Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Re: SICK - SICK - SICK . . .

    Originally posted by hyperlite View Post
    this thread encouraged me to order 4 ND105's that i'll make MTM's out of....someday :D :D Any thoughts on a design for this? Musings? OP, that is a really sweet setup...i've been dying to take advantage of this deal :D You don't have a picture of the finished xover do you?
    that's all I could think of as I listened to thses after work tonight. Again, I HAD to physically get up off myass to make sure the sub wasn't on, even a little (we used it for a movie last night, but it was OFF !). I built these, and I can't believe how they perform. As the poster who built a small "sub" with one of them said, this little 4" Neo woofer is the "star of the show".

    Pic 1 shows the relief on the backside of the baffle behind the woofer which IMO is crucial, otherwise there's almost no room between the frame and the straight cut hole for any air to move.

    Pic 2 shows the box before glueup. I had a side off to check the fit and wiring of everything. I put "kangaback" carpet (it has a closed cell foam back, kinda hard to find nowadays) on the right side ONLY (the side that's off has the convoluted foam on it) to make mounting the XO a little easier, but next pair will be foam on all 5 sides.

    Pic 3 shows a prototype 5 element board. This is the board I used in the final, but the caps and one resistor have been altered, and a 3rd resistor was added.

    To the previous poster, we all have different parameters that "drive" us into any particular design. For this design, my $55 budget was (for me) the only thing that was not negotiable. When I had to increase the cap values a tad, and add an extra resistor, I had to rob Peter (somewhere) to pay Paul. In this case, I had enough in the budget to drop 2 of the resistors from 10w down to 5w. (I also looked at using a #20 coil.) YOU can use botique caps and resistors when you build it if you want to. That's kinda what DIY is all about. I don't believe that this XO is the best that can be designed for this driver set, but it very well MIGHT be the best XO for them that costs less than $7.

    These DO have good imaging, and I've bottomed out the woofer on one channel and the tweeter survived. Over time, if I "toast" a tweeter, I'll pop another one in there for $8. Both of these drivers should be around a while. The woofer series is new, and I think the tweeters have only been out a few years. This is the first time I've used a Dayton Neo tweeter.

    Anyway, adding a shunt coil to the HP might require a cap and L-pad change. It will definately shift the phase. All things are related. I might look at the MtM idea, but I wouldn't be offended if someone else designed it either.

    Right now I'm just wondering who will be the second one to hear these little monsters, and if they'll be as impressed with them as I am.

    Chris
    Attached Files

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: SICK - SICK - SICK . . .

      Originally posted by Chris Roemer View Post
      that's all I could think of as I listened to thses after work tonight. Again, I HAD to physically get up off myass to make sure the sub wasn't on, even a little (we used it for a movie last night, but it was OFF !). I built these, and I can't believe how they perform. As the poster who built a small "sub" with one of them said, this little 4" Neo woofer is the "star of the show".

      Pic 1 shows the relief on the backside of the baffle behind the woofer which IMO is crucial, otherwise there's almost no room between the frame and the straight cut hole for any air to move.

      Pic 2 shows the box before glueup. I had a side off to check the fit and wiring of everything. I put "kangaback" carpet (it has a closed cell foam back, kinda hard to find nowadays) on the right side ONLY (the side that's off has the convoluted foam on it) to make mounting the XO a little easier, but next pair will be foam on all 5 sides.

      Pic 3 shows a prototype 5 element board. This is the board I used in the final, but the caps and one resistor have been altered, and a 3rd resistor was added.

      To the previous poster, we all have different parameters that "drive" us into any particular design. For this design, my $55 budget was (for me) the only thing that was not negotiable. When I had to increase the cap values a tad, and add an extra resistor, I had to rob Peter (somewhere) to pay Paul. In this case, I had enough in the budget to drop 2 of the resistors from 10w down to 5w. (I also looked at using a #20 coil.) YOU can use botique caps and resistors when you build it if you want to. That's kinda what DIY is all about. I don't believe that this XO is the best that can be designed for this driver set, but it very well MIGHT be the best XO for them that costs less than $7.

      These DO have good imaging, and I've bottomed out the woofer on one channel and the tweeter survived. Over time, if I "toast" a tweeter, I'll pop another one in there for $8. Both of these drivers should be around a while. The woofer series is new, and I think the tweeters have only been out a few years. This is the first time I've used a Dayton Neo tweeter.

      Anyway, adding a shunt coil to the HP might require a cap and L-pad change. It will definately shift the phase. All things are related. I might look at the MtM idea, but I wouldn't be offended if someone else designed it either.

      Right now I'm just wondering who will be the second one to hear these little monsters, and if they'll be as impressed with them as I am.

