Might as well start another War....

[J.Lee]

I've never bothered to find out what 'obsession' means were you to talk of such in Psychiatric terms. I do sometimes seriously wonder about myself as times in my Life I've gotten involved in studies of this or that and invested large sums of money with little or no profit .

I'm starting to see Audio just the same. I have no money to do the things I want to do yet find myself spending all kinds of time looking at the Big Boy Toys knowing that were I ever to be able to buy these things I would simply do so because 'they must ' sound even better.

I'm finally starting to replace tools I lost and hoping to have a workable shop of sorts by Summers end. Drivers here for 3 planned projects already.

Although I purchased some semi decent stuff for reproduction I'm already thinking of moving to HTPC for Movies and I most definitely will work 1st at moving up in 2channel SS. It will be awhile before I venture further into tubes.

We've got a couple threads running arguing over $300-$500 comparisons of 2 channel SS, Gainclones, low buck tubes and class D Amps.

I'm nowhere near to making that move up to supposed Nirvana and never is the day I'll own 50K Amps.

So .... new War.

Far from high end but getting into decent are a number of Amps. Immediately coming to mind are Emotiva, Bryston, Adcom, Pass Labs, Parasound, Phase Linear, Accuphase, Rotel, older Mac, Marl Levenson and Jeff Rowland.

I'm thinking minimum 150 per channel 4 ohm capable with a price range of as low as $400 but not to exceed $2500 new or used. I've had bad luck with used stuff and don't know if it was shippers or I just got ripped so new with that piece of paper is preferable. Serviceability important. Don't want something only 5 guys in U.S. work on .

So, fellow Maniacs or Sane Rich Guys .... what and why would you buy? Feel free to mention stuff I didn't. Yeah, I know... good luck finding Pass at that price point.

[WmAx]

Re: Might as well start another War....

I've never bothered to find out what 'obsession' means were you to talk of such in Psychiatric terms. I do sometimes seriously wonder about myself as times in my Life I've gotten involved in studies of this or that and invested large sums of money with little or no profit .

I'm starting to see Audio just the same. I have no money to do the things I want to do yet find myself spending all kinds of time looking at the Big Boy Toys knowing that were I ever to be able to buy these things I would simply do so because 'they must ' sound even better.

I'm finally starting to replace tools I lost and hoping to have a workable shop of sorts by Summers end. Drivers here for 3 planned projects already.

Although I purchased some semi decent stuff for reproduction I'm already thinking of moving to HTPC for Movies and I most definitely will work 1st at moving up in 2channel SS. It will be awhile before I venture further into tubes.

We've got a couple threads running arguing over $300-$500 comparisons of 2 channel SS, Gainclones, low buck tubes and class D Amps.

I'm nowhere near to making that move up to supposed Nirvana and never is the day I'll own 50K Amps.

So .... new War.

Far from high end but getting into decent are a number of Amps. Immediately coming to mind are Emotiva, Bryston, Adcom, Pass Labs, Parasound, Phase Linear, Accuphase, Rotel, older Mac, Marl Levenson and Jeff Rowland.

I'm thinking minimum 150 per channel 4 ohm capable with a price range of as low as $400 but not to exceed $2500 new or used. I've had bad luck with used stuff and don't know if it was shippers or I just got ripped so new with that piece of paper is preferable. Serviceability important. Don't want something only 5 guys in U.S. work on .

So, fellow Maniacs or Sane Rich Guys .... what and why would you buy? Feel free to mention stuff I didn't. Yeah, I know... good luck finding Pass at that price point.

Frankly, price has little to do with ideal 'sound' performance in regard to amplifiers. A transparent to human ears amplifier with lots of power and stability into low impedance need not cost more than $300-$500, if performance is the only thing that matters. A $50,000 amplifier's only special feature is cosmetic. The $50,000 amplifier is probably more likely to have intentional changes to impart an audible 'coloration' upon the amplified signal. Fancy brand names and 'reps' by audiophiles on the other hand, will cost you far more to meet that psychological improvement needed to comfort some.

The speaker(s) and room acoustic(s) are by far more relevant.

-Chris

[Pete Schumacher]

Re: Might as well start another War....

