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SDC (not MWAF) 2022 fallout thread....

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  • #31
    The Fan Favorite award was won by Nick S. for his "Carl & Stuart" speakers (SP40). The external driver was a DIY coax that Nick made using a Dayton RS100 woofer and a SB14 tweeter. The woofer was a Dayton DSA135 mounted internally in a bandpass configuration and vented out the rear end of the enclosure. Wish I could have heard these. I kept walking back and forth between the loudspeaker holding room and the jamming room and I completely missed the session for these. Beautiful cabinets and finishing work!!

    EDIT: This speaker was also the 2nd place winner in the Under #300 category. See posts 51 and 65 below for additional details.

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    Last edited by 4thtry; 08-19-2022, 10:26 AM. Reason: Correction to standings
    SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
    Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
    Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
    Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

    Comment


    • marvin
      marvin commented
      Editing a comment
      Luv' em. Excellent work, Nick!

      As Billet quips, "Look how great they sound!"

  • #32
    Now it's time for the Dayton category, and the 1st place winner simply blows my mind. Tom Z. took the prize with a pair of extremely small speakers, "The Bantams" (SP48). They have to be the smallest speakers that have ever won 1st place in ANY category! Drivers were the Dayton ND91-4 3.5" aluminum cone woofers and the Dayton AMTPOD-4 autosound tweeter (air motion transformer). The passive radiator on the back was a Peerless 830878 3.5". And all of these small parts were jammed, together with xover parts, into a pair of ultra small Denovo .04 cu. ft. knock down cabinets! Incredible!

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    SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
    Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
    Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
    Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

    Comment


    • #33
      The 2nd place winner in the Dayton category was John H. with his "Mini LX521" speakers (SB08). The tweeter was a Dayton ND20FB, the midrange was a Dayton RS100P, and the woofers (two per cabinet) were Dayton ND91's. I can't remember if these were the 8 ohm or 4 ohm versions of these drivers. John told me which versions were used in a thread a while back, but now I cannot find the thread. I think the tweeter is the 4 ohm version. Not sure about the mid or woofer versions. I did not hear these in the jam room this year. These were the speakers that blew everyone away at the InDIYana competition a while back.

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      SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
      Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
      Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
      Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

      Comment


      • #34
        The 3rd place winner in Dayton was Keith E. with his "The Plum Dingers" speakers (SP41). This was a relatively small (6x11x8") two-way bass reflex in an MTM configuration. Drivers used were the Dayton ND20FB-4 tweeter and two Dayton PS95-8 full range per channel. Port tuning was 93Hz (FB) for an F3 of 75Hz. Crossover: 4930Hz. The MDF cabinet was painted with real milk paint "Plum" color (purple) with hemp oil finish.

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        SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
        Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
        Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
        Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

        Comment


        • #35
          Originally posted by mattp View Post

          Heh...

          jhollander Since that is the song I cranked in the lobby I am not sure if this comment is directed at my tapped horn sub or not (although I don't understand the Lockheed Martin part).

          Sorry If it was a little loud, while we were tearing down I had two excited guys run up to me saying "We want to hear this sub LOUDER" so I let her rip.
          Matt sorry this is a reference to the open unlimited contestant ??? who traveled from Georgia with a gigantic speaker and a mirror. His explanations had us rolling with laughter for quite awhile. Similar to the Minion pants, there are somethings worth seeing and hearing at the SDC.
          John H

          Synergy Horn, SLS-85, BMR-3L, Mini-TL, BR-2, Titan OB, B452, Udique, Vultus, Latus1, Seriatim, Aperivox,Pencil Tower

          Comment


          • #36
            Paul K. took 1st place in the final category, under $300, with his "Duetta" speakers (SP01). These were relatively small tower speakers (about 40" high) using an RST28F-4 tweeter and RS180P-4 midwoofer. Per Paul's writeup, this was a tapered TL AND a ML-TL with two mass loading ports near the end of the line. Crossover was 1800Hz LR4. I did not hear these in the jam room, but I heard them play a few months earlier at InDIYana. They were one of the best sounding speakers at the show. Very detailed high frequencies and depth perception. The low frequency extension was exceptional for such a small enclosure (gross volume of only 0.94 cu. ft). Paul made the baffle, base, and tail from 3/4" Bamboo and the rest from walnut veneered Baltic birch plywood. The fit & finish was definitely furniture grade; the detailed work of a true craftsman.


