SDC (not MWAF) 2022 fallout thread....

[Wolf]

Nick's Mnemosynes had that in spades, rpb. Big woofer, monkey coffin, big sound.

Wolf

[rpb]

Were there any larger, more conventional speakers entered? It seems to me that a well designed 10" 3-way might have done well. Perhaps the difference in bass and dynamics would not matter in the scoring. Just curious.

The larger size and weight might make transporting, and handling difficult. Could that be part of the reason?

[tomzarbo]

MWAF 2022 Judges scores
The Bantams * SP48 * Dayton Audio Category * Tom Zarbo

JUDGE 1:
Track 1: Good vocal. Laid back, Jimmy approved
Track 2: OK, so they do have some bass. Cool.
Track 3: Piano – nice. Voice – full.
Good job!
*Clarity: 7 *Craftsmanship: 7 *Dynamic Range: 6 *Originality/Design: 6 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 8
JUDGE 2:
Soundstage good. Bass weak. Except for bass, balance good. Voices good. Transients good. For small speakers, great compromises.
*Clarity: 8 *Craftsmanship: 7 *Dynamic Range: 6 *Originality/Design: 6 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 7
JUDGE 3:
Track 1: Big sound! Nice tonal balance, tweeter level & BSC good. Big soundstage.
Track 2: Impressive bass! Nailed tonal balance. Speaker dances!!
Track 3: Big sound, nice high hats. Bass a little rubbery, missing deep bass.
Killer job Tom!
*Clarity: 9 *Craftsmanship: 9 *Dynamic Range: 8 *Originality/Design: 8 *Soundstage/Imaging: 8 *Tonal Balance: 9.5

ALL SCORES TOTAL: 135.5 * AVERAGE: 7.52

SOME EXPLANATION: Although I did place rubber feet on the bottom of the speakers, one of them danced an inch or so to the right by the end of the test. The other one had the speaker number card on top of it… and by the middle of track 2 it had fallen off. I felt like they represented themselves well, especially on track 2 (Seeya by Deadmou5) which started off Low-Fi, then came in heavy with big-boy bass; I think the judges were really wondering if they would sound distorted on that track when the bass broke in, but they just took it like a man, and sounded like a good two-way with the sub switched off.

Being so small, I didn’t imagine they would win or even place, so I didn’t bother to take them to the Jam room, as there were a few speakers backed up already when I was last in there. I wish I would have now because even though they’re not much to look at, they do really sound excellent. Not patting myself on the back, the ND91 is a really good driver, and I just somehow managed to not mess up the X-over. : )

TomZ

[Paul K.]

To add to what I stated in Post #42, based on the 3 tracks of music played.
Judge 1: T1-Great vocals, good slam in bass. T2-Great James Taylor, great bass. T3-Great clarity. Overall-Great job.
Judge 2: Didn't list comments by Track number but stated: Soundstage great. Bass OK. Transients great. Depth great. Voices great. Except for lowest bass, balance great. Separation of voices and instruments great. Dynamics great.
Judge 3: T1-Strong center image. Great soundstage. Good bass level and impact. T2-Good tonal balance and tweeter level. Non-resonant bass. T3-No comments were listed.
Paul

[Wolf]

Apparently, Jerry was judge 1, Tom was judge 2, and Javad was judge 3.

I'll simplify the ratings for easier comparison and such. Judge//Clarity/Craftsmanship/Dynamic Range/ Originality-Design/Soundstage-Imaging/Tonal Balance//Total//Average

Project 36/Open Unlimited: Mindblowing Minisculities and Goosebump AKA "Oddball 2.1". A dual-opposed PR-bandpass the size of a loaf of bread, and 2" omni satellites about 2.25x2.25x3".

J1//7/5/5/9/7/6//39//6.5; T1 Fun! T2 Ok, handled better than expected. T3 Good image. Thanks!
J2//7/4/4/8/10/7//40//6.67; Very good soundstage and image. Voices clear but a little rolled off. They totally disappear. Very limited bass and dynamics. At high levels makes highs harsh and bass distorted.
J3//6/7/6/8/6/7//40//6.67; T1 Good tonal balance. T2 Distortion, Missing high freq detail and definition, Doing great considering! T3 Decent soundstage, Missing lower bass.

My thoughts: The amplifier was only 15x2 + 30x1, so it was severely low on power. Given enough clean front end, it can get quite loud. This is definitely an overachieving combo sound wise, but there is a limit on high output. That said- I didn't think they were distorting that badly at all as far as the subwoofer goes. The sats can definitely get harsh at higher outputs, but I didn't feel they did that badly here either. I have a feeling the label-maker marks did not really look that professional, but felt the rest didn't look that bad either.