I don't know how you could go wrong with Emotiva. Great build quality, great performance, great looks.

[Æ]

Re: Might as well start another War....

I've never bothered to find out what 'obsession' means were you to talk of such in Psychiatric terms. I do sometimes seriously wonder about myself as times in my Life I've gotten involved in studies of this or that and invested large sums of money with little or no profit .

I'm starting to see Audio just the same. I have no money to do the things I want to do yet find myself spending all kinds of time looking at the Big Boy Toys knowing that were I ever to be able to buy these things I would simply do so because 'they must ' sound even better.

I'm finally starting to replace tools I lost and hoping to have a workable shop of sorts by Summers end. Drivers here for 3 planned projects already.

Although I purchased some semi decent stuff for reproduction I'm already thinking of moving to HTPC for Movies and I most definitely will work 1st at moving up in 2channel SS. It will be awhile before I venture further into tubes.

We've got a couple threads running arguing over $300-$500 comparisons of 2 channel SS, Gainclones, low buck tubes and class D Amps.

I'm nowhere near to making that move up to supposed Nirvana and never is the day I'll own 50K Amps.

So .... new War.

Far from high end but getting into decent are a number of Amps. Immediately coming to mind are Emotiva, Bryston, Adcom, Pass Labs, Parasound, Phase Linear, Accuphase, Rotel, older Mac, Marl Levenson and Jeff Rowland.

I'm thinking minimum 150 per channel 4 ohm capable with a price range of as low as $400 but not to exceed $2500 new or used. I've had bad luck with used stuff and don't know if it was shippers or I just got ripped so new with that piece of paper is preferable. Serviceability important. Don't want something only 5 guys in U.S. work on .

So, fellow Maniacs or Sane Rich Guys .... what and why would you buy? Feel free to mention stuff I didn't. Yeah, I know... good luck finding Pass at that price point.

If I had $2500 available, I'd be out there auditioning, listening to a lot of amps. Or maybe I'd just build a pair of tube monoblocks.

[Face]

Re: Might as well start another War....

It depends on what your driving.

For me, my favorite setup is a tube pre or source with a class D amp, specifically Wyred 4 Sound.

[Thomas Brown]

Re: Might as well start another War....

Although I purchased some semi decent stuff for reproduction I'm already thinking of moving to HTPC for Movies

not completely on your actual ?. the htpc for movies is nice, i have one i built, but is expensive and really a pain in the ****. from my experiance with mine, movies (close to 4000), music (over 2 1/2 months, if library played in full, in a row), all worked great, blu-ray player great. but it was still a computer first, and never got used as one. fast-forward ----- my son got a ps3 from his mom for xmas, i built a low budget home server, hooked the ps3 to the server and will never look at an htpc again. actually turned the htpc into my sons gaming computer. ps3 $299, budget server $300+. also a benift of the server is all your computers will have access to the servers content. movie in the bedroom, hook up laptop to tv, and movie on. just food for thought.

[grumpops]

Re: Might as well start another War....

I have personally used "midfi" amps such as Adcom, Rotel, Nad, Carver and my current Marantz MA 500 monos. All bought used w/no problems as others (Audiogon)were upgrading. Heck even picked up a Sunfire True II sub for 450 shipped years back. Too many other things going on to have monies specifically for new pieces. Have had real good luck in this department.
Have some friends with Krell, HK, Mac, & Conrad Johnson power, tube and SS. Others with just recievers: Yamaha, Onkyo, Pioneer etc.
Their speakers vary from ADS, AR, Dalquist, Polk, B&W, Mac, Thiel, Cerwin Vega to Best Buy specials.
All of the above are happy with their systems and their type of music. Only one keeps searching for the Holy Grail of sound and has me come over to audition a new piece. More like look what I bought. Hell my ex-brother in law just LOVES his Techwood w/ Pro Audio set up.
Point being no war needs to be started. Just audition as many pieces that you can. Remember this is for YOUR enjoyment first ....who is paying the bill anyway? Period. End of statment.

[WmAx]

Re: Might as well start another War....

Just audition as many pieces that you can. Remember this is for YOUR enjoyment first ....who is paying the bill anyway? Period. End of statment.

