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If you were to build a light weight wide dispersion PA speaker...

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  • If you were to build a light weight wide dispersion PA speaker...

    Hi all, Im tossing around the idea of building a light weight PA speaker for my mom. Just gathering thoughts and ideas. Needs to be sub 25lbs(she's small). And ideally be under $3-400 out the door. Right now she uses 2 QSC k10s. They're very nice but also close to 40lbs in the bag.

    So my thoughts were... try to find a really wide dispersion waveguide and use one compression driver on top of a 8" or 10" neo woofer. Kind of like a LR Baggs Synapse - it actually uses a horn loaded mid woofer as well.
    https://www.lrbaggs.com/synapse-personal-pa-system


    OR possibly something like the JBL CWT128, which uses two CDs/waveguides splayed out next to each other. They claim a 160 degree coverage but I can't find any polar patterns of it. I could mount two waveguides above one 10" or possibly 2 8" woofers that are cross fired or splayed.

    https://www.soundtech.co.uk/professi...wide-angle-lou

    -

    I would power it with the Dayton Audio KABD 4x100 amp with DSP.
    https://www.parts-express.com/Dayton...th-DSP-325-434

    -


    The only really wide waveguide Ive found for sale is the Selenium HC23-25, but I have no experience with it.
    https://www.parts-express.com/Seleni...18-TPI-264-318



    If I go one CD/one woofer than I can spend more on the CD and cross it lower. I could buy the same celestion CD that's in my K10s. IF I have to buy 2 CDs/waveguides then im looking at something cheaper, that won't cross as low.


    Any thoughts or suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!!! Ive simulated comb filtering of two drivers next to each other in Vituix cab on a flat baffle, but have no clue how to figure that out on an angled one!
    Thank you



  • #2
    I'm not sure I understand your approach. Waveguides are generally for directivity, not wide dispersion. I would have gone to a line array solution. Lots cheaper for the same sonic results, too. I think there are examples in the project forum here.

    Keep in mind, a no-holds-barred horn speaker is a wonderful experience. A budget-conscious one is generally just scary.
    Francis

    Comment


    • billfitzmaurice
      billfitzmaurice commented
      Editing a comment
      Not scary at all, nor hard to realize. Have a read here. It's a long journey, so if all you care about is the bottom line skip to post #144 https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/v...p?f=30&t=26094

      I wouldn't recommend these to the OP, because while light weight they're bulky, that's the downside of a horn. A line array like the SLA Pro would be a better form factor, albeit more expensive, as it takes four drivers in a direct radiator to equal one in a horn.

    • fpitas
      fpitas commented
      Editing a comment
      Well all right, I meant the more typical $20 CD on a tiny waveguide approach.

  • #3
    Something like this has very wide horizontal dispersion: https://www.parts-express.com/Epique...m-Pair-301-982
    Francis

    Comment


    • #4
      I highly doubt you'll be able to build anything using decent plywood that will come in under 25lbs. Even the Mackie C200 plastic, passive 10" comes in at 26lbs. There's a Yamaha CBR10 that comes in at 20lbs, but most of us don't have access to molding plastics like that.

      Maybe a sub/satellite system with the sub on wheels?

      - Added: What's the purpose and how low do you need to go? Guitar and vocals, DJing, background at outdoor parties?
      Co-conspirator in the development of the "CR Gnarly Fidelity Reduction Unit" - Registered Trademark, Patent Pending.

      Comment


      • fpitas
        fpitas commented
        Editing a comment
        Agreed, that's beginning to sound realistic.

    • #5
      Also, why a PA speaker? Does she listen at 100dB+?
      Francis

      Comment


      • #6
        Thank you, Im loving the feedback - PA joke!

        She plays acoustic guitar and sings. So it really doesn't need to go any lower than 70-80hz. It also doesn't have to be super loud. I still have the k10s for that. Really just wanted an option for her that she could use on her own for smaller gigs. Also wanted something with wider dispersion, more airy than the k10. No one seemed to like the LR Baggs or JBL option I listed!


        We used to have a TurboSound ip300. Which was a personal line array. 26 pounds and 120 degree dispersion. It was perfect... Except for it rattled and I went through 3 of them before I gave up on them. :(


        I looked through all of Bill's projects before posting here. I got the splaying driver idea from his guitar cab.
        Last edited by TroyH; 03-31-2022, 08:36 AM.

        Comment


        • fpitas
          fpitas commented
          Editing a comment
          Aha! OK, she'll use it on stage. Gotcha. I catch on eventually....

        • fpitas
          fpitas commented
          Editing a comment
          I definitely think small line arrays are your best answer.

        • billfitzmaurice
          billfitzmaurice commented
          Editing a comment
          The XF cabs are cross-fired, not splayed. Cross-firing minimizes comb filtering, splaying makes it worse. Look at the SLA Pro, it's considerably better than the ip300, and can be self powered with the Dayton PPA800DSP. Here's a build thread:
          https://billfitzmaurice.info/forum/v...5887&start=120
          It gets interesting when the builder discovers the pitfalls of making a mistake wiring the crossover, which resulted in some community head scratching but we eventually figured it out.

      • #7
        Thank you, I meant to write cross fired. Does splaying effect higher frequencies? Just asking since that's what the JBL does and it cost a million dollars.

        Comment


        • billfitzmaurice
          billfitzmaurice commented
          Editing a comment
          The higher you go the worse it gets. They minimize the effect by placing the acoustic centers of the dual horns so close together. Still, it's a 2x8 speaker. The 228J woofers go for $100 each, 2408H $55 each. $3k for that is absurd.

      • #8
        Thank you. So they interact just like woofers that are too far apart. Can you cross fire horns for a beneficial effect?

        Comment


        • #9
          I do.
          www.billfitzmaurice.com
          www.billfitzmaurice.info/forum

          Comment

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