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            Last edited by 4thtry; 08-09-2022, 12:14 PM. Reason: typo
            SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
            Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
            Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
            Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

            Comment


            • Paul K.
              Paul K. commented
              Editing a comment
              Bill, you're making me blush but your comments are very much appreciated. I didn't hear a lot of speakers in the jam room but of those I did hear, yours and Dan Neubecker's were not hampered by the room's poor acoustics and sounded very good.
              Paul

          • #37
            John H. took 2nd place in under $300 with his "MCR Mains" speakers (SP11). Not sure about the drivers, but my guess would be one RST28F-4 tweeter and two DSA135-8's in a slightly overlapping, surface mount type MTM configuration?? Nice looking cabinets!

            EDIT: This speaker was actually the 3rd place winner in this category after corrections were made in the tabulations. See post 51 and 65 for additional details. Also, the tweeter John used was the aluminum version, RST28A. And the mid-woofers were DSA115's, not DSA135's. And the name was wrong too, should have been "LR Mains"

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            Last edited by 4thtry; 08-19-2022, 10:14 AM. Reason: Correction to standings, driver names, & spkr name
            SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
            Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
            Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
            Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

            Comment


            • jhollander
              jhollander commented
              Editing a comment
              Thanks Bill, the drivers are DSA115s and the RST28A. The name was suppose to be LR Mains, but I was moving speakers in when Jill and Melody changed the name...

          • #38
            Michael H. took 3rd place in under $300 with his "Bella Sonus Model 1" speakers (SP15). Drivers: ??

            EDIT: Per Wolf's comment below and some addition info that I found on the designer's DIY Loudspeaker Project Pad thread: Tweeter: HiVi TN28-B 1" top mount soft dome. Midrange: Silver Flute W14R25-08. Woofers: Goldwood GW-6025. Crossover: 700/5kHz. https://m.facebook.com/groups/DIYLou...0272012995296/

            EDIT2: After re-counting the scores, it was discovered that this speaker was actually the 4th place winner in this category. See posts 51 and 65 below for additional details.

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            Last edited by 4thtry; 08-19-2022, 10:20 AM.
            SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
            Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
            Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
            Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

            Comment


            • Wolf
              Wolf commented
              Editing a comment
              HiVi TN28/Silver Flute W15/Goodwood woofers.

          • #39
            That completes the winner circle. All of the above pictures, except one, were taken with my cell phone camera. The one exception was taken with my Nikon DSLR (D800). Can you tell which one?
            SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
            Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
            Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
            Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

            Comment


            • tomzarbo
              tomzarbo commented
              Editing a comment
              Bill, thanks a lot for chronicling all of the speakers you did. It's nice to look over, and look back at what happened. Your cell phone takes good pics, I can't tell the difference e.
              TomZ

            • 4thtry
              4thtry commented
              Editing a comment
              Your welcome! The higher priced cell phone cameras have advanced quite a bit in the last couple of years, with multiple lenses and sensors, photo stacking, and software that can significantly reduce noise, camera shake, and motion blur.

          • #40
            Originally posted by jhollander View Post

            Matt sorry this is a reference to the open unlimited contestant ??? who traveled from Georgia with a gigantic speaker and a mirror. His explanations had us rolling with laughter for quite awhile. Similar to the Minion pants, there are somethings worth seeing and hearing at the SDC.
            Ohhh sorry, John. I forgot about that one...
            Your results may vary.

