"Knuckle Head" Speak Build

[bvn]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Proving, once again, you can never have too many clamps.
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What a fun project!

[theLinks]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Good Job Dave, all I can say is "WOW"!
Tim

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

It'll be a challenge not to listen to TV and watch the speakers...;)

top notch, way cool

I have a track saved for him of a Harley running. When played out of one speaker you would swear the sound is coming from the exhaust.

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

You better check your carpet for an oil spot after all Harleys do like to mark their spot. lol jk Wow! those look really good. You did really nice work. Now they are gunna want the rest of the bike (a matching sub to go with it.)

I was going to take an outside pic with an oil puddle underneath, but figured I better not. :D

Dave

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Geeze man! Very sorry to hear, I could never imagine as a parent out living your child. Heart-breaking. Its a heck of a gift, and since music brings joy (for most), there is at least 20-30 years of it there.... That is until the NPE's dry up ;) ;)heh heh!

No NPE's in this one. I did have to stuff those big MP caps into them though. I now what your saying about the growing process. At this point if I did hear a difference in a cap I wouldn't know that's what it was. Between comparing PCD to actual measurements is making a huge difference in helping me pin point what I am hearing and why. I was actually able to pick out an instrument last night and now what frequency it was playing at. I went into Media Players equalizer and sure enough found it right were I thought it was. Eventually I hope to get to a point were my learning slows so when I hear something I like I will know what caused it rather then think it has to be one of three things I might have done. I guess that's part of the fun though experimenting.
It is a shame about my niece. One of the things I remember was my niece gave my brother in law a cd with a song, I think called Butter Fly Kisses. After her death he constantly played that song and would well up every time. So I do think these speakers and amp will be appreciated.
Another moment that comes to mind is him grabbing the volume knob on is cheapo system and cranking it to major distortion. Hopefully this system will blow him out of the room before he gets to that point. :D

Dave

[LUKENESSMONSTER]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

You better check your carpet for an oil spot after all Harleys do like to mark their spot. lol jk Wow! those look really good. You did really nice work. Now they are gunna want the rest of the bike (a matching sub to go with it.)

[mzisserson]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Figured I might as well post the final set up I built for my sister in law to give to her husband for Christmas. The budget I was given was $500. I started Nov. 6th finished Nov. 27th. I ended up getting the Onkyo TX-SR608 7.2. Total investment was $540.00 for speakers and amp. Boxed up and ready for delivery. I played them a few days with this amp. I am very happy with this set up for the money invested. I think he is going to be very surprised.
My brother and sister in law lost their 26 year old daughter in an auto accident two years ago and have had a pretty rough time with it. I think this may help just a little bit.



Dave

Geeze man! Very sorry to hear, I could never imagine as a parent out living your child. Heart-breaking. Its a heck of a gift, and since music brings joy (for most), there is at least 20-30 years of it there.... That is until the NPE's dry up ;) ;)heh heh!

[edlafontaine]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

It'll be a challenge not to listen to TV and watch the speakers...;)

top notch, way cool

[mzisserson]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Thanks for the complement Mike. As I look back on choosing the Mini's as my first build, thanks to everyone hear swaying me towards them, then building the Continuums it really helps give me a great reference point. It does seem every speaker I build opens my eyes a little more. Down side is it also makes me realize how much I still don't know. Especially menipulating the crossover . I did A/B these with the Continuums and I was very happy on how they compared. They play a little lower and are a few dBs more efficient but I look at that as my handy cap. This was also how I new the vocals weren't quit right. I also had one of my Rock It speakers set up as a D choice. It's really interesting how each speaker has , I guess the word is "sonic", difference.
Last night I got both Rock It speakers up and running and again I got that big smile. With the MLTL set up, thanks to Paul, The attention to the cabinet damping and just as important the room treatments I had another huge experience. All the words I described above about the Knuckle Heads were topped. There are still issues in the mid/tweeter range but with all the damping I have done with the speakers and room I'm amazed how instrument separation has improved. This may sound funny but at times its almost like I can see the music. Only way I can explain it. Interestingly I took my Knuckle Heads to another room to see how they sounded and they lost half of the magic they had in my treated room. Now I'm getting disappointing with my Mini's in my living room. Now I can hear the reflections since I know what it sounds like with out them. Makes me wonder why more hasn't been done in the Home Building industry to have built in damping in homes. Just to tone down the everyday noises would be nice. This summer I insulated the walls and ceiling of my shop and can't believe how much more quite my tools are. I guess as long as I don't drywall.

Dave

Dave,
It sounds like part of the growing process to me. It is one of the major reasons it is so important to connect what is happening sonically to the technical aspcts of why. As you can clearly see also, it's not always the speaker that is to blame !!! I am constantly changing definitions, and hearing things that I need to track down on paper. Seems the growth never stops. It really had completely changed how I design over time. Morphing from what is right by the "rules" to what is right by my unique set of rules. You will find your own, and I think most designers have their set they prefer. At the end of the day... It's cool, huh?:D

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Figured I might as well post the final set up I built for my sister in law to give to her husband for Christmas. The budget I was given was $500. I started Nov. 6th finished Nov. 27th. I ended up getting the Onkyo TX-SR608 7.2. Total investment was $540.00 for speakers and amp. Boxed up and ready for delivery. I played them a few days with this amp. I am very happy with this set up for the money invested. I think he is going to be very surprised.
My brother and sister in law lost their 26 year old daughter in an auto accident two years ago and have had a pretty rough time with it. I think this may help just a little bit.



