DIY Flat Panel Speaker Love

[rmeinke]

Not a problem, as long as one uses the volume knob within reason. I've never had them heat up, even at room-saturating levels. I'm using one exciter per panel.

Alrighty then... 1 exciter/panel... got it!! :-)

[rmeinke]

I've been out of the loop for a while due to health issues and hospital stays, I hope to get back to playing with DML's soon.


I still think multiple exciters need to be on separate panels to increase power handling and maximum high frequency response.

Sorry to hear about your health issues Jack... sure hope your back up and about and playing with these panels again in the very near future!! :-)

I agree on your multiple panels comment and maintaining the 1 exciter to 1 panel. Especially with EQ assistance. Smaller panels are cleaner, faster and more dynamic...

We've been gone/traveling the last few months but happy to be home for Mother's Day... haven't even had the panels setup... MAJOR bummer. I am also hoping to get back to the DML panels soon myself!

Take care Capin'!!

[Gary.M]

Post 596

http://techtalk.parts-express.com/forum/tech-talk-forum/64791-diy-flat-panel-speaker-love?p=1107127#post1107127

Minimal mounting for the measurements, just lightly held with fingertips. But, firmly holding the sides with palms in contact made no difference to the response.

Hey Gary! Good to be back and see everyone posting!

The Ultra with its larger vc doesn't produce the most extended response... and it doesn't sound good on ply/heavier materials either. Its softer, more compliant suspension just can not exert enough force on heavier panels. I plucked them off my birch ply panels after less than an hour. Better suited to XPS/EPS panels.

I'm playing catch up here after being away for weeks, so apologies if its been stated, but what panel size, suspension/mounting? Sedge over at AC has reported good results with rigid mounting for ply. Should boost SPL and the low freq. response. A quick pine frame should provide some quick results.

Hope everyone is doing well!

[Gary.M]

"Its softer, more compliant suspension just can not exert enough force on heavier panels."


I'm not sure that the suspension has much to do with the force exerted, that more to do with the properties of the magnetic circuit. I think we have a spring system in a way, with the mass of the exciter working against the mass of the panel. When its driven the suspension is just there to hold it together, although I'm sure it will contribute to resonances at some frequencies. It would be interesting to see it analysed as an equivalent circuit.

[Unbiasedsound]

In summary, I've been aiming for a panel that can go from about 200-300Hz on up, with an open baffle woofer filling in below. I may have what I want. Certainly a listen to this single bamboo panel was very impressive.

Gary ,where did you get your bamboo panel from?

[Gary.M]

Gary ,where did you get your bamboo panel from?

Google Ponoko.com I sent them a file, they cut it for me. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

[Unbiasedsound]

Google Ponoko.com I sent them a file, they cut it for me. Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk

Ah ok thanks man.

[Shadetreehifi]

Hello Sahdetreehifi!

+1 on the Laun ply. I do like the sound of my old Baltic Birch panels but they are over damped in my opinion. However Luan, being lighter and more resilient offers a more lively sound and natural sound... not unfamiliar to how XPS is more damped compared to the lighter and more resilient EPS.

Just curious, how are you suspending your panels? 2x6 is a large panel! :-)

I've got the panels hanging vertically from the ceiling with fishing line. The untreated luan does some ringing of its own, with a lot of treble. Two coats of hardening takes care of it. Kind of blew my shoestring budget on three cans of hardening at ten bucks each, but the sound is nice.

Bamboo sounds interesting.

[rmeinke]

"Its softer, more compliant suspension just can not exert enough force on heavier panels."


I'm not sure that the suspension has much to do with the force exerted, that more to do with the properties of the magnetic circuit. I think we have a spring system in a way, with the mass of the exciter working against the mass of the panel. When its driven the suspension is just there to hold it together, although I'm sure it will contribute to resonances at some frequencies. It would be interesting to see it analysed as an equivalent circuit.

Yes, it is a function of 3 things, the weight of the exciter, the motor system, and the compliance of the suspension. If a suspension was ultimately compliant, little energy would be transfered to the panel right? Listening to the exciter on XPS, EPS and then ply makes it more clear how a more compliant suspension can operate.

