DIY Flat Panel Speaker Love

[Unbiasedsound]

Testing the first customers art panels. They sent the images, printed to 16 x 20. Mounted the images to the frames using 3m VHB 5952 foam tape. Used the Dayton Audio DAEX25VT-4 exciter ( helps that their showroom is down the road from my house), with a 199uf high pass capacitor as the customer was going to use these in a surround sound system with subwoofers. You really can't tell from this iphone recording, but they do sound pretty good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qs9Bmri_mqQ

Is the sound coming from just that one single panel or is it a pair?

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Just the one.

[captainjack115]

So, it's stereo like the JMC sound panel?

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No, its just a standard single channel speaker. I was just testing one panel.

[mortron]

I just discovered this thread, but took part on the one over on AC... very informative and exciting stuff here. I have an octet of the PE $3 buyout transducers I haven't done anything with yet. I always had these hair brained ideas that never came to fruition. I think in the end I will use them to try to rig up a 5.1 setup for an old amp I have here. I will have to read through the thread to see what's been done.

I cant help but wonder... if making say 18X12" panels, would a thin foam core board with a single layer of carbon fiber or fiberglass be too heavy of a panel? I have seen folks use ply with the higher powered units, but never anyone attempt to skin in any type of glass.

[rmeinke]

Welcome to this thread:

Most of us are learning as we go along, rmienke started this thread and probably has the most experience here with DML panels.
Your cooler idea looks intriguing. Are you getting any buzzing or self noise?

Welcome to the flat panel thread waxburger! Good too to see Capin' back posting too... glad your back and hope life is settling down for you!

Life has been absolutely crazy with traveling, work and the boys track and soccer... hopefully by the end of June things will slow down enough to have a free weekend and can get back to speakers, audio and music in general.

Great to see everyone posting new experimentations and getting good results!!

[rmeinke]

What is it they make model airplanes from? Balsa? Should be cheap so if things don't work out no biggy. 1/16x12"x24" $8 http://www.nationalbalsa.com/balsa_s.../1161224sh.htm
Try it naked first then treat. I'm thinking it should readily absorb lacquer (what might work better?) and depending on how much you put into it might have some control of flexibility and hardness.

Just a thought.

Great catch KB! Balsa has been mentioned a bunch of time over at AC but I don't think anyone took the time to build some panels from it. Probably have to laminate 2 pieces with grain at 90 degres to stiffen the panel but it should be light and strong at that point. Hmmmm.... very interesting...

[Kornbread]

Great catch KB! Balsa has been mentioned a bunch of time over at AC but I don't think anyone took the time to build some panels from it. Probably have to laminate 2 pieces with grain at 90 degres to stiffen the panel but it should be light and strong at that point. Hmmmm.... very interesting...

Balsa might also take a liking to fiberglass resin. That would definitely stiffen it up but have some flexibility. One coated or two really thin sheets bonded @90 degrees with fiberglass resin then coated. I'm afraid cardboard might absorb so much resin it would become too heavy but if you had good control over application ... Cans of resin can be bought at the local car parts store for cheap, balsa sheets cost a little more but very reasonable, cardboard = free.

If nothing else, the panels would definitely be durable. If you didn't like the way they sounded, make a boat out of them. :D

[rmeinke]

My order arrived.....tested out the Tectonics TAEX19C01-8 19mm vs the Dayon DAEX19QLP-4 19mm.....The tectonics IMO has a little higher frequency response, a little better bass and cleaner sounding then the dayton.

When it comes too the high frequency extension the best exciter so far IMO is the smaller Tectonics HIAX13C02-16/RH 13mm exciter while the bigger TAEX19C01-8 would be second.....This convinces me further that the smaller voice coils have a higher frequency extension and that there is a difference in the sound when it comes to different brands.

For fuller range use though I would not suggest the Tectonics HIAX13C02-16 13mm as it lacks midrange and sounds more like a tweeter....anything 19mm and up will have more mid range and a fuller sound.

I also bought those panasonic clearance 2 way cross overs with the mid at 200hz and the tweeter at 5.5khz. Used the two techtonics exciters I mentioned above the 19mm for the mid and the 13mm for the tweeter and wow that combo sounds great with this crossover and for only 2 bucks each its a steal of a deal. Even at 200hz there is a good mid bass presence. ...now the dayton XO 2 way cross overs do sound better but at over 10 times the cost of the panasonic lol.

Good stuff man!! I was going to suggest just a single cap on the HIAX13C02-16 but see the Panasonic XO has no low pass components so both exciters are generating high frequencies as you would want. One would think that the balance might be a little tilted to the high frequency side but the Panasonic also pads the tweeter by 6 db (with a 16 ohm exciter pads only 3 db I believe). This is really kinda interesting... almost perfect for a 2 exciter DML panel. The 200Hz filter will also improve power handling and perfect if using a sub with the panel (text book cap value for a 4 ohm purely resistive load would place the mid range XO point at approx. 230Hz).

