Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

[Wolf]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Do you think that the flat cone of the W3-1797 may give it an edge in clarity?

Not just for that reason, nor do I think it is a reason. The flat-TB drivers have exceptional off-axis response, and the construction is plastic for antiresonance. The HD of both the 1335 and 1797 is low, but it's a guess as to which would be better, not hearing either of them.
I guess I'll have to wait and see...
Wolf

[raiderone]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

I hope it is as nice as the W4-1337...wrt to clarity.
If it does not suit me, I may jump up to the W3-1797 in the end, but I hope it works out.

Do you think that the flat cone of the W3-1797 may give it an edge in clarity?

[Wolf]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

I definitely like what i see so far. The ND28 face plate is removable? Do you think it can also be inverted and used to rear mount that tweeter?

Yep- Dan Neubecker removed it in the Duo-T design, and made a small wooden waveguide.

It is a 2-piece frame, only the faceplate comes off. The plastic housing remains around the magnet. So- you can't invert the frame/face to rear-mount it if that is what you mean. You would require a different face, and a clamping mechanism of some sort to mount it withought the face, but it is doable.

Later,
Wolf

[Pete00t]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Are you somehow reading my mind???

The ND28F has a removeable face, and it's plastic. I can therefore do exactly as you have entertained. Probably with the midrange on the other side as well.

We think alike, you and I!
Wolf

I definitely like what i see so far. The ND28 face plate is removable? Do you think it can also be inverted and used to rear mount that tweeter?

[Wolf]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Do you have the dimensions worked out for the cabinet yet? With you the way you are thinking of adding chambers its gonna be hefty.

Not yet, but I have an idea... The woofers need to be really broke in and retested to verify the specs, and then I can remodel for the actual towers.

As a thinking perspective- the baffle will be ~32"H x ~9.75"W, and depth to fill out the volume. They shouldn't get that heavy, as the drivers are all Neo-slugs, and I hope I can get these into a 'short tower' not unlike the Icthus for a little less bulk. The chambers will really only add bracing if you think about it.

I hope to get a makeshift chamber made to couple the 1335 and the PR, and to remeasure T/S, Z, and see what box it would require. If there is really no benefit in the end over non-multi for the mid, I'll abort that operation. I want to see what gives first...

Later,
Wolf

[Pete00t]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Do you have the dimensions worked out for the cabinet yet? With you the way you are thinking of adding chambers its gonna be hefty.

[Wolf]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Would the PR be the right thing for the job? I thought MAPD relied on a resistive element between the two chambers (an aperiodic vent), not a reactive one. You could make a resistive vent by just gluing some felt over a hole in the rear of the smaller chamber. If you need felt, I could mail you a couple squares off my big roll of SAE F-15N felt.

I said, 'quasi', didn't I?? :rolleyes::p:D The reason I stated the MAPD in comparoson to the DCR, is that the MAPD is a closed-ended double-chamber, and the DCR is not. It's a sort of blend of the 2:
"A DCR with a closed-ended secondary termination."

That should be more accurate.
Later,
Wolf

[Taterworks]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Would the PR be the right thing for the job? I thought MAPD relied on a resistive element between the two chambers (an aperiodic vent), not a reactive one. You could make a resistive vent by just gluing some felt over a hole in the rear of the smaller chamber. If you need felt, I could mail you a couple squares off my big roll of SAE F-15N felt.

[Wolf]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

I hope it is as nice as the W4-1337...wrt to clarity.
If it does not suit me, I may jump up to the W3-1797 in the end, but I hope it works out.

Heh- I might even quasi-MAPD the midrange chamber internally with the matching PR. Wouldn't that be neat?? :rolleyes:

Later,
Wolf

[xavier]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

Wolf,

I look forward to hearing about your impressions of the w3-1335sb. I just finished my second project utilizing them.

[Wolf]

"Athos"; Update!

Well- I figure I have the final aesthetic of how these will look.

It won't be an inverted 4-way that looks like the Icthus, that much is pretty concrete. The xover is tentatively a full 4-way cascaded series xover (unless the woofer gives me fits), and the woofer will be loaded into a 3CR. It's been on my mind about how the larger drivers would do in the triple-chamber, since I loved the PL22 in a DCR that Ken Ahern built back in 2003 and started this whole ball a rolling for me. I will not give out how the layout for the ports and things are internally just yet, but I have that set in my head as well.