            Comment


            • #41
              Originally posted by 4thtry View Post
              That completes the winner circle. All of the above pictures, except one, were taken with my cell phone camera. The one exception was taken with my Nikon DSLR (D800). Can you tell which one?
              No guesses as to which one was the Nikon picture?? Here is a hint: Look at the background de-focusing effect. Due to the small sensor size, cell phone cameras have depth of field to burn.
              SideTowers: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...corundum-build
              Totally Flat: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...5-totally-flat
              Plumber's Delight: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/fo...notech-winners
              Linehopper: http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...Esoteric-build

              Comment


              • tomzarbo
                tomzarbo commented
                Editing a comment
                Was it John H's SP11 speakers?
                I've looked at all the pics several times over several days and just can't seem to see it.
                I think John's MTM speakers seem to look extra-clear to me, that's why I'm guessing those.
                TomZ

              • 4thtry
                4thtry commented
                Editing a comment
                Nope. Those were all cell phone pics. The solitary Nikon DSLR photo was the 3rd picture posted of Paul K's Duetta speakers, showing the Bamboo rear support "tail". I forgot to take a picture of this tail during the SDC event, so I used the one that I had taken during the InDIYana event two months earlier, using my Nikon DSLR.

            • #42
              I received the judges' score sheets in the mail today for my Duetta floor-standers in the under-$300 category. Judge #1 was a bit tougher than the other two. From him my total score was 49 (out of 60) for an average of 8.17. Judge #2 gave me a total of 58 for an average of 9.67, and Judge #3 gave me a total of 55 for an average of 9.16. All 3 judges combined gave me a total of 162 out of 180 for an average of 9.0. I got one score (from Judge #1) that wasn't an 8 or higher; a 7 for Soundstaging/Imaging.
              Paul

              Comment


              • #43
                Apparently, Jerry was judge 1, Tom was judge 2, and Javad was judge 3.

                I'll simplify the ratings for easier comparison and such. Judge//Clarity/Craftsmanship/Dynamic Range/ Originality-Design/Soundstage-Imaging/Tonal Balance//Total//Average

                Project 36/Open Unlimited: Mindblowing Minisculities and Goosebump AKA "Oddball 2.1". A dual-opposed PR-bandpass the size of a loaf of bread, and 2" omni satellites about 2.25x2.25x3".

                J1//7/5/5/9/7/6//39//6.5; T1 Fun! T2 Ok, handled better than expected. T3 Good image. Thanks!
                J2//7/4/4/8/10/7//40//6.67; Very good soundstage and image. Voices clear but a little rolled off. They totally disappear. Very limited bass and dynamics. At high levels makes highs harsh and bass distorted.
                J3//6/7/6/8/6/7//40//6.67; T1 Good tonal balance. T2 Distortion, Missing high freq detail and definition, Doing great considering! T3 Decent soundstage, Missing lower bass.

                My thoughts: The amplifier was only 15x2 + 30x1, so it was severely low on power. Given enough clean front end, it can get quite loud. This is definitely an overachieving combo sound wise, but there is a limit on high output. That said- I didn't think they were distorting that badly at all as far as the subwoofer goes. The sats can definitely get harsh at higher outputs, but I didn't feel they did that badly here either. I have a feeling the label-maker marks did not really look that professional, but felt the rest didn't look that bad either.

                Total/average 119/6.611 points

                Project 6/Under $300: Purveyor W-T/M 0.23ft^3 3-ways.

                J1//8/8/9/8/9/9//51//8.5; T1 Good vocal. Great Image. Dynamic! T2 Great vocal. Clean. T3 Cool! Great image. Grabs ya! Great job!!
                J2//8/5/5/6/8/7//39//6.5; Soundstage good. Upper bass elevated. Low bass weak. Transients good. Voices good but slightly heavy, albeit good separation. Treble slightly low. Distortion on heavy bass.
                J3//8/7/8/8/7/8//46//7.67; T1 Nice soundstage, good bass presence. T2 Tweeter level a little low. T2&3 Lack of air and presence. T3 Great clarity, dynamic, impressive for size.

