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  • #16
    If the face of the tweeter is 4.125" diameter or less. Most 32mm domes are not that small.
    Wolf
    "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
    "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
    "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
    "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

    *InDIYana event website*

    Photobucket pages:
    https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

    My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
    http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

    Comment


    • #17
      For my design I'm thinking of relatively cheap but well proven drivers with a crap load of crossover parts to make them work
      Craig

      I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol.

      Comment


      • buggers
        buggers commented
        Editing a comment
        Jon Marsh would approve of that for sure.

    • #18
      Originally posted by PWR RYD View Post
      For my design I'm thinking of relatively cheap but well proven drivers with a crap load of crossover parts to make them work
      Sounds good to me!
      Wolf
      "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
      "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
      "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
      "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

      *InDIYana event website*

      Photobucket pages:
      https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

      My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
      http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

      Comment


      • #19
        Originally posted by PWR RYD View Post
        For my design I'm thinking of relatively cheap but well proven drivers with a crap load of crossover parts to make them work
        That is pretty much the opposite of my typical design

        Comment


        • Billet
          Billet commented
          Editing a comment
          Complex crossovers are a proven technique, however. I have been surprised a few times by the sound of a system with large parts count in the crossover.

      • #20
        Originally posted by Billet View Post

        That is pretty much the opposite of my typical design
        Craig

        I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol.

        Comment


        • #21
          I’m thinking Eton 28SD1 or Dayton RS28F (NLA) with RS270P-04A or Visaton GF 200 or B 200…we shall see.
          --Derek

          Comment


          • #22
            It’s been done before but not seen a fully polished version, so Eminence B102 plus Morel CAT378 would be a nice combination.

            Comment


            • deschu
              deschu commented
              Editing a comment
              I didn’t mean to imply it was full range, just that the whizzer, if over 4.125”, could complicate rule compliance,

            • Wolf
              Wolf commented
              Editing a comment
              No, that applies fine and dandy.

            • deschu
              deschu commented
              Editing a comment
              Speaking of the B102, Frank Bruno aka HamHeadBass in NY is closing up shop and selling off the inventory of his custom version thereof, aka the FB-10, which he claims has extended highs and lows, although his fs and sensitivity are higher. $80 versus $130 for the B102 at P-E. I have no idea how glorious the 2nd order harmonic distortion will be though.

          • #23
            The Kartesian TWT30 is also an interesting option… they also provide a simple horn for it, that while 110mm is diameter, it could be easily imitated with a smaller/rules-compliant flange diameter.
            --Derek

            Comment


            • #24
              So OK to use a tweeter that fits in a 4 inch square or can we use the area equal to 4.125 diameter circle for the rectangular area? Just thinking about some ribbons.
              John H

              Synergy Horn, SLS-85, BMR-3L, Mini-TL, BR-2, Titan OB, B452, Udique, Vultus, Latus1, Seriatim, Aperivox,Pencil Tower

              Comment


              • #25
                I am fine with either 4-in square or 4 1/8 diameter that is fine.
                Wolf
                "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                *InDIYana event website*

                Photobucket pages:
                https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

                My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
                http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

                Comment


                • jhollander
                  jhollander commented
                  Editing a comment
                  So the Dayton DC28F is 4.33 inches in diameter does Not qualify, but the truncated DC28FT would qualify by area?

                • Wolf
                  Wolf commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I never said anything about area. 4.125" diameter or smaller, or 4" x 4" square or smaller. This means the trunky-Silkie is too big in both measures.

              • #26
                Man... I need to seriously consider how I want to approach this. I have a pair of Satori WO24P-4s that need a use, so I could go high end tweeter. I also don't know what I cna get away with by really pushing a tweeter too dang low for the fun of it, so I wouldn't want to super abuse a bunch of higher cost parts too... How should I consider a tweeter for this? Just distortion plots, lower Fs is best, something else?
                Voxel Down Firing with Dayton SA70
                Translam Subwoofers - The Jedi Mind Tricks
                The Super Bees - Garage 2 way
                SevenSixTwo - InDIYana 2018 Coax
                The Defiants - InDIYana 2019 "Bare Minimum" Build

                Comment


                • jhollander
                  jhollander commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Divide and conquer, 3-4 tweeters should do it.