On ply the Ultra is more polite and lacking in detail and have always attribute it to the softer, more compliant suspension. There isn't a full spec sheet on the Ultra, but would be interesting to review the specifications and draw more solid technical conclusions.

[captainjack115]

Certainly hope you are on road to recovery.

Feeling better,Thanks!

Jack

[captainjack115]

[QUOTE=rmeinke;n1280761]


Sorry to hear about your health issues Jack... sure hope your back up and about and playing with these panels again in the very near future!! :-)

I agree on your multiple panels comment and maintaining the 1 exciter to 1 panel. Especially with EQ assistance. Smaller panels are cleaner, faster and more dynamic...

We've been gone/traveling the last few months but happy to be home for Mother's Day... haven't even had the panels setup... MAJOR bummer. I am also hoping to get back to the DML panels soon myself!

Take care Capin'!![/QUO
Hey Rich, feeling better,thanks.

I've tried just about everything I could think of to increase power handling without sacrificing high frequencies. Using multiple panels with one exciter per panel seems to be the most successful way to accomplish the task.
Two way hybrid seems to be the best route to go as well, limiting bass to around 100 hz. Although I have yet to try it, I think your dipole bass system is probably the best match for DML's
Less self noise and plenty of sound output should be realized.
The last time a played with one high power exciter in full range I managed to blow the voice coil...................BUMMER!!!!!!!!!!!

Jack

[[email protected]]

So I have been working with these panels for a while now, attempting to come up with a truly marketable surround sound or full range with subwoofer DML design. After various attempts I have come up with these speakers that can use any poster or printed image. I am using a single Dayton Audio DAEX25FHE-4 in each speaker. I also included a 400hz high pass filter in each as there is little need for low bass in a surround sound application or use with a subwoofer. This also quells any rattles with picture frames hanging against a wall. I am very happy with the sound and the high end especially is better than what I have heard out of a lot of other speakers like these, especially the ones I purchased from Onsia.com which sounded like an AM radio.

[Gary.M]

I don't agree with the suspension argument. The suspension is necessary to support things, but when the coil is activated the force is in the magnetic circuit both pushing and pulling. The panel energy is created by the force excerted by the magnetic circuit acting against the mass of the exciter. The suspension will interfere as it will offer some resonance in the system but it does not excert any force..

Yes, it is a function of 3 things, the weight of the exciter, the motor system, and the compliance of the suspension. If a suspension was ultimately compliant, little energy would be transfered to the panel right? Listening to the exciter on XPS, EPS and then ply makes it more clear how a more compliant suspension can operate.

On ply the Ultra is more polite and lacking in detail and have always attribute it to the softer, more compliant suspension. There isn't a full spec sheet on the Ultra, but would be interesting to review the specifications and draw more solid technical conclusions.

[Unbiasedsound]

I recently purchased some new exciters DAEX25 which was on sale and the DAEX19 and the tectonics which was on clearance. Out of all the exciters the small tectonics surprised me the most with its high frequency extension most likely due to there smaller 13mm voice coil, like Rich and many others have mentioned....This is he high frequency sound I have been looking for....The only down fall is that the tectonics can only handle 2 watts and sound out put of course its not as high due to it being very small.....it would probably work well with a crossover...however it did handle my Yamaha 100 watt receiver even at -20db with my receiver crossover set at 80hz as I dont play/listen to my music louder then -20db.....I will be purchasing other Tectonic exciters in the near future to try it out since I was so pleased with these small ones and at clearance price its a steal......These tectonic exciters high frequency clarity sounds almost like my Bertagni speakers, too bad they didnt make a 13mm exciter that could handle at least 10 watts or more.

[Gary.M]

I'm wondering if it is the lighter weight exciters that give higher frequency response, rather than the voicecoil diameter. Less mass to accelerate at higher frequencies?

I Out of all the exciters the small tectonics surprised me the most with its high frequency extension most likely due to there smaller 13mm voice coil, like Rich and many others have mentioned....This is he high frequency sound I have been looking for....