Now- back in June of last year, I had a xover sim done for the M-T-ST, and T-ST, and I did not post them. The M-T-ST was a parallel-series hybrid, and I've since changed my mind on that. The T-ST has remained unchanged.

Just for comparison's sake, here are the original networks (the FR sim pics are posted earlier in the thread):





Here is the newer Full-Series (:eek sim and xover:




As you can see, the hybrid and the recent full-series change are not that different, and the mid's breakup is a tad more reduced. The reverse null is now deeper and the acoustic phase is closer. Now- if the pre-guessed sensitivity holds up for the woofer, then I should not have to adjust much by the way of L-pad.

Thanks for looking!
Wolf

[Wolf]

Nope...

I'll stick with the straight 4-way, and the 1335 and 1363 as the drivers.
Later,
Wolf

[PunkSweeper]

Re: Got my "Athos" drivers today.....

3- What if I used the W6-1139 and the W8-1363SB in series, with the 1139 in a sealed box and the 1363 in a TL (if it will model well in a TL, and I need more break-in on the drivers to even begin to verify that...)??

That sounds awesome. The sixxer tuned for killer kick and the eight for extension, all in a reasonable footprint!

and 5- Wouldn't that just look really cool in person!!!?? 5 drivers of increasing size in a cohesive sounding very dynamic speaker...

That would be cool, but I think it would be even cooler to have the 1139 at the top. :D

Yeah, I really like this project idea.



Also, I anxiously await your findings on the pebble tweeter, as those are at the center of my yet unfinished (:o) "Small Point-Source Cube" speakers, and also maybe in a future, a subatomic MT with the W2-1767S.

[Wolf]

Further pondering....

I currently have (on-hand) these drivers for the upper-3, as well as the W8-1363 woofers:





I have not solidified this project at all yet, but I've thought more about a few things...

1-Curt's 'Mavericks' at Iowa made me think twice about considering this little gem for the midrange:

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-888

The 4 ohm mid impedance might play havoc with the 4 ohm bass impedance, more on that below...

I could even place the dualing mids side-by-side and switch-out the unit with their relating xover network for demonstration purposes.

2-As well as possibly considering a TL for the bass alignment with the W8-1363SB 8" driver.

3- What if I used the W6-1139 and the W8-1363SB in series, with the 1139 in a sealed box and the 1363 in a TL (if it will model well in a TL, and I need more break-in on the drivers to even begin to verify that...)??




The integration for the mid to 1139 would be just as good as it was in the Icthus I wager, whichever midrange I use due to the wavelength and diameters at task. I'm also betting a sealed box for the 1139 would roll it off early acoustically, and allow the 1363 to take the majority of output down low. All of this of course running in tandem allows for less Xmax on either bass driver.

The reasoning for the sealed/TL tandem idea, is that I cannot run the units in parallel being they are 4 ohms each. Therefore, I cannot do this as a full 5-way or true 4.5 way. It would have to be amped separately or use in series.

Problems inherent are individual bass responses running at once, and I would hopefully be able to incorporate them separately for simulation, and passively at the same time in the end. I don't want to hinder the lowend response with a plate amp's filtration, as I know they will do a lot of nasty (:D) things down low unhindered.

4-Another thought for possibility, is porting the 1139 internally into the chamber for the 1363, and sort-of DCR'ing it for more control.

So- Athos might be getting a slight revamp in the final look. Not that I won't try to simulate the W3-1335S as well if I opt for the different mid....

and 5- Wouldn't that just look really cool in person!!!?? 5 drivers of increasing size in a cohesive sounding very dynamic speaker...

Concerns, opinions, +/-?
Later,
Wolf

[Wolf]

Re: More on the 13-1761S tweeters...

As to the threaded insert, I'm not certain on size yet. It's about an 8-32, but it doesn't keep threading. The mounting screw is not included.
Later,
Wolf

The screw that works is an M4. I will probably mount it to a piece of hardboard on the rear of the baffle, and notch out for the lead wires like a keyhole. This way the screw still mounts and holds tight, and the terminals don't get all mashed or damaged.

I'm toying with a removable 'plate' to mount the upper 3-way and simplify installation in the smaller chamber. I don't think I want the whole xover outside the smaller chamber, so that means it's inside the smaller chamber, and the woofer's outside in the main volume. I only have to seal 2 wire holes this way, and not additionally cram them through a 2.5" hole. I know I could have done that, but it's never easy!

Later,
Wolf