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2x250 IRS2092 amp build

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  • #16
    Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

    Originally posted by donradick View Post
    Very nice! IIRC, Neil Davis said the 2092 designs were cleaner than most of the other
    Class D chipamps. Plenty of power for demanding sources like AC/DC and Wagner.
    Thanks Don.
    Will get used 90% for movies. Big sound tracks demand lots of power. I think this will do the trick.
    " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

    Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
    Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

    http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
    http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

      Here is a lovely example with 45000 per rail.
      Attached Files
      " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

      Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
      Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

      http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
      http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

        I think I am with Wolf on the capacitor hookup. Looks to me like each rail has the 8 caps connected with 4 pairs in series-parallel. That makes the capacitance of each pair half the value of each individual one. The diagrams posted don't show series-parallel pairs.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

          Originally posted by JimHRB View Post
          I think I am with Wolf on the capacitor hookup. Looks to me like each rail has the 8 caps connected with 4 pairs in series-parallel. That makes the capacitance of each pair half the value of each individual one. The diagrams posted don't show series-parallel pairs.
          Mine is the same as the diagram.
          " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

          Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
          Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

          http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
          http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

            Originally posted by [email protected] View Post
            Here is another example. These are polarized caps. I used two of them with the + of one and - of the other joined to form the 'ground' for the amp.
            The schematics you posted are fine. But I am like Wolf and Scott. I don't see how your cap filter board is similar to the schematics. Unlike the schematics, it seems you end up with two caps in series between a DC rail and ground bus; this makes each series pair an effective 2350 uF. Four sets of series pair in parallel gives 9400uF per rail.
            If instead you were to put your two sets of 8 end to end, and solder a ground bus in line splitting each pair of caps you'd have something that would give you your 37600uF per DC rail.
            Obviously what you have works and if it sounds fine as it is, live and let live.
            Cheers!

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

              Originally posted by [email protected] View Post
              Here is another example. These are polarized caps. I used two of them with the + of one and - of the other joined to form the 'ground' for the amp.
              I have attached a drawing of what I think you have based on your pictures and description. If that is correct, you have two 4700 uF capacitors connected in series on each parallel leg, which will give you 2350 uF, but double your voltage rating. 4 of those legs connected in parallel gives you 9400 uF. 9400 uF may be enough filter capacitance for that amp, in which case you have a lot of voltage safety margin, which isn't necessarily a bad thing.

              Notice the difference between this schematic and Hong's. In his case, the ground wire is routed between the two capacitors in a 4x2 array. That gives him 4 times the capacitance of each capacitor value between the positive voltage and ground, and the same between ground and the negative voltage.
              Attached Files
              Keep an open mind, but don't let your brain fall out.

              Sehlin Sound Solutions

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                My apologies. This pic does not show the ground wire to case, but it is present just like Hongs and the other schematic.
                " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

                Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
                Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

                http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
                http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                  Originally posted by [email protected] View Post
                  My apologies. This pic does not show the ground wire to case, but it is present just like Hongs and the other schematic.


                  There is no way that this connection is giving you a set of 8 caps in parallel on each rail. Unless you're connecting all those short segments together with a bus wire, you've got caps in series with one another.

                  Here's how each section should be wired (assuming each bank is for one power rail).

                  Attached Files
                  R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                  Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                  95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                  "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                    The pic I posted does not have the ground as it was added later. My apologies. In this pic you can see the wires coming out from under to a star ground behind the yellow shrink wrap. It is like Hongs schematic.
                    There are two identical rails fed by two Bridge Rectifiers. The minus from one goes to b- the positive from the other goes to b+. the other minus and plus are combined and go to the ground tap on the amp.

                    Sorry I caused so much confusion.
                    " To me, the soundstage presentation is more about phase and distortion and less about size. However, when you talk about bass extension, there's no replacement for displacement". Tyger23. 4.2015

                    Quote Originally Posted by hongrn. Oct 2014
                    Do you realize that being an American is like winning the biggest jackpot ever??

                    http://www.midwestaudioclub.com/spot...owell-simpson/
                    http://s413.photobucket.com/albums/pp216/arlis/

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                      You're looking at 2 separate PSUs, rectified by 2 separate bridge rectifiers that Lowell put on the same board. Each PSU has +/- rails, and its own ground. Both grounds are connected together, then to the chassis. The + rail of one PSU is connected to the - rail of the second PSU to form the center tap, so the end result is + rail, center tap, - rail. With the ground probe of the DMM on the center tap, Lowell should be able to measure -63V/+63V.

                      Hong
                      Some people are addicted to Vicodin. I'm addicted to speaker building.

