Pictures from Dayton 2010

[Jim Griffin]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

TTan98,

Both of my speakers I had at Dayton have long threads on diyaudio.com forums. Many folks have built their own clones with success.

Examples of links on these designs:

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-...bbon-mltl.html

http://homepage.mac.com/tlinespeaker...LDesignPak.pdf

Jim

[ttan98]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

Since your 2005 paper, you have changed the design slightly, an e.g. is the FR125S and WR125S are not lined up back to back anymore. There is an offset, ie the WR125S is mounted lower, by how much? also the back tweeter(what brand and model) is crossed over(what is a the x-over network, a simple capacitor what value?) to the WR125S and mounted directly behind the FR125S if not where? etc

The above arrangement does I believe improves the sound reproduction.

[penngray]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

These were final assembled on Friday evening before the show.

Let me say that PE ROCKS. I was aided in dialing in the cd (adjustment of the attenuation pot) through the availability of the measuring gear in-room. That removed one potential weakness.

These were next to last to be heard in the over $200 category. I knew before they played that it would be tough to break into the top 3.

One judge told me that he heard some "horn honk or upper mid-range cloudiness". On the drive home I came to the as-yet unproven conclusion that I overstuffed the cabs. The cab's are almost fully lined with Owens Corning 703. I used at least as much stuffing as called for through simulation. I may have been careless in distributing the stuffing...we'll see; er...hear.
On the other hand, people whose opinion I value, along with total strangers made favorable, encouraging comments.
I'll reserve my personal comments to this: it was a blast! :D

Not to be overlooked is CBT as discussed by Don Keele is the real deal.

Certainly not last: Anyone who can pass along our Best Wishes to Bogdan please do so. Let us know how he is doing.

Did you consider using foam (ala Geddes) on the waveguide? Also I think adding plumbers putty to the back of the waveguide will take all "ringing" sounds out of the waveguide. Im currently measuring the differences and I like what I hear.

btw, I also think its extremely hard for a speaker like this to place in such a broad category. The focus of the listening panel isn't going to allow this speaker to shine.

[panomaniac]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

The audience vote actually weighs heavier than the judge's. I think Ed's speakers got good marks from the judges.

The contest goes by very fast. Many speakers you can get a feel for in a few seconds. But the really good speakers need longer than the time allowed. Sort of a "play-off" or elimination system. But that would be a 2 day affair, at least.

[penngray]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

What I was trying to post, is that content, listening levels, general audience focus does not favor waveguide designs.

[edlafontaine]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

penngray posted:
Did you consider using foam (ala Geddes) on the waveguide? Also I think adding plumbers putty to the back of the waveguide will take all "ringing" sounds out of the waveguide. Im currently measuring the differences and I like what I hear.

I have foam on hand...and the instructions with which to make a hot-wire cutter. I have begun working on the paper templates.

The throat will get attention. I'll graphically compare the 14.6 degree exit angle of the DE250 with the entrance angle of the 152i...determine a suitable thickness for shim stock & blend the two with no void/cavity. Even the outer throat of the 152i needs some smoothing...aahhh!, the pitfalls of being analytical...

Please keep me informed of your progress.

[penngray]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

Thanks,

The thread for treating the waveguide is here. Its just discussion, zero conclusions yet.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...plumbers+putty

Titch used long strand reinforced fiberglass filler and I used plumbers putty after trying modelling clay which cracked and stopped holding after 3 weeks.

I have been slow to get all measurements done but the simple coin test and then listening test (I have Active XOs already) showed great subjective improvements.

[Paul K.]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

Actually Dan did the primary TL design for the Blades, just using me for a sanity check. The Blades are really good but with the music used to judge the Unlimited Class as well as the over $200 Class, none of those speakers were able to show their true abilities.

Congratulations to the four winners.
Paul

Congratulations to Dan (and Paul Kittinger (?) for his Transmission Line design for the RSS265)!

Dan's got a thread over at HTGuide on the Blades. However I'm not claiming the crossover design posted there was the one he presented at the DIY.

I only wish New Zealand was closer. It would be great to attend, meet and learn.

[Jim Griffin]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

ttan98,

My bipoles at Dayton were the original ones with the two drivers at the same height front and back. The cross sectional area of the MLTL is doubled to account for the two drivers in the same box. I have a later design with CSS EL70 drivers which are in offset front and back MLTLs. When you offset the heights of the front and rear drivers you essentially have to siamese two separate MLTLs and have porting from both front and rear.

A super tweeter can be used on the rear to add to the reverb field for the upper octave wherein the direct full range drivers start to beam. In reality I would integrate the super tweeter into the mix only after sorting out the placement of the speakers in the listening room. The super tweeter can be one of many tweets but you do want to have low 90's dB sensitivity and 8 ohms impedance for starters. The super tweeter and a capacitor are connected in series and then placed in parallel across the bipole pair. The cap would be a fairly small value (say 1 mf) and adjusted to your taste from there to get the sound you like.

Jim

[Dennis H]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

The throat will get attention. I'll graphically compare the 14.6 degree exit angle of the DE250 with the entrance angle of the 152i...determine a suitable thickness for shim stock & blend the two with no void/cavity. Even the outer throat of the 152i needs some smoothing...aahhh!, the pitfalls of being analytical...

Yeah, the throats on mine could use some work. The entrance isn't perfectly round and is bigger than 1" in places. Looks like about a 1/4" wooden shim glued on would let you get a nice smooth blend -- glue sandpaper to a 1/4 section of a 1" dowel and have at it for a few minutes. I think a smooth blend to the driver is more important than the exact curve.

[Zilch]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

The audience vote actually weighs heavier than the judge's. I think Ed's speakers got good marks from the judges.

The contest goes by very fast. Many speakers you can get a feel for in a few seconds. But the really good speakers need longer than the time allowed. Sort of a "play-off" or elimination system. But that would be a 2 day affair, at least.

Olive teaches that the single most significant factor in initial listener impressions is low frequency extension. I don't know how well Ed's eWave Delites do that, but I'll be providing LF augmentation any time I demo the small-cab Deluxe in the future.

[Once I work that out.... ;) ]

[Froste]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

For more pictures go here

[Wolf]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

Griffins can dance....:D



Later,
Wolf

[robwest]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

Thanks for the pic update, Ed. I can't tell which is brighter, that carpet, or, your grin!:D Congrats!

[envisionelec]

Re: Pictures from Dayton 2010

That one was mine. Emphasis on the "one"..... only half the pair played that night, there was an internal amplifier fatality in the other. There was a short thread about it earlier this year on DIY audio:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi...xperiment.html

I may replace the amps with something less fussy and re-enter them next year. If I can find something powerful enough and small enough, with a built-in power supply.

Thanks,
Bill

Bill, I missed speaking with you after the show... Did you determine what failed?