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  • allenb
    replied
    Great information on your experience with bypass caps, thanks for posting. When I get everything setup I'll start listening with the NPEs and then give the bypass caps a go for comparison. You are so right about personal preference and ones design and application! I chuckle when I read speaker reviews. As many know, change one thing, whether it be moving the couch or adding or taking away a rug in the listening area, going from one turntable cartridge to another can make speaker X sound great for one person and in their neighbors setup, sound barely passable. A lot of people never get it that the speaker system is only one piece of the whole delivery system and treat it as if what they hear is a mirror image to what everyone else will experience.

    BTW, I got an email showing there was a post in this thread!

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  • Unbiasedsound
    commented on 's reply
    The Audyn copper cap is friggen good IMO but its friggen EXPENSIVE!!!!!!!!!!! I must have lost my mind for a second to spend $55.00 on a pair of by pass 0.1 Audyn true copper caps. LOL

  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Originally posted by allenb View Post

    I haven't found how to get email notifications when a post comes in so just now seeing your post.
    So you can hear the difference when using a film bypass cap. I've read lots where some claim no difference and others swear by it in crossovers. Were you able to do a AB comparison with quick switching back and forth and very noticeable or just very slight improvement that can be perceived only by golden ears?
    From my own hands on experience I have found that capacitors actually color the sound in which in turn makes it sound different. Now in terms of is it "BETTER" is all personal preference and or based on ones design and application. IMO putting anything in the signal path to the driver will change the sound and the more components used the more the sound can change. I tried using a 0.01mh jantzen inductor on my small mid/high range panels just to see if the sound would change and it did. Then I added a 0.1uf jantzen cross cap to the 0.01mh jantzen inductor and the sound changed again.

    One does not need so called Golden ears to hear the changes you just have to listen critically and you will hear the difference just as long as nothing is wrong with your hearing to begin with. The differences between different caps can be subtle to night and day it all depends on each particular cap being compared. If one is not familiar with the sound signature of said capacitor then you will not be able to pick which cap is playing BUT you will KNOW if the sound has CHANGED.

    From my experiments combining by pass caps with NPE caps seem to blend well together and its cheaper then the larger value higher end caps. Some say the better the cap the more neutral it sounds which I do believe as it is less colored but no doubt colored to a lesser degree. NPE caps IMO sound neutral/balanced they just lack sophistication, clarity and detail like the higher end caps. This is where the "BY PASS" caps come into play as they will add that sophistication, clarity and detail to the NPE caps while remaining neutral/balanced sounding. Also not all by pass caps combine well with each other as you have to find the right blend or right combination as some caps when combined can smear the sound due to having different colorations.

    The caps I prefer and or the ones I have experience with are Jantzen and Audyn. The entry level Jantzen crosscap or Audyn q4 is a start. (0.1-0.01) as they are cheap just under 2 bucks. Higher end caps I prefer are Jantzen Z superior and Audyn plus.

    No offense but I dont like the sound of Dayton caps for my DML panels. lol



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  • allenb
    replied
    Here's my settings for notifications

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  • allenb
    replied
    Originally posted by Unbiasedsound View Post
    Also if you want to upgrade the electrolytic capacitor I have found that "BY PASS" caps work very well with electrolytic caps. I use either 0.01 or 0.1. Entry level Jantzen cross cap and or Audyn cap q4 will increase clarity and detail.
    I haven't found how to get email notifications when a post comes in so just now seeing your post.
    So you can hear the difference when using a film bypass cap. I've read lots where some claim no difference and others swear by it in crossovers. Were you able to do a AB comparison with quick switching back and forth and very noticeable or just very slight improvement that can be perceived only by golden ears?

    Leave a comment:


  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Also if you want to upgrade the electrolytic capacitor I have found that "BY PASS" caps work very well with electrolytic caps. I use either 0.01 or 0.1. Entry level Jantzen cross cap and or Audyn cap q4 will increase clarity and detail.

    Leave a comment:


  • allenb
    replied
    Didn't look long enough. Found them on their site. Cost looks very reasonable for 18 gauge laminated core in the size I need.

    Edit, didn't see your post when I wrote this. Thank you for posting the link.
    Last edited by allenb; 12-29-2021, 06:19 PM.

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  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Dayton Audio 4.5mH 18 AWG I Core Inductor Crossover Coil (parts-express.com) Around $7.00 each. and the caps is around $1.00 at 35uf.

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  • allenb
    replied
    That makes sense. Do you know if P.E. can sell the laminated core inductors used in their crossovers? I would like to experiment with a second order 400 hz low pass but is not one offered in an assembled crossover. Everywhere I've looked for inductors whether air core or iron/ferrite, the prices are way higher than what P.E. sells their 2nd order crossovers.

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  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    Although the panel can play 100hz it will be at a lower db as it starts to drop sharply at around 100hz. This is the reason I use the P.E. 800hz low pass as the woofer will cover lower mids while the DML handles the high mids to high frequencies. Plus the higher the DML panel is crossed the less strain on the exciter.

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  • allenb
    replied
    I didn't realize PE had assembled crossovers. Looks like a nice selection. I think the 100 hz low pass might be the one for me to try for the cone woofer I'll be using. I'm hoping the 6 x 14 panel will drop down low enough to blend successfully with the woofer crossing at 100. I want to have the panel play the dominant role in the very low mids up through what ever it will go up to.

    https://www.parts-express.com/100-Hz...ssover-266-446

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  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    I use these at around 10 bucks each so $20.00 for a pair. 800 Hz Low Pass 8 Ohm Crossover (parts-express.com) The P.E. crossovers utilize butterworth type while Dayton uses Linkwitz. But for my application the Butterworth sounds better.

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  • allenb
    replied
    Originally posted by Unbiasedsound View Post
    No I have not but I do use a 125uf electrolytic cap 1st order which is around 160hz.
    That should work for me as well. I'm assuming going 1st order at such a low frequency shouldn't compromise power handling like it would a conventional cone driver. Do you have any affordable woofer crossover options with air core inductors being prohibitively expensive? Copper is outrageously expensive. Looks like the Jantzen for a cap that big is around $60 each.

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  • Unbiasedsound
    replied
    No I have not but I do use a 125uf electrolytic cap 1st order which is around 160hz.

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  • allenb
    replied
    I'm still collecting parts after a delay in getting started. Styrofoam ordered for doing 9 1/2 x 14 panels and TEAX19C01-8 exciters. Question on impedance curve for passive crossover calculations. Have you determined the impedance of a 9 1/2 x 14 x 1/2" panel coupled with the TEAX19C01-8 at frequencies below 500 hz. I noticed the unmounted driver's resonance and impedance spike occurs around 350 hz but obviously would drop to a lower frequency once attached to a panel. Was curious to know for crossover calculations for a cross at somewhere between 150 and 200 hz.

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