Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

I'll have to check that out. How does it model?

My apologize...........I meant to nominate the DC380......not the S. When you mentioned 4ohms, I knew I made a mistake somewhere.

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Your opinion may represent majority and then I say we go with majority. Personally when listening even to jazz for example I know I'm missing stuff if I don't have output below 40. Just my $.02 but I'm happy to take the collective opinion of interested parties and see what has the broadest appeal.

I thought you wanted an old fashioned big monitor and so putting some work in to define the objectives as you are doing looks like time well spent.

From my perspective I don't see see any real benefit of an F3 in the 20s but I can see a real loss of efficiency and SPL in order to get it. But that is just one view and others will no doubt have different ones.

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Well score one for Faital. I think that might be an easy choice for this project after looking at what is out there.

The Dayton "sounds" less ragged than the Alpha 6. For smoothness (among Eminence mids) I prefer the Beta 8, but that's a little big for this. I did a shootout between the three when re-building my truck sound system. I originally has Alpha 6's, and I compared them to the Daytons and the Faitals because I had both. Either one was a step function improvement, and the Faital was a bit better. But the sensitivity was a tad lower on the Fatial, along with the chamber size requirements. The real decision maker was that the Fatial performed so much better on a horn than any other 6" I've tried, so I saved them for that development effort - the Daytons got installed in the truck box.

The Faital will still be plenty sensitive enough to use with a 15 for a project like this - regardless of whether it goes the 89dB or the 95dB route.

[civit]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

I'm interested in this project for sure. I've been dabbling with what I would call a "Classix+" speaker - same idea as the classix, but with a big bass driver in the mix.

Making it work on the cheap is not easy, and one big issue is the LF crossover. I find myself needing very large capacitors to do the job. Just thought I would mention that with a project like this a lot of cost might go to correcting the response of wily drivers.

[civit]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

I'm interested in this project for sure. I've been dabbling with what I would call a "Classix+" speaker - same idea as the classix, but with a big bass driver in the mix.

Making it work on the cheap is not easy, and one big issue is the LF crossover. I find myself needing very large capacitors to do the job. Just thought I would mention that with a project like this a lot of cost might go to correcting the response of wily drivers.

[wg_ski]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Well, you definitely don't want to start with "wily drivers". I figured that's why things were graviating toward 'pro' paper cone mids that were sort-of intended to run full range... not much correction required. And any 15 chosen would certainly be smooth to 3-400. Can't really use a monster-motor sub driver and keep any kind of sensitivity... or budget.

It probably will require a big capacitor (and inductor) in the LF. This is the situation where you will want iron core and er... electrolytic. If you choose the right capacitor, the result will not be bad. And model the ESR - don't just assume it's an ideal cap in simulation because it isn't. You'll have to think outside the speaker 'box' when sourcing them. I use the 105C-rated high ripple current, snap-mount units typical of the mains filters for switch mode power supplies. A lot more rugged and reliable than typical 'audio' grade NP's - they're actually designed to have several amps of current run through them continuously.

[Oxbox]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

So like you say, we have at least two good designs for a three way already, why not go with a large format 4 or even 5 way? they seem to be somewhat scarce, why not go for something that hasn't been done??

Ox

[bolland83]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

This looks like a fun project! About all I can contribute is some sketchup work for the cabinets once you get the details worked out.

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

No doubt about component costs. Builders would make their own choices but I would choose NPE capacitors and iron core inductors for the woofer at least.

I'm interested in this project for sure. I've been dabbling with what I would call a "Classix+" speaker - same idea as the classix, but with a big bass driver in the mix.

Making it work on the cheap is not easy, and one big issue is the LF crossover. I find myself needing very large capacitors to do the job. Just thought I would mention that with a project like this a lot of cost might go to correcting the response of wily drivers.

[donc]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

For years my Cerwin Vega clone would use the Dayton ST385 ,Vifa /Peerless P17WJ00, and the Seas 27TDFC , for a less expensive higher sensitivty version , Dayton DC380 ,TB W6 789E and the Viva DX25TG09-04 , or use a Dayton 12" ST305 ,buy some Sansui lattice grilles off obey .......I really need to quit this !
,donc

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Those will be amazing. A totally different thing than what I was thinking of here. But wow!!

There was a thread started on the AVS forum about a month or so ago for a similar project. The first model was going to be a very big speaker, then work down to smaller models.

Here's the thread: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...s-maximus.html

It seems most people were hoping for high sensitivity, max ouput, and at least low 30hz range output. So pro woofers were chosen to hit those marks.

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Sketchup work is extremely helpful. Especially useful to have a drawing to measure off of to double check dimensions of the build in my experience.

This looks like a fun project! About all I can contribute is some sketchup work for the cabinets once you get the details worked out.

[Whitneyville1]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

My 3 cents worth. Aim for enough sensitivity that about 100 watts, it's about 108 dB or so, but hold the mid 30's bass response if possible. A 15" woofer moves so much more air, it seems like it's almost mandatory.

[Mayhem13]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

My 3 cents worth. Aim for enough sensitivity that about 100 watts, it's about 108 dB or so, but hold the mid 30's bass response if possible. A 15" woofer moves so much more air, it seems like it's almost mandatory.

Agreed!

[lorenmjones]

Re: Is there interest in a large three way "monkey coffin" collaboration?

Well it seems there is a fairly strong consensus to move toward a little better efficiency in a trade for giving up a half octave or so of bass extension.

I like the idea of a 15" woofer in that role. I also like the idea of something sealed with an F3 below 40hz if we go with a 15" woofer.

DC380-8 does F3/f6/F10 of 42/31/24 in about 100 liters walls lined which would be pretty OK. The Response through the midbass and up to 400 hz looks ok to me but I may not know what to look for. It suffers from lack of excursion and only handles 40 watts before exceeding xmax at 35 hz which amounts to 106db above 100hz and also means max output of 99db at 30 hz.

DCS380-4 does F3/F6F10 of 33/26/20 in 100 liters stuffed fully which is some real amount more extension but may not be that big of a difference. The response into the midbass may be more of an issue...I'm not sure. It has more exxursion and will do 109db on 150 watts above 100 hz. At 30 hz it hits 104.8db before hitting excursion limits.

So if we get a consensus to go with a 15, which of these would folks prefer?

My 3 cents worth. Aim for enough sensitivity that about 100 watts, it's about 108 dB or so, but hold the mid 30's bass response if possible. A 15" woofer moves so much more air, it seems like it's almost mandatory.