      Chris
      Chris,

      Thank you VERY much for the thoughts and pictures. I've been modeling an MTM configuration all evening, which honestly is nothing more than an evolution of the Nano's with the previously suggested xover mods. It looks good. real good. :D This driver models like Adriana Lima. I have great respect for your firm budget...the only reason i'm looking at MTM is because i would like to transition these to entry level HT duty in the not-to-distant future. Assuming no extra cost from swapping the value of the xover parts, the only price increase is in materials and the two extra drivers. Enter the classic sob-story about no time for hobbies...it's going to be a few weeks before i can get rolling on this. I absolutely can't wait to hear these guys make noise. Thanks again for the design, impeccable clarity of instructions, and insight!

      Trent
      The TK421 kicks it up another 3 or 4 quads per channel.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: SICK - SICK - SICK . . .

        Originally posted by hyperlite View Post
        Chris,

        Thank you VERY much for the thoughts and pictures. I've been modeling an MTM configuration all evening, which honestly is nothing more than an evolution of the Nano's with the previously suggested xover mods. It looks good. real good. :D This driver models like Adriana Lima. I have great respect for your firm budget...the only reason i'm looking at MTM is because i would like to transition these to entry level HT duty in the not-to-distant future. Assuming no extra cost from swapping the value of the xover parts, the only price increase is in materials and the two extra drivers. Enter the classic sob-story about no time for hobbies...it's going to be a few weeks before i can get rolling on this. I absolutely can't wait to hear these guys make noise. Thanks again for the design, impeccable clarity of instructions, and insight!

        Trent
        Here's my version.

        - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
        edit on 3.16.11

        Please see my NanoNeos/ntn "album" for the latest crossover

        eoe
        - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

        HP - 2nd order for safety: 4uF cap stays, then a #20 0.30mH shunt coil (to ground). Change L-pad to 5 ohm SR (series) and 3 ohm PR. Tweeter keeps positive polarity.

        LP (for two ND105-4's in series): bigger coil - a #18 1.4mH (0.6 ohm DCR). Zobel changes to 6 ohm resistor and 4uF cap.

        About 82+/-2dB, with 3dB BSC and an Fc near 3.3 kHz.

        My cabinet choice: 28"h x 6"w x 9.5"d. 0.55 cf
        A 2"d x 7" long rear vent centered 10" up from the bottom tunes this box to 39 Hz yielding an F3 of 38. I'd mount the upper woofer's center 4" down from the box top. This puts the tweeter at about 21", so theese should sound best on about 12" high stands.

        Off you go.

        Chris
        Last edited by Chris Roemer; 03-16-2011, 10:27 AM.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

          You're awesome Chris.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

            If I were to have a budget of $75 instead of $55, would that open up opportunity for a significant and justifiable crossover upgrade?

            Kevin

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

              Wow chris, thanks for the xo rework. Something like the attached? Let it be known that i'm a crossover newb...i still have much to learn.


              What would you guys consider an acceptable port velocity for a system like this? I assume there is nothing wrong with using the 5% rule...
              Attached Files
              Last edited by hyperlite; 06-18-2010, 08:52 PM.
              The TK421 kicks it up another 3 or 4 quads per channel.

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                Originally posted by hyperlite View Post
                Wow chris, thanks for the xo rework. Something like the attached? Let it be known that i'm a crossover newb...i still have much to learn.


                What would you guys consider an acceptable port velocity for a system like this? I assume there is nothing wrong with using the 5% rule...

                You're good to go on the XO.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                  Well, I'm sold. I'm making a pair of these as my left and right front channels for use in my home theater. They will be used in conjunction with a powered sub and an AviaTrix sealed center channel.

                  These are going to be on a shelf (unfortunately) with about 3 -4" maximum clearance behind them, and hoping that will be ok... this leads me to a couple questions before I order my parts.

                  1) Because of spacing issues, I'll be building these in the smaller cabinet size and using the 7" port option... willl the lack of space behind my speakers affect the port negatively? Should I move the port to the front or side of the cabinet?

                  2) I read this thread a few times before posting, so I hope I didn't miss an answer to this question ... there was mention of an upgrade to the original crossover using a shunt coil on the tweeter... I see the model for the MtM crossover upgrade... is the original Nano Neo (Mt) crossover upgrade modeled or available before I submit my PE order?

                  Thanks in advance for the help, and thank you Chris for this design... I've been on the fence for a while as to picking my next build. Just couldn't pass these up.

                  Johnny Ravo
                  "I could get a better look at a t-bone steak by sticking my head up a bull's a**, but I'd just as soon take my butcher's word for it."

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                    Originally posted by ravo2000 View Post
                    Well, I'm sold. I'm making a pair of these as my left and right front channels for use in my home theater. They will be used in conjunction with a powered sub and an AviaTrix sealed center channel.

