woofers in my living room, I already stated I do not have the luxury of space in this little office to place a powered subwoofer.
I'll carry on as before and just be aware of the limitations with the volume. If I do blow these speakers...that'll be it. I'm not going to put one more penny into this diy, I have already spent way too much for a "C-Note" I'll get something else off the shelf at a box store, I'm giving up on $$diy$$!