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advice for woofer/cabinet for new 3 way system

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  • advice for woofer/cabinet for new 3 way system

    I have a hi end system and I am going to start the process of building a new 3 way speaker. (Ive built before but am no expert). For the woofer I have some options. First I have GR Research subs so the mains dont need to go down super low, however I want them to get decent response out of them as you would a true full range speaker. Second I have a unused 1.6 cu ft cabinet. In previous posts people suggest I use the Peerless SLS 830668 in it. The alternative is to build a new larger cabinet for a 12 assuming it would outperform the 10. Thoughts? Will the Peerless give me reasonable low end response? Also, if I build a larger cabinet I would like to keep in to no larger than say 3.3 cu ft, if possible. Your advice is greatly appreciated. Thanks all!!

  • #2
    Going to need to know a few more things before any meaningful advice can be given:
    - what are the other two drivers in the three-way?
    - what do you use these for? more specifically the question really is what is your SPL expectations? Are they dedicated to music or home theatre or covering both duties?
    - do you foresee using these without the subs at any point?

    My personal view is that if you already have subs (plural) and these speakers will always be used in conjunction with those subs and your SPL expectations always include those subs then there is little if anything to be gained by using large woofers. Particularly in the range of 100 Liters / 12inch! (If you just want to, then there is no reason not to either)

    But for arguments sake, with a 50hz high pass, even a pair of Dayton RS180 (7" drivers) can produce over 110db in 25 liters (~0.9cuft) with an f3 of 50hz. I'd say that is more than likely to keep up with whatever the rest of the system consists of.
    Constructions: Dayton+SB 2-Way v1 | Dayton+SB 2-Way v2 | Fabios (SB Monitors)
    Refurbs: KLH 2 | Rega Ela Mk1

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    • #3
      Peerless 830883 mid and seas 27TAC/BG
      Listening mostly to Jazz and female vocals, no sustained high SPL levels. I do listen to rock but no metal at blasting levels lol.
      I will always have subs. However, the current subs are OM so although they go down low they dont load the room like a traditional sub so I will say I will always have a sub. My philosophy is that the main speakers should be capable of reasonably low bass. This is kind of like that bass swarm model.

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      • #4
        A 1.6cf sealed and stuffed box for that sub is small, and should roll off in the upper half of the 40s (not considering room gain).
        In 4 vented cu.ft. it'll do 25Hz.

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        • #5
          Agree, what about an 8? I am crossing over at 250 hz

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          • #6
            For 1.6cuft I would look at the SB Satori WO24P-4 in a sealed box if you have subwoofers. This will have a f3 around 50-55hz with a gentle slope off. I am currently building something similar with 40l (approx 1.4cuft) with WO24P-4 sealed paired with the Morel EM1308 2.25” mid dome and ET448 1.18” soft dome tweeter. Crossovers are currently looking around 700-800hz and 3500-4000hz and as I am going active I have LR2 (and a preliminary passive scheme) and LR4 or But4 options (in progress), both having very good phase coherence, flat on axis and a nice 6dB slope from 50hz to 15khz on the listening response. Worth looking into.

            The Morels are supposed to be good for vocals and reproducing instruments realistically and the WO24P has low distortion and can be used up to 1500hz if needed (See Jeff Bagby’s Helios).

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            • #7
              Originally posted by jimbones View Post
              Agree, what about an 8? I am crossing over at 250 hz
              Is the mid in a separate box, or is the mid chamber going to be inside of the 1.6 cu-ft box?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by rpb View Post

                Is the mid in a separate box, or is the mid chamber going to be inside of the 1.6 cu-ft box?
                separate box

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                • #9
                  I can't personally vouch for this, but I have heard people rave about good sealed bass down into the 50s in threads about vented bass where people are trying to get into the 40s and 30s.
                  Since you have the subs, for say 60Hz and below, you could have sealed woofers that would cover most of the music you listen to and the subs pick up just the lowest octave.
                  One SLS 830668 will get you a sealed F3 lower than 60 Hz as will an SLS 830667 (8-inch). You could put two of the 830667's in the cabinet sealed, moving about 25% more air than the single 10", but you'd be at 4 ohms if that is a problem.

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                  • #10
                    I am thinking I am going to build another cabinet. wheels are turning lol. I just have to decide how large and what driver. Like i said I'd like to stay around 3.3 cu ft but nothing is ever cast in stone. I'll create some box sims to see what the beast will look like.

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                    • #11
                      Is this possible? The Peerless XXLS P835016 in a 1.3 cu ft cabinet will have an F3 of 33 hz? Thats what the PE info says

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                      • #12
                        WinISD does NOT bear that out (someone made an error there, I think). F6 MAYbe?

                        But you'd really need a PR 'cause a (3" - which is probably too small) port would be very long.
                        Now, 2.0cf is a different story.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Chris Roemer View Post
                          WinISD does NOT bear that out (someone made an error there, I think). F6 MAYbe?

                          But you'd really need a PR 'cause a (3" - which is probably too small) port would be very long.
                          Now, 2.0cf is a different story.
                          I could go to a 2 cu ft cabinet. That's not big. whats a PR? what dia port do you think I would be necessary?

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                          • #14
                            Passive radiator (alternative way to tune a box besides a port tube).
                            For a 10" sub, I like 4" PVC, but a 3" "Precision Port" (which would be shorter) about 10" long should be okay. I'd aim it out the back (or bottom) if possible.

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                            • jimbones
                              jimbones commented
                              Editing a comment
                              just curious what is the reason for port location. I usually locate on rear panel but is there a reason not to put on front other than aesthetics?

                            • fpitas
                              fpitas commented
                              Editing a comment
                              As Chris said, if a port chuffs it's a lot more audible on the front. As well, midrange inevitably comes out the port. That may or may not be loud enough to be audible, but rear or bottom mounting helps attenuate it a lot.

                          • #15
                            Originally posted by Chris Roemer View Post
                            Passive radiator (alternative way to tune a box besides a port tube).
                            For a 10" sub, I like 4" PVC, but a 3" "Precision Port" (which would be shorter) about 10" long should be okay. I'd aim it out the back (or bottom) if possible.
                            Lol of course. OK Im seeing some of the Peerless drivers that look good are only available in bulk (100pcs) so that aint happening ha ha. I think I may start a new thread. Just curious if there is any advantage of a 3 way over a 4 way. I see in Harbeths SHL5 they have a double tweeter arrangement.

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