Total/average 119/6.611 points

Project 6/Under $300: Purveyor W-T/M 0.23ft^3 3-ways.

J1//8/8/9/8/9/9//51//8.5; T1 Good vocal. Great Image. Dynamic! T2 Great vocal. Clean. T3 Cool! Great image. Grabs ya! Great job!!
J2//8/5/5/6/8/7//39//6.5; Soundstage good. Upper bass elevated. Low bass weak. Transients good. Voices good but slightly heavy, albeit good separation. Treble slightly low. Distortion on heavy bass.
J3//8/7/8/8/7/8//46//7.67; T1 Nice soundstage, good bass presence. T2 Tweeter level a little low. T2&3 Lack of air and presence. T3 Great clarity, dynamic, impressive for size.

My thoughts: The heavy voices were referencing the James Taylor "Line 'em up" track. This track's vocals sound heavy as that is how they were recorded. Not every one of his do, but this is an exception. I found the room a little too dead. So, some treble comes across as dull, whereas a brighter speaker would sound right. This would alleviate the other comments/concerns for the most part. I also would not call the finish average.

Total/avg 136/7.556 points

Post 'em if ya got 'em!
Wolf

[Paul K.]

I received the judges' score sheets in the mail today for my Duetta floor-standers in the under-$300 category. Judge #1 was a bit tougher than the other two. From him my total score was 49 (out of 60) for an average of 8.17. Judge #2 gave me a total of 58 for an average of 9.67, and Judge #3 gave me a total of 55 for an average of 9.16. All 3 judges combined gave me a total of 162 out of 180 for an average of 9.0. I got one score (from Judge #1) that wasn't an 8 or higher; a 7 for Soundstaging/Imaging.
Paul

[4thtry]

That completes the winner circle. All of the above pictures, except one, were taken with my cell phone camera. The one exception was taken with my Nikon DSLR (D800). Can you tell which one?

No guesses as to which one was the Nikon picture?? Here is a hint: Look at the background de-focusing effect. Due to the small sensor size, cell phone cameras have depth of field to burn.

[4thtry]

Your welcome! The higher priced cell phone cameras have advanced quite a bit in the last couple of years, with multiple lenses and sensors, photo stacking, and software that can significantly reduce noise, camera shake, and motion blur.

[tomzarbo]

Bill, thanks a lot for chronicling all of the speakers you did. It's nice to look over, and look back at what happened. Your cell phone takes good pics, I can't tell the difference e.
TomZ

[mattp]

Matt sorry this is a reference to the open unlimited contestant ??? who traveled from Georgia with a gigantic speaker and a mirror. His explanations had us rolling with laughter for quite awhile. Similar to the Minion pants, there are somethings worth seeing and hearing at the SDC.

Ohhh sorry, John. I forgot about that one...

[Wolf]

HiVi TN28/Silver Flute W15/Goodwood woofers.

[jhollander]

Thanks Bill, the drivers are DSA115s and the RST28A. The name was suppose to be LR Mains, but I was moving speakers in when Jill and Melody changed the name...

[4thtry]

That completes the winner circle. All of the above pictures, except one, were taken with my cell phone camera. The one exception was taken with my Nikon DSLR (D800). Can you tell which one?

[4thtry]

Michael H. took 3rd place in under $300 with his "Bella Sonus Model 1" speakers (SP15). Drivers: ??

EDIT: Per Wolf's comment below and some addition info that I found on the designer's DIY Loudspeaker Project Pad thread: Tweeter: HiVi TN28-B 1" top mount soft dome. Midrange: Silver Flute W14R25-08. Woofers: Goldwood GW-6025. Crossover: 700/5kHz. https://m.facebook.com/groups/DIYLou...0272012995296/

EDIT2: After re-counting the scores, it was discovered that this speaker was actually the 4th place winner in this category. See posts 51 and 65 below for additional details.

[4thtry]

John H. took 2nd place in under $300 with his "MCR Mains" speakers (SP11). Not sure about the drivers, but my guess would be one RST28F-4 tweeter and two DSA135-8's in a slightly overlapping, surface mount type MTM configuration?? Nice looking cabinets!

EDIT: This speaker was actually the 3rd place winner in this category after corrections were made in the tabulations. See post 51 and 65 for additional details. Also, the tweeter John used was the aluminum version, RST28A. And the mid-woofers were DSA115's, not DSA135's. And the name was wrong too, should have been "LR Mains"