Official Iron Speaker Thread

[Pete Basel]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

Was the noise bandwidth limited at all?
I'd suggest something like 200 to 10 kHz
so that the critical midrange level is matched.

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

I don't care what's on the disc, but it would be good to nail down the maximum loudness that a CD will be played. I have a Stereophile test CD with pink noise. If I play it at 70 dB on my speaker, and leave the volume knob alone, then I know how loud the test tracks are going to be played. I can try every torture track I have before finalizing the design. I would like an accurate reference. What are you using for the pink noise source?

If the volume is to be left the same for each speaker demo, the level for each track needs to make sense. Dianna Krall at 85 dB would not sound natural, and Fleetwood Mac at 75 dB wouldn't be loud enough.

I do not want to get into what is "natural" or not. We set up to about 70dB (75dB at -20Dbfs was VERY loud with music).

Do not be scared of the "room". The New Horizons and Lil Brits both showed well! As did the Levitations, Tiny TiMMs, Roman's Walnuts, among other small speakers without stress or distortion.

I'd be happy to do the CD mix of 5 short cuts.

Interesting quandry though, if you're going to say that the contestants should not know ahead of time what's going to be on it.

On a general level I guess we can all discuss the spread across genres.

But as far as specific tracks, who's coming as an observer and has some suggestions?

We can use the previous 2 DIY's CD's as a starting reference point. ("too much of this ", "not enough of that" , "this track was great" , "that one, not so much")

Let me know you're thoughts.

At last year's DIY the first track was -20dbfs of noise, and we calibrated each speaker to the same level. Phil manned the meter which I think was set to around 78 db at his listening position (gotta check that) Once the music played I don't think we measured an RMS of much more than 90ish. just keep in mind that this is a HUGE room; I'd estimate that the listening position starts at around 10-12 feet with people spread out a bit beyond that.

As far as track balancing, I can do that. I'll spend some time sequencing and crossfading into a more palatable, musical experience. I prefer to leave them as unadulterated as possible, but yes if there happens to be something modern (loud) chosen for the mix, it would have to lowered by several dB to avoid killing your ears.

Jeff,
Mix exactly how you did for DIY NY events. It worked out perfectly and thank you kindly for your time to do this again. This is not a variable I would like to mess with and I believe everyone would agree with me the mixing for the past couple of years has worked out perfectly.

I would like to handle the music as we have done in the past and Jeff, I ask you kindly to be the ultimate decision maker depending on how many track we recieve. Since it is only 5 tracks (maybe 7 depending on the # of entrys) the selections have to be quite varied. I do not think EVERY track submitted will be able to make the demo.


It would be very easy for anyone to acquire and build to the tracks for the contest. That is why they will remain a secret until a week or two before the competition. A good design should be prepared for anything.

There WILL be at least these two types of tracks:

One torture track

One Female and one male (unless one is selected with a combined duette which is more ideal) Vocal.



Also, to all entry's: Jeff has a very good ear for music, and most submitted tracks are usually not "compressed crap". He does just fine mixing both natural acoustic music and studio recordings and I am comfortable we are in good hands.

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

Was the noise bandwidth limited at all?
I'd suggest something like 200 to 10 kHz
so that the critical midrange level is matched.

Great question Pete! I do believe it was not, but we were C weighting it on the SPL meter.

[rpb]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

At last year's DIY the first track was -20dbfs of noise, and we calibrated each speaker to the same level. Phil manned the meter which I think was set to around 78 db at his listening position (gotta check that) Once the music played I don't think we measured an RMS of much more than 90ish. just keep in mind that this is a HUGE room; I'd estimate that the listening position starts at around 10-12 feet with people spread out a bit beyond that.

As far as track balancing, I can do that. I'll spend some time sequencing and crossfading into a more palatable, musical experience. I prefer to leave them as unadulterated as possible, but yes if there happens to be something modern (loud) chosen for the mix, it would have to lowered by several dB to avoid killing your ears.

I just set my volume using the test CD to 73 dB at my seat, and played a wide variety of my CDs through one speaker. About half were perfect at this level. Most of the rest, I turned up another two or three dB. As much as 6 dB on a couple. So I'm now pretty sure there's nothing to worry about even with a single 5 1/4" woofer.

For track balancing, I would simply just not use one that needs adjusting.

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

I just set my volume using the test CD to 73 dB at my seat, and played a wide variety of my CDs through one speaker. About half were perfect at this level. Most of the rest, I turned up another two or three dB. As much as 6 dB on a couple. So I'm now pretty sure there's nothing to worry about even with a single 5 1/4" woofer.

For track balancing, I would simply just not use one that needs adjusting.

From what you described, I was not too worried. ;)

I will add you to the "in" pile then.

[boroson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

Biff Jennings and I from Nags Head would like to enter. Bryan Oroson

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

Biff Jennings and I from Nags Head would like to enter. Bryan Oroson

Cool! Just send me a PM with your names and e-mails.

Got quite a few 11th hour entey's! Will update the list.

[AR3A]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

someone stole your tweets and replace them with chinese crap! ;)

Thank you lol :D

The originals had mold growing out of them so no way to really restore them.

I listen to these everyday and they sound pretty good.

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

Updated

[r-carpenter]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

I am at $195.54 per two speakers. :D

[rpb]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

I am at $195.54 per two speakers. :D

How does the bass response of the ROOM measure? Particularly the 40 hz to 80 hz range. Are there any notable peaks or dips that would help, or hinder a small sealed speaker?

[r-carpenter]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

How does the bass response of the ROOM measure? Particularly the 40 hz to 80 hz range. Are there any notable peaks or dips that would help, or hinder a small sealed speaker?

I can give you the size of the room (which is 1200ft^2)
Haven't had much of issues myself.

[rpb]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

I can give you the size of the room (which is 1200ft^2)
Haven't had much of issues myself.

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

[mzisserson]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

I would go with room dimensions. There is no way to "Design" for this room and any ails your speaker will suffer, so will the rest. Roman has about 1/2 of it filled and there are many items amongst the shop so it is almost like a giant diffusion chamber. Knowing how my designs sound there vs. at home vs in other rooms I would say design like you would any other speaker for normal lifestyle use and you will be fine. Actually, speakers sound suprizsingly good in there!

[r-carpenter]

Re: Official Iron Speaker Thread

How about a little more helpful information. What is the ideal BSC for the room? It makes no sense to spend a lot of money entering this competition, only to find out full BSC is way too much for the room, or gambling on 2 dB BSC being enough. Based on your recent post in another thread, I assume full BSC is probably too much. You stated that speakers are usually 3 feet from the back wall, and six from the sides. From that I assume the room is about 20 to 24 feet wide, and about 50 feet long.

Don't really have anything to add aside from what Mike said.
I normally design with 4db of baffle step for smaller stand mounted systems.
Previously we had a multitude of speakers judged and I can't say that 1 or 2db of BSC made a huge difference in the scores. Just design the speaker that you yourself would be happy with and see how it fairs against other designs.
If you have a very particular requirement on the speaker positioning in relation to the boundaries, other people will ask for the same flexibility and we'll be moving speakers all day long. So, I'd rather not go there. Design for the above mentioned position. 3ft away from the back wall and 6 to 8 ft away from side walls.