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  • dcibel
    replied
    Listening distance should be set to the distance you typically listen, generally 2-3m for most rooms. Simulating at 1m distance can create problems at actual listening distance as Dezzar has found.

    speakers should be designed for flexibility of placement, so design data should be reflection free. Room placement can be addressed by EQ if needed.

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  • rpb
    replied
    About the only thing you can change is the on, and somewhat, the off-axis response. Speaker position in the room can cause reflections to be of short delay, or long. Your brain perceives each slightly differently. Once you have selected drivers, a lot of the off axis response has been determined.. As to distance to the speaker, there may be small changes in diffraction that are probably meaningless..

    AS DeZZar stated, the driver summation can change with distance. It's a geometry thing. For the sim, I'd probably optimize for 2m.

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  • DeZZar
    replied
    Originally posted by zinger084 View Post
    however, another item Dezzar mentioned... listening distance. how does everyone design/take into account their components on speakers that may be flexible in a space?
    I had mine set to 1m...which I could be wrong about...my theory is that I want to model against how I will eventually measure for as close as possible results. I've never really paid too much attention to this aspect as I always measure, tweak, measure tweak (repeat) until I'm satisfied with the result and the simulation becomes less important at that point.

    If you increase the listening distance in the simulation to say 2.5m you start to get a dip at the crossover point. Not a significant one, and you can tweak the values to flatten it out, the big question being which values would you run with when relying solely on a simulation?

    Interested in what others views on this are.

    zinger084 either way it's going to be a lot better than a pre made two way crossover ;)

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  • DeZZar
    commented on 's reply
    That's a "target" you can setup. You can tilt it down/up, set a level etc which acts as a bit of a guide and the system uses it in some of the automated optimisations. You might notice in mine it's just a flat line at 85db. Not sure what Zinger has setup here.

  • zinger084
    replied
    well here is the fix... it ended up being a non-connected wire that wasn't showing red, as if it was open either, over the notch near the 2.2. note to self... draw each wire node to node and when adding components, erase that area and completely redraw.

    Click image for larger version

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    however, another item Dezzar mentioned... listening distance. how does everyone design/take into account their components on speakers that may be flexible in a space?

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  • zinger084
    commented on 's reply
    i just tried Dezzars frd's and zma on both the tweeter and the woofer and i'm getting the same mismatched results. i'm working through it and will report back findings. i don't know how they can be different if i'm literally using his frd's and zma's but i'll get to the bottom of it.

  • rpb
    commented on 's reply
    Sims are nice for getting close (If your good at it.), but for me, the fun begins when measuring the driver responses, and actually measuring how they respond to a filter..I'm likely one of the few here that does x-overs by trial and error, making many sweeps while changing the x-over.

  • rpb
    commented on 's reply
    What's that smooth purple arc centered near 1k? Should that be there?

  • dcibel
    replied
    zinger084 Have a close look at the frequency response files loaded to the tweeter driver, I would suggest you have the wrong files loaded here.

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  • DeZZar
    commented on 's reply
    Steps 3 and 5 are redundant. Not sure that's the difference though if your deleting the loaded files and importing the diffraction ones at step 9.

  • DeZZar
    commented on 's reply
    Check the files loaded for your woofer. Perhaps just work with the horizontal diffraction files for now, remove the rest.

  • zinger084
    commented on 's reply
    will do, thanks for making the suggestion. if i wasn't so far off from DeZZar, i would just plow forward, but there's just such a disparity on the middle i want to make sure i get it right.

  • rpb
    replied
    I know that you are mostly concerned with the software at the moment. I've no experience with it. But, while you are playing with things, note that changing the coil to 2mH will affect the notch that it, and the 1uf cap create. Try a smaller 2 ohm resistor to make it easier to see the notch location. Then alter the 1uf cap higher or lower value, and watch the result. At the same time, I'd try different values for L2., and take a look at R5. Sometimes the interaction between these parts can be sensitive.

    It's odd that your result don't match. I'd double check the woofer zma file. I currently don't have a pc to play with the sim, so I'm just making educated guesses.

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  • zinger084
    replied
    additional screenshots
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  • zinger084
    replied
    I'm still not getting the same result.

    The steps I'm following are:
    1. Open Vituix.
    2. Create woofer and tweeter drivers on drivers tab.
    3. Load in woofer frd and zma.
    4. Trace tweeter spl and impedance to generate frd and zma.
    5. Load in tweeter frd (under frequency response) and zma (under impedance response).
    6. Make sure minimum phase is checked at bottom of drivers tab alongside smooth 1/12oct.
    7. Open diffraction model and model the woofer and tweeter separately with mic in center of each driver.
    8. Export the generated .txt full space files in 10 degree increments.
    9. Reload these exported files back in as the sole source of frequency responses in the drivers tab to compensate for baffle step (for each the woofer and the tweeter.
    10. Look at SPL chart and design crossover.
    I apparently am missing something though... and not sure what it is.

    Here are mine.
    Peerless DA32TX00-08 Response_ZR.zma
    [email protected]
    Baffle Step Diffraction Tweeter_Full-space hor 0.txt
    Baffle Step Diffraction Tweeter_Full-space hor 30.txt
    Baffle Step Diffraction Tweeter_Full-space hor 60.txt

    Leave a comment:

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