Dave

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Dave,
A lot of times when there are ahem... strong conversations... around here, I like to relate some of what is going on to everyone's point of reference. From the psycological//psycoacoustical aspect of "if you have never heard it, you never know!" It seems with these lil' buggers you have heard some new aspects of what a speaker can do. Aspects you will difine all of your future speakers by. Aspects that suprised you, as you may have never heard them before no matter how well a speaker measures. It is a great learning expirence, and if you relate what you have heard here to your design, you will only keep growing as a designer. I am happy to see they turned out so well! It is funny, just when it seems you have heard it all, something else comes along and completey re-defines your point of reference.

They are amazing, which I had a pinky full of your cabinet ability!!!!

Thanks for the complement Mike. As I look back on choosing the Mini's as my first build, thanks to everyone hear swaying me towards them, then building the Continuums it really helps give me a great reference point. It does seem every speaker I build opens my eyes a little more. Down side is it also makes me realize how much I still don't know. Especially menipulating the crossover . I did A/B these with the Continuums and I was very happy on how they compared. They play a little lower and are a few dBs more efficient but I look at that as my handy cap. This was also how I new the vocals weren't quit right. I also had one of my Rock It speakers set up as a D choice. It's really interesting how each speaker has , I guess the word is "sonic", difference.
Last night I got both Rock It speakers up and running and again I got that big smile. With the MLTL set up, thanks to Paul, The attention to the cabinet damping and just as important the room treatments I had another huge experience. All the words I described above about the Knuckle Heads were topped. There are still issues in the mid/tweeter range but with all the damping I have done with the speakers and room I'm amazed how instrument separation has improved. This may sound funny but at times its almost like I can see the music. Only way I can explain it. Interestingly I took my Knuckle Heads to another room to see how they sounded and they lost half of the magic they had in my treated room. Now I'm getting disappointing with my Mini's in my living room. Now I can hear the reflections since I know what it sounds like with out them. Makes me wonder why more hasn't been done in the Home Building industry to have built in damping in homes. Just to tone down the everyday noises would be nice. This summer I insulated the walls and ceiling of my shop and can't believe how much more quite my tools are. I guess as long as I don't drywall.

Dave

[mzisserson]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

My listening impressions;
This was a huge learning experience. A lot of things clicked on this one. After listening a while it seemed the vocals just didn't sound right. Best way to explain it is that they sounded like they were coming from a small speaker. So I moved the xover point of the woofer/ mid up from 450 to 600. Thought this may make the difference. Sure enough it made quite a difference. I tweaked the tweeter a little around 7KHz only because there was a peak from measuring. I couldn't really hear it.
These speakers seem to excel with imaging and sound field. I think I have learned what a few phrases I’ve heard mean. “Vocals being pin point” these seem to do this very well. “Spacious sound stage” I can hear a separation in instruments like if never heard before. Almost like a 3D effect ,at times, like there is depth to the sound stage. The sound stage also seems to come from behind the speakers slightly. The AC25TG is really a nice tweeter. I am really surprised what a nice job it does especially when my reference tweeters are the RS28F and Fountek Neo CD3.
I used the Peerless TC08SD69 3.5 dome for a mid. It seems to do a pretty good job. Occasionally it has a small speaker sound to it mostly noticeable in certain vocals. At high volumes I notice a harshness occasionally in some vocals. May not be the speakers fault possibly the xover guy. Possibly a peak around 2K. I’ll have to measure and check that out. If I had time to tweak some more it would definitely be the mid.
Dave

Dave,
A lot of times when there are ahem... strong conversations... around here, I like to relate some of what is going on to everyone's point of reference. From the psycological//psycoacoustical aspect of "if you have never heard it, you never know!" It seems with these lil' buggers you have heard some new aspects of what a speaker can do. Aspects you will difine all of your future speakers by. Aspects that suprised you, as you may have never heard them before no matter how well a speaker measures. It is a great learning expirence, and if you relate what you have heard here to your design, you will only keep growing as a designer. I am happy to see they turned out so well! It is funny, just when it seems you have heard it all, something else comes along and completey re-defines your point of reference.

They are amazing, which I had a pinky full of your cabinet ability!!!!

[KLR]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Wow! Awesome job.

[davepellegrene]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Thanks again guys for all the great complements and support. Also all the ideas everyone has given. Even if I didn't use an idea that was given some lead me to other ideas. Hearing everyone's feed back has really been great. This is a great bunch of people on this board. I believe that has a lot to do with this being a fun hobby.
Dave

[ocdSCHACK]

Re: "Knuckle Head" Speak Build

Wow! Just wanted to say how great the build looks. You did an awesome job, and even better you saved cheese for avoiding all the pricey auto body supplies. If you took off the speaker stands, I think people would try and figure out why the engine looks off... not why the speaker looks like an engine. Really awesome build; Great Job!!!