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Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

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  • Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

    So I want to put together a tiny TM using the 3" TB subwoofer (W3-1876S).

    I've been using UniBox and I like how it looks in 1L box tuned to 58hz. The port could be (barely) considered a slot port 0.5" x 1.25" x 11". If I was going to use any real amount of power it would certainly be too small but with just a 12w t-amp it should be fine.

    According to the published specs (with a grain of salt, I know) the little sub should be good to crossover around 1.5khz. I'm wondering if I should go with a conventional tweeter like the Vifa XT25 or if I might be better off with something like the Aura Sound 1" full range driver as I would have to pad down any "real" tweeter significantly more.

    I do have DATS and OmniMic though I have not yet used them.

    Basically, I really like the idea of getting as much response out of a super tiny cabinet. Of course, if I need so many crossover parts that I need to double the cabinet, well...

    Thoughts, opinions?

    Thanks!

    - Dan
    People hear with their eyes.

  • #2
    Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

    Originally posted by DanHine View Post
    So I want to put together a tiny TM using the 3" TB subwoofer (W3-1876S).

    I've been using UniBox and I like how it looks in 1L box tuned to 58hz. The port could be (barely) considered a slot port 0.5" x 1.25" x 11". If I was going to use any real amount of power it would certainly be too small but with just a 12w t-amp it should be fine.

    According to the published specs (with a grain of salt, I know) the little sub should be good to crossover around 1.5khz. I'm wondering if I should go with a conventional tweeter like the Vifa XT25 or if I might be better off with something like the Aura Sound 1" full range driver as I would have to pad down any "real" tweeter significantly more.

    I do have DATS and OmniMic though I have not yet used them.

    Basically, I really like the idea of getting as much response out of a super tiny cabinet. Of course, if I need so many crossover parts that I need to double the cabinet, well...

    Thoughts, opinions?

    Thanks!

    - Dan
    The little HiVi B1S will work too.

    But I wouldn't use the XT25 crossed at 1.5KHz. There are other tweeters that can handle that much better without breaking the bank.
    R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
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    • #3
      Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

      A 1.5 way with the Aura NS3 might be something to try? It also has 5mm xmax, and extension to 15khz for $12.50.
      http://jaysspeakerpage.weebly.com/

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      • #4
        Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

        The little HiVi B1S will work too.

        But I wouldn't use the XT25 crossed at 1.5KHz. There are other tweeters that can handle that much better without breaking the bank.
        Pete,

        Have you used the B1S? I'm not against the idea - getting everything from PE would be nice. That driver has gotten some bad reviews.

        Any recommendations as to a different tweeter? The Vifa is only $20.
        People hear with their eyes.

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        • #5
          Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

          Originally posted by Jay1 View Post
          A 1.5 way with the Aura NS3 might be something to try? It also has 5mm xmax, and extension to 15khz for $12.50.
          Yeah, I looked at the NS3. And the ND90. And the ND91. I just can't seem to get the low end extension (into the 40's) in anywhere near as small a box.
          People hear with their eyes.

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          • #6
            Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

            the xt25 does not like to be crossed to low. even though the fs is low, it sounds much better crossed above 2000, and really good above 2500. you might want to try the rs28, either version will work.
            craigk

            " Voicing is often the term used for band aids to cover for initial design/planning errors " - Pallas

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            • #7
              Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

              Originally posted by craigk View Post
              the xt25 does not like to be crossed to low. even though the fs is low, it sounds much better crossed above 2000, and really good above 2500. you might want to try the rs28, either version will work.
              RS28 - $35? Not a rip off, I'm sure, but a bit more than I wanted to spend. Maybei'm expecting too much?
              People hear with their eyes.