Cool report out USB!!

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Again, an iphone video is certainly not the best way to judge sound quality, but the 16x20 framed panels sound great in the basement media room.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEAkQSTtxAg

[Unbiasedsound]

Good stuff man!! I was going to suggest just a single cap on the HIAX13C02-16 but see the Panasonic XO has no low pass components so both exciters are generating high frequencies as you would want. One would think that the balance might be a little tilted to the high frequency side but the Panasonic also pads the tweeter by 6 db (with a 16 ohm exciter pads only 3 db I believe). This is really kinda interesting... almost perfect for a 2 exciter DML panel. The 200Hz filter will also improve power handling and perfect if using a sub with the panel (text book cap value for a 4 ohm purely resistive load would place the mid range XO point at approx. 230Hz).

Cool report out USB!!

Yup , it sounds really good using that panasonic XO even at 200hz there is still decent enough mid bass. Also I am using the TEAX13C02-8 which is the 8ohm version of the HIAX13CO2 in which I believe they are exactly the same except for there impedance....I also will be utilizing a FLAT PANEL SUB, making the frame as type , hopefully tomorrow it will be finished.

[Unbiasedsound]

Again, an iphone video is certainly not the best way to judge sound quality, but the 16x20 framed panels sound great in the basement media room.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEAkQSTtxAg

Very nice Jmanes, I have to ask if it is all three picture frames playing or just a pair or ? good amounts of bass........My friend dub these DML flat panel speakers the "POOR MANS MAGGIES". LOL....in which I take as a compliment. lol

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The left and right pictures are the speakers. The panels are sized 16x20 which does produce pretty good bass response.

[Unbiasedsound]

My order arrived.....tested out the Tectonics TAEX19C01-8 19mm vs the Dayon DAEX19QLP-4 19mm.....The tectonics IMO has a little higher frequency response, a little better bass and cleaner sounding then the dayton.

When it comes too the high frequency extension the best exciter so far IMO is the smaller Tectonics HIAX13C02-16/RH 13mm exciter while the bigger TAEX19C01-8 would be second.....This convinces me further that the smaller voice coils have a higher frequency extension and that there is a difference in the sound when it comes to different brands.

For fuller range use though I would not suggest the Tectonics HIAX13C02-16 13mm as it lacks midrange and sounds more like a tweeter....anything 19mm and up will have more mid range and a fuller sound.

I also bought those panasonic clearance 2 way cross overs with the mid at 200hz and the tweeter at 5.5khz. Used the two techtonics exciters I mentioned above the 19mm for the mid and the 13mm for the tweeter and wow that combo sounds great with this crossover and for only 2 bucks each its a steal of a deal. Even at 200hz there is a good mid bass presence. ...now the dayton XO 2 way cross overs do sound better but at over 10 times the cost of the panasonic lol.

I have a question if anyone can answer this, is the larger crimp disconnects usually used as the positive and the smaller crimp disconnects used as the negative? I was reading the reviews on the clearance panasonic xo and one person said the the black wire (which has the smaller crimp connects) is the positive and the yellow wire (which has the bigger crimp connects) is the negative, this is for the tweeter part.....yet the mid wire the positive is the bigger connect while the negative is the smaller connect....why is it like this? Either panasonic made a mistake when utilizing the crimps on the tweeter wire or is the answer from matt p wrong?

[WernerM]

I received the DAEX25 pair as a Christmas gift a few years ago and tested several materials including corrugated cardboard. After the vhb wore out from sticking and unsticking various materials, it got put on the back burner due to full time work and school. This thread has renewed my interest since I now have time. Today I found some 14"x20"x1.5" thick styrofoam panels that I did a quick and dirty treatment on. Initial testing sounds pretty darn promising I must say. I did try mixing food coloring in with the glue, but my black food coloring dried up and while trying to make black with red, blue and green, it came out forest green lol. Still I know that food coloring does work to color the panels. Later I will try taking measurements of untreated, treated no color, treated with color and treated no color then spray painted. That way there will be evidence of any changes to the panels with different treatments. Thank you for renewing my interest. My long time end goal has been to create a setup that's looks like the Martin Logan electrostatics. I am even thinking if trying 2 panels per side like a mini line array with sub re-enforcement for bottom end punch. One sub per channel. Thinking a mini sub lime the 5.25" Tang-band. Maybe even a project using passive radiators like Tom has done recently. Anyway, i have to get to work now that my break is over. Just wanted to touch base, say thanks and let you know I'm in! Will report my findings as I go.