To me, the real issue is the ignorance spread wide that causes so many people to buy into the B.S. and waste $$ on part of the chain that has little influence where investment into the best speaker and room acoustics is where it really pays off.

-Chris

[andy19191]

Re: Might as well start another War....

> So .... new War.

There would be no war if you were clear about what you want from the amplifier.

For example, if the objective is to amplify the input signal without audible degradation then pretty much any competently designed solid state amplifier should be fine. One probably needs to keep away from the aggressively priced stuff which is likely to have cut too many corners to get the price down. Unfortunately the "consumer" press no longer seems to serve the interests of the consumer in this respect and so it is difficult to know which commercial products have in practise crossed the audibly neutral line and which have not.

Audio enthusiasts on the other hand usually want a range of other things from their amplifiers but rarely want to admit to it even to themselves I suspect. There is of course nothing wrong with this but it does lead to disagreement in threads like this because people are not up front and clear that they are addressing different objectives.

[J.Lee]

Re: Might as well start another War....

Andy9 -

Thread title is cynical based upon opinions on other topic mentioned.

I'm simply looking at where I want to go with SS in the future within price range mentioned from those who have experience or expertise there that I don't have.

Looking for opinions on best bang for buck rather than bringing my foolish ego into play.

Next move up will definitely not be $2500 if I hear opinions based on experiences that a $500 - $1000 Amp performed as well or better than those more expensive.

Soupy doesn't start Wars... he isn't bright enough.

[lunchmoney]

Re: Might as well start another War....

In the spirit of DIY, what about kits from Class D Audio? There's a recent thread where some experienced folk were saying good things about these kits...

http://classdaudio.com/

[lasse]

Re: Might as well start another War....

Hello,

Just my Swedish thoughts on the subject......

I beleive that the most cost-efficient way to get the sound you want is to focus mostly on the drivers and make as shure as you can that they have the best chance to do their "job" optimally.

This involves building rigid cabinets with enough bracing etc... Getting rid of the passive XO is another thing and today, there is DSP-gear (ex DCX2496) that lets you do fantastic things to the signal. The amps are not necessarily very "high-endish". 30W/ch will do splendidly even for woofer duty, I think.

This way, I think that you can get away with less than 1000 USD for a really nice set-up.:D

Regards//lasse

[Paul Ebert]

Re: Might as well start another War....

If I had $2500 to spend on an amp? Well, I don't need to do so since I stumbled upon a Spectral DMA-80 at a rummage sale. It sounds great and will drive pretty much anything and that's all I need it to do.

But, if I was in need of a new amp, I would probably build one of the designs Nelson Pass so generously tosses out to the DIY community over at diyAudio. Specifically, at this moment in time, I'd be looking for a clone of his First Watt F5. If that wasn't available I would build one of the F series clones depending on my needs (some of them are pretty specialized). Probably any of them can be made for the price of an Emotiva amp.

Based on the listening I've done I do feel that amps make a sonic difference, but I agree with Chris that speakers and the room have a much more significant impact. Probably an order of magnitude or two more impact.

[johnnyrichards]

Re: Might as well start another War....

$2500? For an amp? I am SO glad there is a company like Emotiva out there so I don't have to spend $2500 on $100 worth of parts in a $100 case wrapped in $2300 worth of marketing. The seven channel Emotiva is going to be my next major purchase (along with a pre/pro with up to date audio decoding). I really see zero reason to drop a months income on a two-channel amp.

And from my understanding, $2500 is on the cheap side when it comes to hi-fi amps? Wow. Imagine the improvements you could make spending that $2500 on room treatments and speakers (as Chris suggests), or spend 1/2 that on DIY treatments and speakers and throw a world-class party with the rest. Or just send it to me and I will send you a custom certificate, printed on parchment colored paper, congratulating you on your purchase of genuine psychological audio nirvane

I am missing so much using my poor little Onkyo HTR

[jclin4]

Re: Might as well start another War....

I like Lunch's suggestion. In fact speaking of obsession, I'm having a hard time not thinking about class d amps. If the feedback and comments from folks on this forum, AudioCircle and diyaudio are accurate, these amps could be something special. 120 watts into 4 ohms for less than $200 no problem.