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              • #8
                Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                The first thing I do if I'm looking at drivers for a design is research any data on non-linear distortion. Crossovers can fix linear distortion, but a driver used out of it's "clean" range sounds bad no matter what you do, and my ears don't care for the result. I'm investigating a desktop speaker build similar to yours, but using the Fountek FR88EX, based on Zaph's data form 2008, and the similarity to data from 2012. I'll give up some bass for a clean sound any day.
                http://www.diymobileaudio.com/forum/...ek-fr88ex.html

                If you're wedded to the TB-W3, take Pete's advice seriously. I've done designs that crossed at 1KHz, and the NSW1 is one tweeter that can make that trip (have no reason to doubt the B1S, but have no personal experience). The RS28, not so much (perhaps with waveguide?), and I'd like to know where to get them at $35 ea.

                Have fun,
                Frank

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                • #9
                  Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                  RS28AS $35

                  http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=275-135
                  People hear with their eyes.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                    I'll check out the Fountek. There is not much user data on the W3-1876 so if the Fountek will work with published data the I may go that route. Or, I could be the one to measure the TB for everyone else.
                    People hear with their eyes.

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                    • #11
                      Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                      I was going to post a link to my Xenums, but Photobucket isn't loading right currently.
                      No pics, but the link opened. 1.2 ltrs.

                      http://s18.photobucket.com/albums/b1...ums_Duoxenums/

                      Later,
                      Wolf
                      "Wolf, you shall now be known as "King of the Zip ties." -Pete00t
                      "Wolf and speakers equivalent to Picasso and 'Blue'" -dantheman
                      "He is a true ambassador for this forum and speaker DIY in general." -Ed Froste
                      "We're all in this together, so keep your stick on the ice!" - Red Green aka Steve Smith

                      *InDIYana event website*

                      Photobucket pages:
                      https://app.photobucket.com/u/wolf_teeth_speaker

                      My blog/writeups/thoughts here at PE:
                      http://techtalk.parts-express.com/blog.php?u=4102

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                      • #12
                        Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                        Originally posted by DanHine View Post

                        It doesn't get any better than this for the money, folks. This tweeters shames a lot of $100 tweeters as it is.
                        Click here for Jeff Bagby's Loudspeaker Design Software

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                        • #13
                          Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                          Wolf,

                          I see you did use the Vifa XT25. Would you say it's a good choice for this situation or would you consider the Aura I first mentioned?

                          One more side note, I've made 5 (?) designs by other people. They are always great and I enjoy them. But I paid for the DATS and Omnimic so darn it, I'm going to use them! I also feel like I'm not learning as much by just following a schematic. I learn better with a hands on approach even if that means spending a little more $$.

                          Jeff,

                          I bet that RS tweeter is good. Would it not be overkill for my design goals? In case I wasn't clear about them they are:

                          1) As small as I can manage
                          2) Good sound
                          3) As small as I can manage

                          They will be computer speakers. They don't need to be "audiophile" -esque.
                          People hear with their eyes.

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                          • #14
                            Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                            That Tang Band "Subwoofer" driver really needs to be paired with an extended-range driver as its 'tweeter'. Really, you ought to go with a 2" driver in this application.

                            Peerless 830983 #264-1042
                            Tang Band W2-800SL #264-807
                            Tang Band W2-803SM #264-805

                            Remember to give these drivers their own chamber since they have open backs. They should be better for the lower crossover point you'll need to use with that 3" sub.
                            Best Regards,

                            Rory Buszka

                            Taterworks Audio

                            "The work of the individual still remains the spark which moves mankind ahead, even more than teamwork." - Igor I. Sikorsky

                            If it works, but you don't know why it works, then you haven't done any engineering.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Designing a TINY TM for computer speakers. Help with HF driver selection

                              So Pete says I could try the HiVi B1S, Frank says the NSW1 would work and Rory says I ought to use a 2" driver. You guys don't make it easy.

                              Rory,

                              Would you mind giving me your two cents on why I ought to use a 2" extended driver and not a 1" like Pete suggests (or the driver I originally considered)?

                              Oh, I found this PDF for the Aura:

                              http://www.quint-audio.com/qaudio/files/nsw1-205-8a.pdf
                              People hear with their eyes.

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