                My thoughts: The heavy voices were referencing the James Taylor "Line 'em up" track. This track's vocals sound heavy as that is how they were recorded. Not every one of his do, but this is an exception. I found the room a little too dead. So, some treble comes across as dull, whereas a brighter speaker would sound right. This would alleviate the other comments/concerns for the most part. I also would not call the finish average.

                Total/avg 136/7.556 points

                Post 'em if ya got 'em!
                Wolf
                "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                *InDIYana event website*

                Photobucket pages:
                https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

                My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
                http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

                Comment


                • #44
                  To add to what I stated in Post #42, based on the 3 tracks of music played.
                  Judge 1: T1-Great vocals, good slam in bass. T2-Great James Taylor, great bass. T3-Great clarity. Overall-Great job.
                  Judge 2: Didn't list comments by Track number but stated: Soundstage great. Bass OK. Transients great. Depth great. Voices great. Except for lowest bass, balance great. Separation of voices and instruments great. Dynamics great.
                  Judge 3: T1-Strong center image. Great soundstage. Good bass level and impact. T2-Good tonal balance and tweeter level. Non-resonant bass. T3-No comments were listed.
                  Paul

                  Comment


                  • #45
                    MWAF 2022 Judges scores
                    The Bantams * SP48 * Dayton Audio Category * Tom Zarbo

                    JUDGE 1:
                    Track 1: Good vocal. Laid back, Jimmy approved
                    Track 2: OK, so they do have some bass. Cool.
                    Track 3: Piano – nice. Voice – full.
                    Good job!
                    *Clarity: 7 *Craftsmanship: 7 *Dynamic Range: 6 *Originality/Design: 6 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 8
                    JUDGE 2:
                    Soundstage good. Bass weak. Except for bass, balance good. Voices good. Transients good. For small speakers, great compromises.
                    *Clarity: 8 *Craftsmanship: 7 *Dynamic Range: 6 *Originality/Design: 6 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 7
                    JUDGE 3:
                    Track 1: Big sound! Nice tonal balance, tweeter level & BSC good. Big soundstage.
                    Track 2: Impressive bass! Nailed tonal balance. Speaker dances!!
                    Track 3: Big sound, nice high hats. Bass a little rubbery, missing deep bass.
                    Killer job Tom!
                    *Clarity: 9 *Craftsmanship: 9 *Dynamic Range: 8 *Originality/Design: 8 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 9.5

                    ALL SCORES TOTAL: 135.5 * AVERAGE: 7.52

                    SOME EXPLANATION: Although I did place rubber feet on the bottom of the speakers, one of them danced an inch or so to the right by the end of the test. The other one had the speaker number card on top of it… and by the middle of track 2 it had fallen off. I felt like they represented themselves well, especially on track 2 (Seeya by Deadmou5) which started off Low-Fi, then came in heavy with big-boy bass; I think the judges were really wondering if they would sound distorted on that track when the bass broke in, but they just took it like a man, and sounded like a good two-way with the sub switched off.

                    Being so small, I didn’t imagine they would win or even place, so I didn’t bother to take them to the Jam room, as there were a few speakers backed up already when I was last in there. I wish I would have now because even though they’re not much to look at, they do really sound excellent. Not patting myself on the back, the ND91 is a really good driver, and I just somehow managed to not mess up the X-over. : )

                    TomZ
                    Last edited by tomzarbo; 08-12-2022, 08:41 PM.
                    Zarbo Audio Projects Youtube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEZ...aFQSTl6NdOwgxQ * 320-641 Amp Review Youtube: https://youtu.be/ugjfcI5p6m0 *Veneering curves, seams, using heat-lock iron on method *Trimming veneer & tips *Curved Sides glue-up video
                    *Part 2 *Gluing multiple curved laminations of HDF

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