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DIY Flat Panel Speaker Love

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  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Originally posted by JoeC View Post
    hey all,
    Newbie and new user on this great forum. Although I have read a bunch of threads on this particular form, I can not find how you are setting up to use the exciters on an 8ohm receiver, because all the recommended exciters are listed at 4 ohm. So.... do I need to get 4 exciters and run two in series of the right and left channel or is there something else I can do to experiment with these with only having to spend the $$$ for just two exciters?
    I do apologize if this question has been asked before, but I can not find the thread that relates to this
    Thanks!

    Edit: I have a 110w 1986 Fisher receiver that I will be using on this experiment
    You can just buy the 8ohm exciters. IMO the best 8ohm exciter is the Tectonic (19mm) TEAX19CO1-8. It wont handle the power of the larger (over 19mm) exciters but this exciter will have better high frequency response then the larger exciters.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    commented on 's reply
    My DML sub is just a DML panel but utilizing a sub amp so it will only produce the low frequencies from 150hz and below. Exciter used are the larger 25mm and up exciters and they can handle more power and have more excursion.

    The reason for a sub amp is because the exciters voice coil is attached to a heavy thick plastic that is suppose to hold up the exciters weight/magnet so the exciter is not efficient in the low frequencies. To compensate you will need a sub amp to push the exciters into pistonic motion to produce the low frequencies.

  • JoeC
    replied
    Originally posted by Unbiasedsound View Post
    If you want to utilize some of that energy from the back of the DML panel you can also make a front firing slot port as this will increase sound output from the front.
    Would that help the bass response like a bass reflex speaker?

    Leave a comment:


  • JoeC
    replied
    hey all,
    Newbie and new user on this great forum. Although I have read a bunch of threads on this particular form, I can not find how you are setting up to use the exciters on an 8ohm receiver, because all the recommended exciters are listed at 4 ohm. So.... do I need to get 4 exciters and run two in series of the right and left channel or is there something else I can do to experiment with these with only having to spend the $$$ for just two exciters?
    I do apologize if this question has been asked before, but I can not find the thread that relates to this
    Thanks!

    Edit: I have a 110w 1986 Fisher receiver that I will be using on this experiment

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    If you want to utilize some of that energy from the back of the DML panel you can also make a front firing slot port as this will increase sound output from the front.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Originally posted by NW Sailor View Post
    First post to this forum, apologies if I get things wrong.

    i have a need to place audio monitors in a setting that is extremely space constrained, and think the flat panel approach could be really helpful, ie a monitor that is <3 inches thick. However, it seems there is no easy way of making the flat panel ‘one sided’ so that the volume on one side is loud, the other side quiet. I think I know the answer, that there isn’t an easy way to do this but thought I would throw the question out to this group - is it possible to build some sort of thin enclosure / baffle on the “back” of the panel to stop sound going in that direction?

    thanks for any insights.
    Yes its possible to build a sealed enclosure on the back just like a conventional cone boxed speaker. I would make a 1inchX2inch frame and just cover the back with a thin (1/4-1/8) piece of wood.

    Leave a comment:


  • NW Sailor
    replied
    First post to this forum, apologies if I get things wrong.

    i have a need to place audio monitors in a setting that is extremely space constrained, and think the flat panel approach could be really helpful, ie a monitor that is <3 inches thick. However, it seems there is no easy way of making the flat panel ‘one sided’ so that the volume on one side is loud, the other side quiet. I think I know the answer, that there isn’t an easy way to do this but thought I would throw the question out to this group - is it possible to build some sort of thin enclosure / baffle on the “back” of the panel to stop sound going in that direction?

    thanks for any insights.

    Leave a comment:


  • mhester
    commented on 's reply
    I saw the Tech Ingredients vid a year or so ago and have wanted to experiment with this at some point (need to finish my Classix 2.5's first...) This is a very long thread and I'm not sure if you've previously posted your sub design. Can you kindly share that (again?)

  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    During this covid time (3 months 7 days a week 2-4 hrs a day lol) I've been experimenting with many different placements of the exciters including the use of 2 exciters per panel. What I have found is that the 2/5-3/5 rule of exciter placement is bogus. Not sure who first thought of those placements as the standard (NXT?) but it seems P.E. guide and T.I. youtube vid like to use those placements.