                • KEtheredge87
                  KEtheredge87 commented
                  Editing a comment
                  Hah. My first TTTW design

              • #27
                Originally posted by KEtheredge87 View Post
                Man... I need to seriously consider how I want to approach this. I have a pair of Satori WO24P-4s that need a use, so I could go high end tweeter. I also don't know what I can get away with by really pushing a tweeter too dang low for the fun of it, so I wouldn't want to super abuse a bunch of higher cost parts too... How should I consider a tweeter for this? Just distortion plots, lower Fs is best, something else?
                My approach, flawed as it likely is, has been to look for faceplate-compliant tweeters with larger diameters that have low Fs and large Xmax, and then also trying to find reviews, distortion, and csd data when available on the 'net before ordering some. I believe that Xmax (linear) and (physical limit) is likely to be the predominant thresholds of stuff starting to sound bad and approaching tweeter damage, respectively, as the crossover frequency is dropped and the SPL is increased.

                A coworker of mine, who has had a long history in hifi, has been a recent fan of crossing over lower than recommended, but he compensates heavily in these designs by not driving them loud, and he generally tries to stay at least a bit above Fs. My interpretation of the competition, however, is that the ability to provide a non-quiet SPL will be judged favorably.

                My current mix of trial tweeter are: Eton 28SD1, Kartesian TWT30, BlieSMa T34A-4, and the CSS LD22F (which I believe is a wavecore + faceplate)...there's some serious money in some of those tweeters if bought new, but eBay came to the rescue. Woofer-side: Visaton GF200, Peerless 830869, Dayton RS270P4A, a variant of the Eminence B102, and the Silver Flute w20rc38-04. My intent is to measure the tweeters for distortion and then Xmaxes (via ARTA with Baumer laser sensor).

                I'm presently interpreting the faceplate rule as the tweeter's nominal/original manufacturer faceplate need to meet the dimensions (regardless if modified for the entry), but that a waveguide needs to only meet the faceplate requirement in it's final form. That is, that I can duplicate or modify the optional Kartesian TWT30 waveguide (TWT30_Horn) (which is non-compliant due to it's mounting pattern but not the guide surfaces) so long as the final entry meets the dimensional requirement....but I think this is probably at the edge of the rules.
                --Derek

                Comment


                • #28
                  I've crossed the RS270p at 2.5k to a Peerless H26 tweeter. Crossing lower with a std dome should be easy,

                  Comment


                  • deschu
                    deschu commented
                    Editing a comment
                    The H26TG meets the contest requirements as is....are you trying to tell Wolf to make it more challenging?

                  • Wolf
                    Wolf commented
                    Editing a comment
                    H26 applies, no question.

                    I don't want to either choke or flood the motor. You have to have a design flow or stifle creativity. Necessity breeds invention.

                  • rpb
                    rpb commented
                    Editing a comment
                    I was just showing that you don't necessarily need a tweeter that can be crossed at 1.5k. It could be that a lower xo would sound better. That's all. The x-over is not a simple one on this (my) speaker, and this was not a totally finished design. I only have one RS270p woofer currently, Got lucky on the off axis I suppose. I have some Morel. and CSS tweeters I could try, but my future plan may be a 3-way with this woofer.

                • #29
                  "stand mounts preferred but not required"

                  As in tophats for tripods?

                  Comment


                  • #30
                    No, as in bookshelf style. Not many of us use poles like PA.
                    Wolf
                    "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                    "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                    "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                    "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                    *InDIYana event website*

                    Photobucket pages:
                    https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

                    My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
                    http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

                    Comment

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