InDIYana 2022; "Missing Link" theme announcement....

[Wolf]

I talked to Chuck tonight, and we are considering the changes.
Craig has a valid point...
Wolf

[skatz]

Did I miss it, do you have date/location already?

[Wolf]

Nope, I'll dial in the venue around December as I usually do.
We usually shoot for April.
Wolf

[ernperkins]

I think blind is an excellent idea and welcome it. You could have a sheet up behind the speakers and table back there. You could just assign a random number to each entry and let people know what the number is for their evaluation feedback forms. If you're not judging/voting, then your bias is eliminated and not of concern in the rankings.

I also think this is an excellent chance to do it blind. We’re only switching xovers instead of entire speakers so this is most likely our one and only chance to have a blind competition. To take it further, I would volunteer to make boxes that the crossovers would fit inside to make sure no one can identify the crossovers. The boxes would just duplicate the banana plugs and have the wiring to connect to the crossovers inside. I’d make two sets so we could prepare one set behind the curtain while the other set is playing. We could also use some resistors instead the actual speakers to test the crossover with the DATS. This would be done behind the curtain while the other set is playing so no time delay. I'll also volunteer to help out behind the curtain.

[PWR RYD]

I had a little extra time today at lunch so I used XSim to model some of my existing project designs that have either a resistor or an LRC directly across the tweeter terminals. Surprising to me there was very little difference with and without that series 100 uF cap Ben and Chuck have proposed. I expected a fairly significant change in phase and some change in frequency response (maybe a dB or two). This was not the case. Maybe a few degrees phase shift and 1/2 dB in FR. The protection cap doesn't seem to be a big deal at all

[Wolf]

Fair enough- the cap stays. =-) No DATS sweep required as long as the schematic is provided as asked.
Wolf

[Wolf]

To take it further, I would volunteer to make boxes that the crossovers would fit inside to make sure no one can identify the crossovers. The boxes would just duplicate the banana plugs and have the wiring to connect to the crossovers inside. I’d make two sets so we could prepare one set behind the curtain while the other set is playing. We could also use some resistors instead the actual speakers to test the crossover with the DATS. This would be done behind the curtain while the other set is playing so no time delay. I'll also volunteer to help out behind the curtain.[/SIZE]

I'm toying with an idea of 'bagging' the xovers. Basically, buy a case of brown-paper bags, and label them A-Z. This would of course mean the size of the boards would be dictated and required. Cheap covers, nothing gets seen during the duration, no swapping needed, and no curtain required.

Wolf

[Wolf]

On the Blind-judging note...
Some prior stated criteria will change for this, but only slightly. See below for proposed addendum.

Okay, perusing through Wally World yielded a pack of 50x Great Value Self Standing Giant Lunch Bags, of the brown-paper variety, and inside measures 6.125" x 4" x 12.375". We will provide these.
I feel these will suit us really easily. This means that xovers should adhere to a 6" x 10" platform to fit the bags, and with a height of 3" or less. If able to cut the 10" dimension down a bit, please do. I also would prefer that the connections be across the short end (6"), so that it is easier to hook them up, and fold them up when done for swapping. (Please keep sharp or pointy surfaces at a minimum to maintain xover anonymity as more pokes = more visible.) Previously stated 4-banana plugs for outputs, and 2 banana jacks for binding posts from the amp still apply here. I feel 12" for plug wires should be plenty, and make sure they are well marked. All speakers will be setup for toe-in, unless marked on the xover boards as such.

A Sharpie for a lottery-drawn letter or number scheme atop the bags will be the MO, and for which entrants will not draw or know their own number. Only one person will have the code key to ensure entrants get their property returned. This way we eliminate the 'voting for a friend' scheme, as no one is the wiser. After the challenge voting concludes, xovers will be laid out for visual perusal.

Coop has offered to do the checking of the xovers both by eye and a DATS sweep to verify operation and safety via an appropriate dummy load. (Again- the 100uF poly cap on the tweeters will remain. I have also done models now, and see that it does not reflect significant issues, but is enough to protect the tweeters should issues arise.)
Nick has offered to be the 3rd party helping swap, as we will need 3 people to run the challenge portion. Chuck will run the remote and head to head brackets while Nick and I man a channel a piece.

Upon figuring out the randomly-entered brackets, and how it will work, there will be a maximum number of entries applied to this challenge. Unfortunately, we cannot do this ad nauseum even as much as we'd like to.

For the international entrants, should you want to enter a design, please contact the "Grand Rapids Distributor" for help in this endeavor. They have graciously offered to assemble a pair of boards for you. More details upon contacting them should you have that itch.

More to come as it is arranged,
Wolf

[Billet]

Do I understand correctly that our crossovers should have approx. 12" long pigtails with banana plugs on the outputs?

[Wolf]

Yep. But that has been the MO since the announcement. The xover has to interface with the cabs, and nanners are the fastest to do without cranking.
It's even in the original writeup to use them, minus maybe the wire length.
Wolf

[jhollander]

The inputs are also banana jacks, so can those be mounted to the x-o board vs. cable? Also I assume we are doing two x-o boards one for each speaker.

[Wolf]

Yes, and yes. Post/jack inputs, approx 12" leads with nanner-plug-ended outputs, and a pair for demo so we can listen to a pair rather than a single. All terminals for use out the short end of the bag.

I am planning on mounting my jacks to the boards as well. Even a mounted terminal cup towards the open end would be cool.

Wolf

[ernperkins]

I think the blind aspect of this get together will make it unique. Looking forward to it!

[PWR RYD]

I think the blind aspect of this get together will make it unique. Looking forward to it!

+1

[Wolf]

Just so everyone knows-
The binding posts in the plates on the rear of the speakers are in the Dayton biamp plates and will not accept dual banana-plugs.

Wolf