    Most just blindly follow those standard placements instead of experimenting for themselves as most cant think outside the box. lol

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Another thing that is great about DML's is that you can custom tune your panels to your preference. You can make them sound bright, dark, forward sounding laid back sounding its all based on how one tunes there panel as the combinations are endless. One can even change the soundstage and imaging of a panel. These tuning changes can be done in as little as 30 seconds per speaker with very little cost and no tools required.

    With conventional cone drivers the usual way to change the sound is to change the crossover and even then its very limited and time consuming, not to mention all the costly tools and parts needed to do so.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    It seems some people (on the other forum) dont understand about DML's and bass. Besides having very limited pistonic motion exciters are also not efficient in the bass region. When running full range a exciters mid to high frequencies efficiency will be way higher then the bass which will over power and drown out the bass frequencies. The way to fix it is to use the exciter as sub to only produce the low frequencies 100hz and below. A sub amp is needed as it will push the exciter to produce pistonic motion but wont have the higher frequencies to drown out the lower frequencies.


    My DML sat/sub combo is my top preferred design as it has great high frequencies and well as the low frequencies down to 40hz.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Originally posted by viewcart View Post
    A controlled and predictable speaker cone is significantly more accurate than a random piece of wood/plastic/composite material vibrating. Isn’t the goal of speakers to accurately reproduce recordings?
    Instruments are vibrating material. Whats more accurate then a panel vibrating like a instrument.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    DML's are great for mid to high frequencies as they are basically full range speakers being able to play from 60hz-20khz. Of course its all design dependent as the better the design the better they will sound. The low frequencies are not as good due to the limited pistonic excursion. Conventional cone drivers move more air to produce bass while DML's vibrate the panel (less air movement) which is why a larger sized panel is needed to produce lower frequencies because it needs to bend the panels hence the term bending wave transducers. EPS needs to be thin (5-10mm) 1/2-1/4 inch to flex enough to produce adequate bass. T.I. video uses 1inch XPS which is to thick. Also EPS is more flexible then XPS.

    There are two types of damping. One is panel treatment damping usually done with a 50/50 water/glue mixture or even paint water based or oil based. The other type of damping is done with some type of foam damping material in which this is used to "TUNE" a panel to smooth out its frequency response. It can be applied directly on to the panel and or on to the panel frame. Shelly Katz Podium speakers gave me the idea to use this technique and it works. http://www.stereomojo.com/Podium%20....akerReview.htm

    One of the best "ACCURATE", sounding DML's speakers are from a Russian company called Sheet Control.> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JheZ84QcZPw

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vBXQyR1EwSs

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PLweDrL4EDc


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MsEg7RjunhQ&t=96s This video compares DML to Dynaudio.

    Leave a comment:


  • viewcart
    replied
    While I love his YouTube channel, those speakers are going to be a complete mess for HF reproduction, and forget LF all together. For midrange they WILL work, but to get a smooth output the thing needs to be so damped you may as well forget any efficiency advantage from a radiator of that size. He states that these produce sound the same way a piano soundboard does, which IS true, but he goes on to say traditional cone speakers produce sound “artificially” while wooden resonances are “natural.” Sorry, sound is vibrating air and that’s it. It really doesn’t matter what makes it vibrate. A controlled and predictable speaker cone is significantly more accurate than a random piece of wood/plastic/composite material vibrating. Isn’t the goal of speakers to accurately reproduce recordings?

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Originally posted by Unbiasedsound View Post
    What is the best shape for DML panels? Best most accurate shape is a square as it produces the most even sound because its shape is even. Next best shape is a rectangle but there is a limit to how long you can make it. A rectangles length should only be at most 8 inches greater then its width, preferably 5-6inches is ideal. The longer the rectangle the more exaggerated the sound becomes and it also becomes more uneven and weird sounding. This is the reason odd shape conventional cone speakers like 6X9's are not readily used in home speakers as the odd uneven shape makes the sound uneven and off sounding. Its no different for DML panels.
    Once the corners are rounded though they are more of a hexagon shape.

    Leave a comment:

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