                      The Chorales - Usher 8945A/Vifa XT25TG Build
                      ESP Project 101 Lateral MOSFET Amplifier
                      LM4780 Parallel Chipamp
                      Sonata Soundbar Project
                      The Renditions - Active/Passive Towers

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                      • #26
                        Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                        Originally posted by hongrn View Post
                        You're looking at 2 separate PSUs, rectified by 2 separate bridge rectifiers that Lowell put on the same board. Each PSU has +/- rails, and its own ground. Both grounds are connected together, then to the chassis. The + rail of one PSU is connected to the - rail of the second PSU to form the center tap, so the end result is + rail, center tap, - rail. With the ground probe of the DMM on the center tap, Lowell should be able to measure -63V/+63V.

                        Hong
                        If each of those capacitor banks is for one power rail, one for (+) and one for (-), and if each of those bus wires represents the full voltage of the rail, connecting two of them together to establish GND, then the short wires between the caps are floating, and the caps are in series.

                        And if what you said about each PSU having it's own + and - rail, and it's own ground, where is the ground in each PSU connected to the caps? And if you did connect each ground together, you can't then connect the positive of one to the negative of the other. The grounds would have the be floating or you would have large current flow from the Pos to Neg since they share a ground.

                        Do you have the schematic of the dual PSU including the transformer?
                        R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                        Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                        95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                        "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                          Thanks for chiming in Pete. Please see the enclosed schematic. This is how I wired my IRS2092 amp, and I get no humming, buzzing, and can play as loud as I can into a 4 ohm load. Since the Sure board requires a separate PSU for each channel, I used a toroid with dual secondaries, feeding each into a bridge rectifier. Are you saying that this wiring scheme is incorrect, and I won't get the rail capacitance I expect to get? Would you correct this by just having one bank of reservoir capacitors per PSU, then the center tap would go the board, to the chassis ground as well? Thanks.

                          Hong
                          Attached Files
                          Some people are addicted to Vicodin. I'm addicted to speaker building.

                          The Chorales - Usher 8945A/Vifa XT25TG Build
                          ESP Project 101 Lateral MOSFET Amplifier
                          LM4780 Parallel Chipamp
                          Sonata Soundbar Project
                          The Renditions - Active/Passive Towers

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                            Originally posted by hongrn View Post
                            Thanks for chiming in Pete. Please see the enclosed schematic. This is how I wired my IRS2092 amp, and I get no humming, buzzing, and can play as loud as I can into a 4 ohm load. Since the Sure board requires a separate PSU for each channel, I used a toroid with dual secondaries, feeding each into a bridge rectifier. Are you saying that this wiring scheme is incorrect, and I won't get the rail capacitance I expect to get? Would you correct this by just having one bank of reservoir capacitors per PSU, then the center tap would go the board, to the chassis ground as well? Thanks.

                            Hong
                            That schematic has me scratching my head. When you ground the two PSUs, you've basically connected them together and they're referenced from the same common. That means the negative rail of one will cause a current flow into the positive rail of the other.

                            With dual secondaries of 45V each, you wire the secondaries in series and choose the center tap as ground. Then you run the dual power supplies off that with a rectifier bridge for each channel. Each end will be your + and - 65.

                            Click image for larger version

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                            R = h/(2*pi*m*c) and don't you forget it! || Periodic Table as redrawn by Marshall Freerks and Ignatius Schumacher || King Crimson Radio
                            Byzantium Project & Build Thread || MiniByzy Build Thread || 3 x Peerless 850439 HDS 3-way || 8" 2-way - RS28A/B&C8BG51

                            95% of Climate Models Agree: The Observations Must be Wrong
                            "Gravitational systems are the ashes of prior electrical systems.". - Hannes Alfven, Nobel Laureate, Plasma physicist.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                              Guys, I'm really enjoying this discussion!

                              For my first build, I bought a power supply board, but sooner or later I'm
                              sure that I'll try building a PS from scratch. Good tips and analysis here.

                              I think I hear a difference - wow, it's amazing!" Ethan Winer: audio myths
                              "As God is my witness I'll never be without a good pair of speakers!" Scarlett O'Hara

                              High value, high quality RS150/TB28-537SH bookshelf - TARGAS NLA!
                              SB13/Vifa BC25SC06 MTM DCR Galeons-SB13-MTM
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                              Tangband W6-sub

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                              • #30
                                Re: 2x250 IRS2092 amp build

                                With dual secondaries of 45V each, you wire the secondaries in series and choose the center tap as ground. Then you run the dual power supplies off that with a rectifier bridge for each channel. Each end will be your + and - 65.

                                [ATTACH=CONFIG]46972[/ATTACH]
                                Pete,

                                With independent secondaries, wouldn't you want to do this instead of tying them in series (please see enclosed drawing)? I think you would preserve the current of each secondary pair for each channel. Thanks.
                                Attached Files
                                Some people are addicted to Vicodin. I'm addicted to speaker building.

                                The Chorales - Usher 8945A/Vifa XT25TG Build
                                ESP Project 101 Lateral MOSFET Amplifier
                                LM4780 Parallel Chipamp
                                Sonata Soundbar Project
                                The Renditions - Active/Passive Towers

                                Comment

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