                    These are going to be on a shelf (unfortunately) with about 3 -4" maximum clearance behind them, and hoping that will be ok... this leads me to a couple questions before I order my parts.

                    1) Because of spacing issues, I'll be building these in the smaller cabinet size and using the 7" port option... willl the lack of space behind my speakers affect the port negatively? Should I move the port to the front or side of the cabinet?

                    2) I read this thread a few times before posting, so I hope I didn't miss an answer to this question ... there was mention of an upgrade to the original crossover using a shunt coil on the tweeter... I see the model for the MtM crossover upgrade... is the original Nano Neo (Mt) crossover upgrade modeled or available before I submit my PE order?

                    Thanks in advance for the help, and thank you Chris for this design... I've been on the fence for a while as to picking my next build. Just couldn't pass these up.

                    Johnny Ravo
                    As long as the air coming out the vent can get out w/out restrictions, you should be OK (like the way a fridge's heat can escape from the radiantor on the back as long as there's enough room above the top of the box. You shouldn't really put them on a shelf that's only 15" high, for example. I've used vented cabs angled up against an obstruction, and although I've never measured the effect, I think you probably lower the cab tuning if it's restrictive, but that's not necessarily a bad thing.

                    The original Nano Neos XO is fine w/out an "upgrade". I did add a coil (for safety) on the MtM request, because they'll probably get cranked louder.

                    Chris

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                      Thanks, Chris for the clarification on the XO. I'm ordering parts today and really looking forward to this build.

                      Johnny Ravo

                      EDIT: parts ordered! did have to upgrade to the $1.25 3 ohm 10 watt resister from the 39 cent version due to backorder... also ordered a tritrix
                      (was going to do an Aviatrix CC, but couldn"t pass on the value of the Tritrix kit) component kit for my CC... uh oh, that's going to leave me witha an extra speakers' worth of parts... I'm sure I'll find a use for them.....
                      Last edited by ravo2000; 06-22-2010, 04:05 PM.
                      "I could get a better look at a t-bone steak by sticking my head up a bull's a**, but I'd just as soon take my butcher's word for it."

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                        I ordered the parts for these. I couldn't pass up the $55 price. To top it off, in my part bin I already had a pair of 0.5mH 18 ga inductors that I can easily unwind a little to 0.44mH. Subtract out the inductors and and adding a pair of ports, terminal cups, and shipping my total came to $68.

                        The ND140 is driver is a great driver. I was very impressed with it recently. so, I couldn't pass this up. I have no doubt that the ND105 will impress me also.

                        This is just to give me something to do. I'll probably give these away to a friend after I've played with them for a while.
                        - Ryan

                        CJD Ochocinco ND140/BC25SC06 MTM & TM
                        CJD Khanspires - A Dayton RS28/RS150/RS225 WMTMW
                        CJD Khancenter - A Dayton RS28/RS150/RS180 WTMW Center
                        CJD In-Khan-Neatos - A Dayton RS180/RS150/RS28 In/On Wall MTW

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                          I just placed an order as well. I was going to dump some extra items in my cart to get the free shipping, but just couldn't justify spending an extra $50 to save $12. Sorry PE reason won over emotion this time.

                          I assume the drivers are not recessed in the baffle?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: One day left !

                            Originally posted by kornphlake View Post
                            I just placed an order as well. I was going to dump some extra items in my cart to get the free shipping, but just couldn't justify spending an extra $50 to save $12. Sorry PE reason won over emotion this time.

                            I assume the drivers are not recessed in the baffle?
                            Nope. Easy as pi. I DO strongly recommend cutting some clearance on the backside of the baffle for the woofers to breathe. Pics of all on my first few posts.

                            Chris

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                              *BUMP*

                              Sale or no sale, this thread deserves more attention.


                              I just finally received all of my parts ( a little shipping error, but PE hits one out of the park with customer service yet again)

                              I'm hoping to make some sawdust in the next couple of days, but the 100 degree temps in RI over the last week have diverted me to other projects... MDF dust is bad enough without the full body sweat!

                              I'll post a build log once I finish. Thanks again, Chris... you inspired me to purchase a 3/8" rabbeting bit as well. Also going to try my hand at some raw veneer for this project.

                              Johnny Ravo
                              "I could get a better look at a t-bone steak by sticking my head up a bull's a**, but I'd just as soon take my butcher's word for it."

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: on Sale - $55/pr (drivers & XO)

                                I took a lot out of me not to build these. However, I already have the drivers for RJB's Microbes and JKim's Poor Man's High End Monitors waiting for cabinets and crossovers when I get back to Tulsa in August.

                                Not to mention I've got the mids and RS180's ready to go for my Mini Statement L/C/R. If anyone has some of the Fountek Neo3CD they're looking to get rid of hit me up.

                                So many other projects I want to do though.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X